ATD2018 - Draft Thread 2

[kruezer]

yeah I would have absolutely taken Doughty with my pick as well, I assumed his resume looked good, but it still kinda surprised me how good it looked upon review

 

[DitchMarner]

If Bentley isn't in a higher tier than Gilmour, you can't really put him in a higher tier than Thornton.

Gilmour was obviously far superior to Thornton in the playoffs, but I think Thornton's regular season superiority (predicted primarily if not entirely on a longer/better prime) is large enough that you really can't put him in a lower tier than Gilmour at this point.


Regarding 1993: I feel like if you remove Lemieux from the equation entirely and everything else stays the same (which isn't actually possible, but let's imagine such a scenario to keep things simpler), Gilmour does win the Hart that season.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Well, these last few D picks have made this selection easy for us, as there's only one guy left on our list. The Kenora Thistles select Emile "Butch" Bouchard, D

Bouchard is about a perfect fit for the type of guy you want playing next to Red Kelly, RHS, physical, defensive defenseman, who is still a good puck mover. Bouchard will allow Kelly to do his thing offensively, while holding down the fort on the back end.

 

[Claude The Fraud]

The Winnipeg Jets are proud to select, from Mimico, Ontario, Brendan Shanahan.

The Jets staff are very confident Shanahan is the right kind of player to complete Forsberg and Bossy.

 

[tony d]

Doughty's a very good talent, much like Karlsson this seems to be the area for him to be picked. Very solid player. Is the plan for him to play on a pairing with Fetisov to form a good defensive one or will you separate the two?

 

[ImporterExporter]

Raptor's doing school related stuff. He should be here around 1 PM EST to pick.

 

[Habsfan18]

Second post on this page has undrafted players named..

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Doughty's a very good talent, much like Karlsson this seems to be the area for him to be picked. Very solid player. Is the plan for him to play on a pairing with Fetisov to form a good defensive one or will you separate the two?

Doughty will probably play with Fetisov at even strength. I think Doughty is a pretty good #2 in this at even strength, while having less value on both special teams (kind of the opposite of Rob Blake, who has more value on special teams than at even strength). I actually started a team with Fetisov before, and that team's biggest weakness was lack of a good partner for Fetisov.

 

[ResilientBeast]

Second post on this page has undrafted players named..

I misread that as post on second page and spent 5 minutes looking for it, serves me right to mod without coffee

 

[Dreakmur]

Well, these last few D picks have made this selection easy for us, as there's only one guy left on our list. The Kenora Thistles select Emile "Butch" Bouchard, D

Bouchard is about a perfect fit for the type of guy you want playing next to Red Kelly, RHS, physical, defensive defenseman, who is still a good puck mover. Bouchard will allow Kelly to do his thing offensively, while holding down the fort on the back end.

Didn't Bouchard play left defense? I know he was a right hand shot, but he definitely had to start on the left side to break into the lineup.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Didn't Bouchard play left defense? I know he was a right hand shot, but he definitely had to start on the left side to break into the lineup.

I'm not sure about when he broke into the lineup, but in the HOH "which side did they play" thread people said that Bouchard played the right side next to Harvey, and that Harvey didn't switch to the right side until after Bouchard retired.

There was also another thread a while back on the HOH board where an attempt was made to find any RHS Dman in history who played primarily the left side during their career. I'm pretty sure I remember correctly that while examples were found of a RHS playing the left side for a season or two here or there, no one was able to find a RHS Dman that played the left side the majority of the time.

 

[Velociraptor]

Bill Cowley, C

 

[ResilientBeast]

Good pick with Cowley, very strong offensive player

 

[jarek]

If it makes it to me, I won't be able to pick until at least 4:30 PM EST or so.

 

[TorontoTrades]

Shanahan hurts, Francis hurts too.

Was eyeing both of them heavily.

 

[markrander87]

What value is placed (in the years played at Forward) for a player if they are being used as a Defenseman but played a portion of their career at Forward?

 

[ResilientBeast]

What value is placed (in the years played at Forward) for a player if they are being used as a Defenseman but played a portion of their career at Forward?

Depends on how long at either spot I'd assume

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

What value is placed (in the years played at Forward) for a player if they are being used as a Defenseman but played a portion of their career at Forward?

I usually look at their years at forward adding to their career value, but not peak and probably not prime value.

 

[Sprague Cleghorn]

If Bentley isn't in a higher tier than Gilmour, you can't really put him in a higher tier than Thornton.

Gilmour was obviously far superior to Thornton in the playoffs, but I think Thornton's regular season superiority (predicted primarily if not entirely on a longer/better prime) is large enough that you really can't put him in a lower tier than Gilmour at this point.


Regarding 1993: I feel like if you remove Lemieux from the equation entirely and everything else stays the same (which isn't actually possible, but let's imagine such a scenario to keep things simpler), Gilmour does win the Hart that season.

If you don't account for WW2, then Gilmour could be in the same tier as Bentley. Players should definitely be given credit for missed time out of their control, such as WW1 and the 2005 lockout. After giving Bentley a less than generous score of 80 for his VsX for his missed 1944 and 1945 season, I'm inclined to say that Bentley definitely belongs in a higher tier than Gilmour.

Gilmour vs Thornton is an interesting comparison. I know Thornton's VsX is massively superior to Gilmour's. If I have time, I'll do an in depth comparison of the two also.

 

[markrander87]

I usually look at their years at forward adding to their career value, but not peak and probably not prime value.

That's how I see it now, it just doesn't seem fair for a player to get robbed of some prime years if they were used at multiple positions. It almost feels like they get treated similar to lost war years.

 

[Sprague Cleghorn]

Cowley is an excellent pick. Best offensive player on the board by a large margin, and his playoff performance is good. Yeah, he sucks defensively, but does that warrant his massive drops every year? Other one dimensional Cs dont drop that much, so why is Cowley being singled out?

 

[Habsfan18]

Just walked in the door from work. Weighing a few options and jumping in the shower. Pick coming shortly.

 

[BenchBrawl]

That's how I see it now, it just doesn't seem fair for a player to get robbed of some prime years if they were used at multiple positions. It almost feels like they get treated similar to lost war years.

No, because the player had an opportunity to be a star at the other position.

 

[ResilientBeast]

I should move Goodfellow to center and Taylor to D just for fun

 

[ImporterExporter]

Cowley is an excellent pick. Best offensive player on the board by a large margin, and his playoff performance is good. Yeah, he sucks defensively, but does that warrant his massive drops every year? Other one dimensional Cs dont drop that much, so why is Cowley being singled out?

I think people are scared by the fact he was a one way only C. Plus he was soft. Personally I don't care all that much, as you can find the right wingers to support him but I know some devalue him because of the reasons I mentioned. I think he's going about where he should honestly.