Brian Dumoulin

[Speaking Moistly]

he's had those stats his entire career, and he's still been a scratch each year under different coaches. I like the guy. He's solid. But he's a bottom pairing guy maybe an okay #4. He's not as good as Maatta or Dumo. If the stats you are using tell you that he is, then you need to use more than those stats to form your opinions.

Tbf, he wasn’t a HS last year except for the final game of the season when they were resting guys. He’s still well below what those two are capable of, and I’ve liked Cole in his time here.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Tbf, he wasn’t a HS last year except for the final game of the season when they were resting guys. He’s still well below what those two are capable of, and I’ve liked Cole in his time here.

fair enough. Most years.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

fair enough. Most years.

Every year except the best year of his career where he was paired with Schultz who was rebounding hard, and, iirc, they were still sheltered. This year he’s not repeating that level of performance. The half Johnston season is murky because Johnston kind of, you know, may have accidentally almost destroyed Cole's career and I don’t think Sullivan HS him after he returned to the lineup. He’s currently not living up to that half a season either. A lot of them aren’t but Cole is just more of a great 5D than anything and I think the Pens know it.

this thread has taken a weird turn... I thought Dumoulin had a good game against Columbus and a great shift against Colorado that involved solid defensively play and carrying the puck very well. It fizzled out once he hit the offensive zone. Surprisingly he hasn’t repeated the consistency of his rookie season and that included Johnston sucking the life out of the team.

 

[Gurglesons]

Every year except the best year of his career where he was paired with Schultz who was rebounding hard, and, iirc, they were still sheltered. This year he’s not repeating that level of performance. The half Johnston season is murky because Johnston kind of, you know, may have accidentally almost destroyed Cole's career and I don’t think Sullivan HS him after he returned to the lineup. He’s currently not living up to that half a season either. A lot of them aren’t but Cole is just more of a great 5D than anything and I think the Pens know it.

this thread has taken a weird turn... I thought Dumoulin had a good game against Columbus and a great shift against Colorado that involved solid defensively play and carrying the puck very well. It fizzled out once he hit the offensive zone. Surprisingly he hasn’t repeated the consistency of his rookie season and that included Johnston sucking the life out of the team.

Ian Cole is the same player he was when he was traded here. Has the tools and physicality to be a top four guy, but poor decisions and ultimately his penchant for lazy play and penalties makes him a solid bottom pairing guy. I’m glad the front office recognizes a lot of last year was Schultz not Cole. I think we can get away with a Dumo - Letang / Maatta - Schultz top four.

 

[CommissionerGordon]

Still a big fan of him, the thing is I just do not get it anymore... Guy went from being the rock to playing awful hockey. Among our worst performers nigh in and nigh out, this year. All of that when I thought that he is fully ready to become an effective part of our core. Right now tho, he is doing everything wrong.. not only is he irrelevant offensively, he creates defensive lapses as well. I think his level of play this season is absolutely unacceptable and it is an underrated part of why we are where we are now...

He better gets his **** together soon, because you can´t have a player playing like this on your first pair, unless you are a lottery chaser. Not sure what to think anymore. I just don´t understand how can a guy with such a solid, reliable game in his prime go from a hero to the zero just like this. Probably, separating him from Letang could be an idea...

This is not an attack on you. But thanks for catching up.

He is a classic blah defender. What would you say he does best? I would say his best asset is above average skating. Problem is he has zero offensive awareness. He is not physical despite being 6'4".

The best part is the $4.1m cap figure.

One game and I think Oleksiak is better offensively and defensively. It's not that Oleksiak is that GOOD, although I think we're looking at a Schultz fleecing again, it's that Dumoulin is that BAD

He is and will always be a 6.5/10

 

[CommissionerGordon]

Dumo has never been good for a significant period of time, and I've been trying to tell anyone here with a open brain that for the last 2 years. He's basically Mark Eaton, but makes 4mil/year. He just exists. No offense, average defense, ices it a ton. PIT management couldn't wait to lock him up with term.

You are brilliant. Can I just applaud you for your efforts? Thank you.

Brian Dumoulin....... what would you SAY you do HERE

 

[CommissionerGordon]

I loved Dumoulin when he was making under a million.

Now that hes making 4 million i can't stand him.

He would be one of the guys I'd be looking to move.

I could look past his shortcomings at $800k at age 25. Now he makes me sick

Paying Dumoulin was the mistake of the offseason that dominoed into skimping at other positions resulting in a mediocre team.

 

[Ogrezilla]

man how did this thread actually manage to get worse?

 

[Speaking Moistly]

This is not an attack on you. But thanks for catching up.

He is a classic blah defender. What would you say he does best? I would say his best asset is above average skating. Problem is he has zero offensive awareness. He is not physical despite being 6'4".

The best part is the $4.1m cap figure.

One game and I think Oleksiak is better offensively and defensively. It's not that Oleksiak is that GOOD, although I think we're looking at a Schultz fleecing again, it's that Dumoulin is that BAD

He is and will always be a 6.5/10

Yeahhhhh. Some people need to chill the f*** out about things like Oleksiak. It’s one game.

 

[Deczola73]

Brian D has been a rock solid D man for us since he has been on our team. I can't believe I'm reading some comments about his offensive game regressing, when he brings almost zero on the offensive end. In about 200 career games he has 3 goals. On the D end he has been rock solid and has elevated his D in the playoffs. He has played poorly many games this year and on quite a few occasions he was our worse player of 6 on the D end. So what. He will get his game together when the Penguins start scoring more and he plays more relaxed and concentrates on his own end. Thing I noticed is that he is trying to hard with quick outlet passes or high risk passes trying to start a quick breakout to help our disappointing O game this year so far this season.

Once the team elevates their play and I've no doubt they will, he will be the same old Brian D we.......errrrrrrr........love?

 

[Deczola73]

I could look past his shortcomings at $800k at age 25. Now he makes me sick

Paying Dumoulin was the mistake of the offseason that dominoed into skimping at other positions resulting in a mediocre team.

We will see what happens long term. We signed him with the expectations of him playing the way he did first two full seasons and if he played that way, that is not a bad contract. I guess it's possible that he signed the money and is now set thus extra effort may not be there though I hope that is not the case.

However one blunder was signing Hunwick instead of Hainsey. There is no debate about who is better and it's not even close. Difference between the 2 was $750,000 a year and Hainsey had only signed for 2 years. If we signed Hainsey instead of Hunwick, we might have grabbed him around 2.8 million for two years which we should have done.

 

[larueskee]

Does anyone see a interesting trend here?

Left defense stats
Points
Cole 26, Dumo 15, Maata 7
Plus/Minus NHL Rank
Cole + 26/ 11th, Maata +17/42nd Dumo +7/152nd
Blocked shots
Cole Rank 3rd # 194, Maata Rank 91st # 102, Dumo Rank 97th # 99
Hits defensemen/Rank
Cole 18th # 164, Dumo 53rd #113, Maata 113th # 72
Minor penalties
Cole 29, Dumo 7 , Maata 6,
Games played
Cole 71, Dumo 70, Maata 55

 

[Beauner]

Does anyone see a interesting trend here?

Left defense stats
Points
Cole 26, Dumo 15, Maata 7
Plus/Minus NHL Rank
Cole + 26/ 11th, Maata +17/42nd Dumo +7/152nd
Blocked shots
Cole Rank 3rd # 194, Maata Rank 91st # 102, Dumo Rank 97th # 99
Hits defensemen/Rank
Cole 18th # 164, Dumo 53rd #113, Maata 113th # 72
Minor penalties
Cole 29, Dumo 7 , Maata 6,
Games played
Cole 71, Dumo 70, Maata 55

First of all, the only trend I see is you digging yourself into a deeper hole. Second, I find it quite impressive that you literally use the worst stats possible to compare 3 defensemen. Bravo.

 

[larueskee]

First of all, the only trend I see is you digging yourself into a deeper hole. Second, I find it quite impressive that you literally use the worst stats possible to compare 3 defensemen. Bravo.

Lol at you!, points are the least impressive? Plus minus?, blocked shots? No my friend you dug yourself a deeper hole with that ridiculous comment. He bested the entire left side in every major category. What category do you see as remotely more important than the categories listed? Hair style? Now I realize that some you ill informed might think the PIMs are too high but playing with the 6 and 7 th guys might create some of those taking minor penalties. The only really bad thing about him taking those pims might be that the rest of the d has to kill a penalty, but 58 minutes in minors isn't bad at all when you consider that he is a defender first.

 

[Gurglesons]

Lol at you!, points are the least impressive? Plus minus?, blocked shots? No my friend you dug yourself a deeper hole with that ridiculous comment. He bested the entire left side in every major category. What category do you see as remotely more important than the categories listed? Hair style? Now I realize that some you ill informed might think the PIMs are too high but playing with the 6 and 7 th guys might create some of those taking minor penalties. The only really bad thing about him taking those pims might be that the rest of the d has to kill a penalty, but 58 minutes in minors isn't bad at all when you consider that he is a defender first.

Ian Cole has six points and is a -5 average 16 minutes this year. While taking 30 PIMs.

It is almost like Justin Schultz greatly over inflated his numbers last year.

If you want to question Dumoulin’s contract that is fine, but I don’t see how you use Cole as the reason Dumoulin’s contract is bad. If you pay Cole because of last year, you are essentially moving out Dumo for an older, slightly better offensive Dumo that gets featured on the Coors Light Crush Cam more.

 

[Beauner]

Lol at you!, points are the least impressive? Plus minus?, blocked shots? No my friend you dug yourself a deeper hole with that ridiculous comment. He bested the entire left side in every major category. What category do you see as remotely more important than the categories listed? Hair style? Now I realize that some you ill informed might think the PIMs are too high but playing with the 6 and 7 th guys might create some of those taking minor penalties. The only really bad thing about him taking those pims might be that the rest of the d has to kill a penalty, but 58 minutes in minors isn't bad at all when you consider that he is a defender first.

I`m not sure why you think the stats are use are relevant. Physicality is Cole's game, I would hope he has more hits. Also blocked shots...could they maybe be explained by the amount of time one spends in their own zone? There are numerous holes that can be poked in your stats without context. For instance, Maatta and Dumoulin have a better CF% and CF%REL than Cole, while getting more ice time per game. I can't find QualComp stats but considering what pairings each have been on, it's safe to assume Dumo/Maatta have much higher Qualcomp. Dumoulin/Maatta also have more takeaways and less giveaways than Cole.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I`m not sure why you think the stats are use are relevant. Physicality is Cole's game, I would hope he has more hits. Also blocked shots...could they maybe be explained by the amount of time one spends in their own zone? There are numerous holes that can be poked in your stats without context. For instance, Maatta and Dumoulin have a better CF% and CF%REL than Cole, while getting more ice time per game. I can't find QualComp stats but considering what pairings each have been on, it's safe to assume Dumo/Maatta have much higher Qualcomp. Dumoulin/Maatta also have more takeaways and less giveaways than Cole.

Exactly and they could always watch a game too.

Maybe not tonight since Cole’s probably scratched. So I guess stay tuned for the next thread ‘Let’s fire Sully’

 

[larueskee]

If you don't understand why these stats are relevant what stats do you use to assess players? This lack of understanding exhibits a few things to me. You have never played the game, you have never played sports ( hockey stats are like a batting average ), you just watch the game and decide if a player looks good in his uniform with no concern or idea about how those stats are put together. Its ok to be a fan of certain players but I will tell you that Letang took another minus 2 and Dumo was another minus 1 last night.

 

[Beauner]

If you don't understand why these stats are relevant what stats do you use to assess players? This lack of understanding exhibits a few things to me. You have never played the game, you have never played sports ( hockey stats are like a batting average ), you just watch the game and decide if a player looks good in his uniform with no concern or idea about how those stats are put together. Its ok to be a fan of certain players but I will tell you that Letang took another minus 2 and Dumo was another minus 1 last night.

I've played hockey since I was 6 and have watched since I was 3. I've played with and against guys who have played NCAA and juniors, though I was never at that level. I know what I'm talking about and I know how to properly use statistics in context. The fact that not a single person in this whole thread has agreed with you should tell you something

 

[Pancakes]

I like Dumo and Maatta but I wouldn't hesitate to move either of them for a good forward, and the reason for that is neither Dumo or Maatta provide much in the way of offense.

I wouldn't move them for peanuts or rentals mind you. Would have to be a decent top 9 forward with term or youth.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Y

If you don't understand why these stats are relevant what stats do you use to assess players? This lack of understanding exhibits a few things to me. You have never played the game, you have never played sports ( hockey stats are like a batting average ), you just watch the game and decide if a player looks good in his uniform with no concern or idea about how those stats are put together. Its ok to be a fan of certain players but I will tell you that Letang took another minus 2 and Dumo was another minus 1 last night.

You are praising Cole way too much for being splashed by Justin Schultz's points last season.

 

[larueskee]

I've played hockey since I was 6 and have watched since I was 3. I've played with and against guys who have played NCAA and juniors, though I was never at that level. I know what I'm talking about and I know how to properly use statistics in context. The fact that not a single person in this whole thread has agreed with you should tell you something

Congrats to you on playing some hockey. I don't put much stock in having people agree with me on this board. I might think I was wrong if the Pens were in a playoff spot but at the moment but they are not.

 

[Gurglesons]

Congrats to you on playing some hockey. I don't put much stock in having people agree with me on this board. I might think I was wrong if the Pens were in a playoff spot but at the moment but they are not.

Good retort.

Ian Cole playing top four minutes and Dumo being a scratch would totally put us in the playoff picture.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Congrats to you on playing some hockey. I don't put much stock in having people agree with me on this board. I might think I was wrong if the Pens were in a playoff spot but at the moment but they are not.

So an extra 2 wins would show you that you’re wrong?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Congrats to you on playing some hockey. I don't put much stock in having people agree with me on this board. I might think I was wrong if the Pens were in a playoff spot but at the moment but they are not.

I have no idea what this is even supposed to mean.