Critical13
Fear is the mind-killer.
Barzal's stats impress me more...but should we be taking into account age? If so, then Matthews.
Barzal rookie season vs. Matthews rookie season
- Thread starter Oan
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He's 18th in points Matthews was 20th and 2nd in goals. If anything Barzal was not as good as Matthews offensively.
How though? He has 18 goals and is a whole 2 places higher in the points race than Matthews was.
Wait a minute, Barzal is winning this? GTFO...
Critical13
Fear is the mind-killer.
I don't really value goals all that much higher than assists, so that doesn't sway me. He's been pretty dominant. His defensive game is worse, but his vision and skating are as good if not better. Puck handling they seem pretty even.
Cleatus
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Yeah but you all conveniently ignore how this is Barzal’s D+3 season (compared to Matthews’ being D+1), and you also ignore how high scoring is for players this season compared to last, along with the crazy amount of extra power play time Barzal gets over Matthews.
Believe it or not, all this helps Barzal out a ton in the production department. Matthews didn’t have close to these kind of luxuries in his rookie year.
It's abut the same, Barzal's point production is obviously better, but you don't discount 40 ginos as a rookie and similar point production because Matthews is out and Barzal is HF's newest sweetheart.
LeafsNation75
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You yourself on other threads have claimed Laine to be the best player of the 2016 draft despite him being 7 months younger than Matthews and unlike Barzal at least they were selected in the same draft. So why does the age difference between Matthews and Barzal not matter, however it does between Matthews and Laine?
Nadal On Clay
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Matthews could have scored 50 goals with 0 assists and Leafs fans would still pick Matthews.
LeafsNation75
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If Tavares decides to leave the Islanders as a UFA let's see next season if Barzal can have the same success in his 2nd season compared to what he's doing now.
The Winter Soldier
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Frolov 6'3
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Cleatus
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Get the feeling that he’s going to have his share of struggles next season if Tavares leaves. Plus there’s almost no way he’ll have multiple 5 point games as well.
Kelly
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Matthews was 19 in his rookie season.
Barzal is in his D+3 year, Matthews was in his D+1 in his rookie year.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Not when they played their rookie seasons....
The Winter Soldier
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Well that is not what @Menzinger wrote. But if you want to use their 20 year old seasons. Barzal is still out pointing, out corsi-ing, and out projecting Matthews PPG and in actual production. So that answers both questions there right?
Kelly
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Do you understand the question asked in the Op.?
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
This thread is discussing rookie seasons - and age is a huge element here. A D+1 player vs a D+3 player is an important variable in any comparison.
LeafsNation75
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It's great when we can post the correct facts about Matthews when it comes to his age in examples like that.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Cleatus
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Barzal had two extra development years though, which is pretty significant no matter how you cut it.
Basically, I strongly feel a player coming into the league immediately after the draft (D+1), scoring 40 goals, and winning the Calder is much more impressive than a player who got more development time beforehand (D+3) winning the Calder.
In that regard (and considering some other factors), I even think Laine’s rookie season is more impressive than what Barzal is doing now, and he lost the Calder to Matthews last year.
The Winter Soldier
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This thread asked who had a better rookie season. Not the criteria you and @Kelly tried to insert here. Barzal may still hit 80 points this season. Something around the 30 point mark you questioned, something about an unsustainable 12% shooting %. You would be better off just admitting you were wrong about him falling off a cliff as the sample of games grew narrative you like to bring up often here, and just give him credit as others have.
Barzal has 70 points in 70 games in today's game for a rookie, this is hard to do. Is this a big enough sample for you now? Really has fallen off there right bud? So take your pick, he is producing more impressively than Matthews as a rookie, and as a 20 year old. Whether you want to use PPG or actual production of 70 to 50 this season.
Sidney the Kidney
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I'm just basing my opinion on the "eye test" as I haven't bothered to look up the numbers to see whether it's the case, but I'd judge their rookie seasons as Barzal looking more dynamic and a guy who creates a lot, while Matthews looked more deadly as a goal scorer and in all-around presence.
If I had to pick one, I'd lean towards Matthews because I think his two-way game and work around the net translates better to playoff hockey. But both have had fantastic rookie seasons.
If I had to pick one, I'd lean towards Matthews because I think his two-way game and work around the net translates better to playoff hockey. But both have had fantastic rookie seasons.
More impressive AM when you factor in age+D+1 year although Barzal has bettered him points wise and P/GP wise. AM obviously way better goal scorer, and Barzal is the better point producer both EV and PP wise. They have both had some poor line mates, Barzal plays with the corpse of Andrew Ladd and AM played with Hyman. Close to call, but Matthews' ascension from 3C to overtaking the 1C and being a very strong contributor to a playoff team, and playing well in the playoffs gets my vote. but it is close
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