Confirmed with Link: [CHI/DAL] Sharp & Johns traded to Stars for Daley & Garbutt Part 2

[DPHawk]

Most of his points were the first half of the season. He was terrible in the 2nd half. This is a huge red flag for an aging winger. He was good in the playoffs. Teams don't just look at the previous season but they put the most weight in the last season. This is a what have you done for me lately league. His value was not that high and I don't understand why people can't understand that.

Sharp 5v5
Pre All Star: 3+9=12 33GP
Post All Star: 5+12=17 35 GP

Sharp PP
Pre All Star: 6+6
Post All star: 2+0

At even strength he was actually producing much more in the 2nd half and it was the collapse of the Power Play (no doubt the Kane injury had a hand in that) that dragged down his numbers.

 

[BK]

Sharp 5v5
Pre All Star: 3+9=12 33GP
Post All Star: 5+12=17 35 GP

Sharp PP
Pre All Star: 6+6
Post All star: 2+0

At even strength he was actually producing much more in the 2nd half and it was the collapse of the Power Play (no doubt the Kane injury had a hand in that) that dragged down his numbers.

I stand corrected. I specifically remember him being the worst player on the team in February.

 

[DPHawk]

I stand corrected. I specifically remember him being the worst player on the team in February.

Well February was a disaster for him (0+2 in 13GP) but that is probably true for quite a few Hawks.

 

[Bubba88]

It was Sharp & Johns for Garbutt, Scuderi and 2.8 Million Cap Space

 

[Hawkaholic]

Stan made a bad deal, Sharp's past track record and current performance is all the "proof" that I need.

Yes, he made a bad deal. But that doesn't mean there was a much better deal tabled at any point.

Teams were waiting for Free Agents that they could get for cheaper that would have as big, or more of an impact, Hawks could have been waiting to see how the Saad situation played out before trading Sharp. There are many factors at play. It's not as simple as saying..he had a better offer and he screwed up, no one knows that at all.

 

[hockeydoug]

Yes, he made a bad deal. But that doesn't mean there was a much better deal tabled at any point.

Teams were waiting for Free Agents that they could get for cheaper that would have as big, or more of an impact, Hawks could have been waiting to see how the Saad situation played out before trading Sharp. There are many factors at play. It's not as simple as saying..he had a better offer and he screwed up, no one knows that at all.

The bolded part many times over.

The more likely option, if one is to de-homer and look around 29 franchises, is that there weren't many if any other good options available.

Teams weren't looking to gamble on expensive multiyear cap hits for players well over 30. Taking on a 3rd line LW on the decline, with 2 years at 5.9 was going to be a big gamble.

It's still a big gamble even though everything looks shiny and awsum in Dallas.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

It was Sharp & Johns for Garbutt, Scuderi and 2.8 Million Cap Space

Which doesn't help trade at all

No matter how people try to spin it this and handling of Sharp has been disaster since moment of NHL draft

The giveaway of Johns just adds to the awfulness of deal

 

[BK]

It does actually help the trade. What screwed Stan was the cap not going up more. Sharp is on a heavy deal and teams with the space did not want him.

Not saying we won the trade because we didn't but it did help this team.

 

[Blue Liner]

The bolded part many times over.

The more likely option, if one is to de-homer and look around 29 franchises, is that there weren't many if any other good options available.

Teams weren't looking to gamble on expensive multiyear cap hits for players well over 30. Taking on a 3rd line LW on the decline, with 2 years at 5.9 was going to be a big gamble.

It's still a big gamble even though everything looks shiny and awsum in Dallas.

People want to deny the giant elephant in the room and I will dance around this as lightly as I can, per board rules, but if people think for a second Sharp's...reputation...for lack of a better term, had not traveled around the offices of other NHL GM's and didn't have at least some hand in difficulties moving him... coupled with his contract-to-age ratio, they are completely fooling themselves or lying to themselves; one or the other. There are guys who have done worse things find a new NHL home, but those things never involved disruption of a dressing room in any way, shape or form. To franchises, right or wrong, that kind of thing is much more egregious than even some of the worst off-ice offenses. It's not a be-all, end-all...Sharp found a home. As have others *cough* Shanahan *cough...but especially combined with cap/contract/age factors....it's a thing.

I'm not saying anything one way or the other....I'm just sayin'.

 

[Hawkaholic]

Sharp is on a heavy deal and teams with the space did not want him.
.

And a lot of people are forgetting that Sharp had a NTC, probably severely limiting CHI's options

 

[Blue Liner]

And a lot of people are forgetting that Sharp had a NTC, probably severely limiting CHI's options

That also probably didn't help.

 

[BobbyJet]

People want to deny the giant elephant in the room and I will dance around this as lightly as I can, per board rules, but if people think for a second Sharp's...reputation...for lack of a better term, had not traveled around the offices of other NHL GM's and didn't have at least some hand in difficulties moving him... coupled with his contract-to-age ratio, they are completely fooling themselves or lying to themselves; one or the other. There are guys who have done worse things find a new NHL home, but those things never involved disruption of a dressing room in any way, shape or form. To franchises, right or wrong, that kind of thing is much more egregious than even some of the worst off-ice offenses. It's not a be-all, end-all...Sharp found a home. As have others *cough* Shanahan *cough...but especially combined with cap/contract/age factors....it's a thing.

I'm not saying anything one way or the other....I'm just sayin'.

Actually, you didn't say anything at all.

 

[hockeydoug]

People want to deny the giant elephant in the room and I will dance around this as lightly as I can, per board rules, but if people think for a second Sharp's...reputation...for lack of a better term, had not traveled around the offices of other NHL GM's and didn't have at least some hand in difficulties moving him... coupled with his contract-to-age ratio, they are completely fooling themselves or lying to themselves; one or the other. There are guys who have done worse things find a new NHL home, but those things never involved disruption of a dressing room in any way, shape or form. To franchises, right or wrong, that kind of thing is much more egregious than even some of the worst off-ice offenses. It's not a be-all, end-all...Sharp found a home. As have others *cough* Shanahan *cough...but especially combined with cap/contract/age factors....it's a thing.

I'm not saying anything one way or the other....I'm just sayin'.

Very good point.

I never believed the franchise would have tolerated him last year if the rumors were true, but I sure as hell believe that this stuff was a giant red flag for a number of franchises. Anytime a giant off ice distraction correlates with a negative (or positive) on ice produciton, at least somebody in every franchise is going to notice and ask the question.

 

[Blue Liner]

Players talk/confide in other players/friends, their own agents, agents talk to each other, they talk to GM's; it's a small, small world.

 

[ZeHockeyFan]

So think Stan has realized he ###### up bigtime at draft when he didn't deal Sharp and tried to hold out for better value?

I believe I was discussing this very same issue with one SLarmer28 when the trade happened and he/she invoked this (rumored) two 2nd round picks and a prospect offer at the draft that Bowman turned down. You can read the conversation here. In the conversation, I linked Hockeybuzz (article dated 27th June, 2015) that mentioned that the said offer was from Dallas. It made no sense for obvious reasons because we had only one 2nd rounder (from Detroit in the Erik Cole trade) and we had traded away our 2nd rounder in the Spezza deal, but when I read this other (earlier) report from June 25, 2015 that clears the status a little by indicating that while the offer was indeed from Dallas, it was a 2nd rounder in 2015 and 2016 and a defensive prospect. However, from the looks of it, these "reports" (maybe it was one solitary rumor that Eklund at Hockeybuzz jumped on) seem to have no strong credibility because I cannot find any other corroborating reports elsewhere.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Bobby Mac and others reported teams had interest in Sharp

Do you really believe the Hawks best offer was a trash defender and 4th line scrub at draft when several teams in need of winger had cap space to fill role?

We know teams had interest but Stan tried to play hardball

 

[hisgirlfriday]

Having interest does not necessarily mean having presented a concrete offer. sharp's cap hit and the hawks' inability to eat any of his salary at the same time every team's budget was constrained by the lower than expected cap certainly limited the possible dance partners the hawks had to work with at any point of the trade process.

one thing I do think was mismanagement of sharp's trade value though was letting q put him on the 3rd line so much of last season. the hawks should have been rolling him out with kane or toews as much as possible if only to inflate his trade value through better stats. it was bizarre to me how sharp-toews-hossa was so dominant for most of 2013-14 yet from the time sharp returned from injury q didnt put them back together until the last couple games of the 2015 playoffs.

 

[ZeHockeyFan]

Bobby Mac and others reported teams had interest in Sharp

Possible, but that doesn't indicate what the offers were.

Do you really believe the Hawks best offer was a trash defender and 4th line scrub at draft when several teams in need of winger had cap space to fill role?

Argument from ignorance. One doesn't know with certainty (even today) what the offers were, so one cannot just assume that there were better offers. Maybe the better offers were from teams for whom Sharp had no interest waiving his NTC (or is it NMC)?? If you check, you'll find that there really weren't many teams that were playoff-bound and had the kind of cap-space to accommodate Sharp.

We know teams had interest but Stan tried to play hardball

Maybe it was other GMs that were playing hardball with Stan knowing full well that he had a major mess on his hands? Why not? One can never know for sure until there is confirmation.

 

[Hawkaholic]

Bobby Mac and others reported teams had interest in Sharp

Do you really believe the Hawks best offer was a trash defender and 4th line scrub at draft when several teams in need of winger had cap space to fill role?

We know teams had interest but Stan tried to play hardball

You (and others) don't know anything, actually.

 

[hockeydoug]

one thing I do think was mismanagement of sharp's trade value though was letting q put him on the 3rd line so much of last season.

Letting a coach do the coaching isn't mismanagement.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Having interest does not necessarily mean having presented a concrete offer. sharp's cap hit and the hawks' inability to eat any of his salary at the same time every team's budget was constrained by the lower than expected cap certainly limited the possible dance partners the hawks had to work with at any point of the trade process.

one thing I do think was mismanagement of sharp's trade value though was letting q put him on the 3rd line so much of last season. the hawks should have been rolling him out with kane or toews as much as possible if only to inflate his trade value through better stats. it was bizarre to me how sharp-toews-hossa was so dominant for most of 2013-14 yet from the time sharp returned from injury q didnt put them back together until the last couple games of the 2015 playoffs.

Your GM shouldn't be telling your coach who to play where.

 

[Bubba88]

if he wants to force to Play Sharp higher on the depth Chart, he should have traded Kane and Saad to force him.... This wasn't an Option.

Q won the Cup as Coach, he was right with his choices

 

[hisgirlfriday]

The Hawks won the Cup with Q as coach but that doesnt equal Q having made in hindsight the optimal coaching decision in every circumstance. If we can critique Stan for past bad contracts/trades that precipitated cup wins why can't we also talk about what Q did?

 

[ClydeLee]

While it's just a case of situation and timing, maybe Sharp should of got more regular time with Kane but it also worked out well that he finally gelled late in the year on the 3rd line with the young kid and new addition to the team via trade.

As good as sharp was with Toews & Hossa the year before, Saad had become, so it wasn't really fair to say he should of filled in there when that was already a situation working all so well. Having 3 strong offensive scoring lines was a better option than a makeshift 3rd line and better trade value of Sharp.

 

[BigClemMacdonald]

What a stupid deal this turned out to be.

Don't even have Daley anymore and Garbutt won't get more than 5 points. We gave Sharp away for nothing.