Sportsnet: Arizona have received an offer matching their asking price for Jakob Chychrun.

[Overrateprospects]

You two should argue with eachother. We’ve got one guy saying it’s “brutal” for Carolina and two guys saying it’s “brutal” for AZ.

Wouldn’t that be three people?

 

[BB88]

Wow man talk about biased and picky. You put up extremely specific conditions for comparable situations and then when provided with examples you shoot them all down because they are not exactly the same.

Im not say he will get traded but if Eichel got traded then Lundell is by no means 100% untouchable

What?

I asked a simply question.

When is the last time an elite C got traded with multiple elc years left.

You mentioned zero and do you know why?
Because they are the most valuable assets in the league.

Danault, Strome& Schenn weren’t anywhere close to being viable examples and gave you reasons for why

You know Eichel trade is garbage example.
Florida isn’t the biggest joke in the league, Lundell isn’t at war with the management

 

[rt]

Wouldn’t that be three people?

You’re arguing with me again. I’m trying to sick you all on eachother. Haha. I don’t know how so many people can say it was “brutal” for opposite sides. I’m genuinely curious.

I’m an AZ fan. Basically, I know our GM is trying to say he got a great young roster player, a top prospect and a pick.

And I find myself agreeing with the Carolina fan who said that’s all a bit rich when the roster player is Jarvis. He’s a cut-above. So maybe the price should come down.

But I know Armstrong is stubborn and his prices don’t come down. I ask know he’s not afraid to construct a big, hairy, super complicated trade (look at all the pieces in the OEL deal, and the wild ass conditions on the picks for Dvorak and Kuemper). Finally, I know he is more than willing to eat dumps for value.

So what’s 2.3aav retained in Chychrun for three years worth? Probably a late 1st, right? What’s eating Gardiner worth? Given he’s LTIR - not as much, probably. Maybe a 2nd. And how much is Boyd worth? Maybe a 3rd?

So, if the retention on Chychrun pays for the very late 1st that’s 18mo away, what does eating Gardiner and Cole pay for? And what about Boyd? Let’s say they Scott Morrow has doubled his value since the last draft. Say he’s worth two 2nds instead of just one. Surely the two dumps and Boyd pay for half of that.

That means my proposal is more simply, Chychrun for Jarvis and a 2nd. Which I think is fair. And I think most people would think is fair. All of the other stuff is meant to A) get BA his “on-paper” asking price and B) make the cap work, while C) keeping the value as close to Jarvis+2nd as possible.

 

[JA17]

What?

I asked a simply question.

When is the last time an elite C got traded with multiple elc years left.

You mentioned zero and do you know why?
Because they are the most valuable assets in the league.

Danault, Strome& Schenn weren’t anywhere close to being viable examples

You know Eichel trade is garbage example.
Florida isn’t the biggest joke in the league, Lundell isn’t at war with the management

Lol you think Lundell is elite?

 

[BB88]

Lol you think Lundell is elite?

He was one of the best prospects before the season and has only sky rocketet his value.

He absolutely is an elite top tier prospect contributing to real wins at nhl level, nobody should question that

 

[Overrateprospects]

You’re arguing with me again. I’m trying to sick you all on eachother. Haha. I don’t know how so many people can say it was “brutal” for opposite sides. I’m genuinely curious.

???? Have no clue what you are talking about but I disagree with Coyotes giving up a 3rd that drops to a 7th if a team reaches Conference finals

 

[rt]

???? Have no clue what you are talking about but I disagree with Coyotes giving up a 3rd that drops to a 7th if a team reaches Conference finals

Wait a minute! You’re saying it’s “brutal” because of an extraneous 3rd? Lol. Who cares? Haha. Ditch it then.

You missed my ninja edit. See below:

I’m an AZ fan. Basically, I know our GM is trying to say he got a great young roster player, a top prospect and a pick.

And I find myself agreeing with the Carolina fan who said that’s all a bit rich when the roster player is Jarvis. He’s a cut-above. So maybe the price should come down.

But I know Armstrong is stubborn and his prices don’t come down. I ask know he’s not afraid to construct a big, hairy, super complicated trade (look at all the pieces in the OEL deal, and the wild ass conditions on the picks for Dvorak and Kuemper). Finally, I know he is more than willing to eat dumps for value.

So what’s 2.3aav retained in Chychrun for three years worth? Probably a late 1st, right? What’s eating Gardiner worth? Given he’s LTIR - not as much, probably. Maybe a 2nd. And how much is Boyd worth? Maybe a 3rd?

So, if the retention on Chychrun pays for the very late 1st that’s 18mo away, what does eating Gardiner and Cole pay for? And what about Boyd? Let’s say they Scott Morrow has doubled his value since the last draft. Say he’s worth two 2nds instead of just one. Surely the two dumps and Boyd pay for half of that.

That means my proposal is more simply, Chychrun for Jarvis and a 2nd. Which I think is fair. And I think most people would think is fair. All of the other stuff is meant to A) get BA his “on-paper” asking price and B) make the cap work, while C) keeping the value as close to Jarvis+2nd as possible.

 

[JA17]

He was one of the best prospects before the season and has only sky rocketet his value.

He absolutely is an elite top tier prospect contributing to real wins at nhl level, nobody should question that

You just asked when the last time an elite center got traded with multiple ELC years left. The only centers of the last decade who were elite with multiple ELC years left were McDavid and Matthews. Lundell is absolutely not elite

 

[Overrateprospects]

Wait a minute! You’re saying it’s “brutal” because of an extraneous 3rd? Lol. Who cares? Haha. Ditch it then.

You missed my ninja edit. See below:

I’m an AZ fan. Basically, I know our GM is trying to say he got a great young roster player, a top prospect and a pick.

And I find myself agreeing with the Carolina fan who said that’s all a bit rich when the roster player is Jarvis. He’s a cut-above. So maybe the price should come down.

But I know Armstrong is stubborn and his prices don’t come down. I ask know he’s not afraid to construct a big, hairy, super complicated trade (look at all the pieces in the OEL deal, and the wild ass conditions on the picks for Dvorak and Kuemper). Finally, I know he is more than willing to eat dumps for value.

So what’s 2.3aav retained in Chychrun for three years worth? Probably a late 1st, right? What’s eating Gardiner worth? Given he’s LTIR - not as much, probably. Maybe a 2nd. And how much is Boyd worth? Maybe a 3rd?

So, if the retention on Chychrun pays for the very late 1st that’s 18mo away, what does eating Gardiner and Cole pay for? And what about Boyd? Let’s say they Scott Morrow has doubled his value since the last draft. Say he’s worth two 2nds instead of just one. Surely the two dumps and Boyd pay for half of that.

That means my proposal is more simply, Chychrun for Jarvis and a 2nd. Which I think is fair. And I think most people would think is fair. All of the other stuff is meant to A) get BA his “on-paper” asking price and B) make the cap work, while C) keeping the value as close to Jarvis+2nd as possible.

Yikes, I responded to a deal that said Coyotes give a 3rd rounder up if Canes don’t reach conference finals if not it drops to a 7th.

 

[rt]

Yikes, I responded to a deal that said Coyotes give a 3rd rounder up if Canes don’t reach conference finals if not it drops to a 7th.

Do you have any concept of how nuts it is to fixate in literally he most insignificant part of all of that?

 

[Overrateprospects]

Do you have any concept of how nuts it is to fixate in literally he most insignificant part of all of that?

Would you trade JT Miller for Vlad Namestnikov and a late 2nd?

 

[Bevans]

You’ve done a poor job of expressing yourself. Please clarify.

1. Awful for which team?

2. You’re saying the 1st doesn’t cover the retention in Chychrun and the absorption on Cole and Gardner? Yet, Jarvis and Morrow are in the deal. You’re saying they don’t balance it out?

3. How does Boyd’s inclusion break the cap? What do you mean that’s not how the cap world works? Are you implying this isn’t compliant?

I think it's quite clear. As explained. It costs money for retention and dead space.

The team's asking price is 1st round pick and two former first rounders for Chychurn.

Not same for chychrun, Boyd, and taking on 6 million in cap space plus a LTIR contract.

There is almost zero value here provided for all the freebies sought on top of full price chychrun.

 

[Bevans]

Im not say he will get traded but if Eichel got traded then Lundell is by no means 100% untouchable

Lol everything is eichel.

"If a guy who demanded a trade can be traded then anyone can be traded!"

Just doesn't have the same ring as Gretzky does it?

 

[57special]

That means my proposal is more simply, Chychrun for Jarvis and a 2nd. Which I think is fair. And I think most people would think is fair. All of the other stuff is meant to A) get BA his “on-paper” asking price and B) make the cap work, while C) keeping the value as close to Jarvis+2nd as possible.

That's a steal for CAR.

 

[rt]

I think it's quite clear. As explained. It costs money for retention and dead space.

The team's asking price is 1st round picks and two former first rounders for Chychurn.

Not same for chychrun, Boyd, and taking on 6 million in cap space plus a LTIR contract.

There is almost zero value here provided for all the freebies sought on top of full price chychrun.

You aren’t acknowledging Jarvis and Morrow at all.

 

[rt]

That's a steal for CAR.

Yet Carolina fans seem not to like it. Why do you suppose that is?

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

You just asked when the last time an elite center got traded with multiple ELC years left. The only centers of the last decade who were elite with multiple ELC years left were McDavid and Matthews. Lundell is absolutely not elite

I think the term 'elite' gets thrown around a little too freely, especially in this thread

 

[Bevans]

You aren’t acknowledging Jarvis and Morrow at all.

Incorrect.

 

[rt]

Incorrect.

I’m asking you to expand and you’re doing the opposite.

 

[Bevans]

I’m asking you to expand and you’re doing the opposite.

Alright I'll break it down.

Arizona ask:
1st: check
Former 1st: Jarvis, check
Former 1st: Morrow, for sake of discussion we can say check.

This is theoretically what Arizona is asking for to trade a full price Chychrun.

You are "asking" for the following freebies.
1. Cole dump
2. 50% retention.
3. Gardiner dump.
4. Boyd.
5. The weird conditional pick.

Even if we presume that 1st Jarvis Morrow is the "best" offer that matches the ask, there's no way it's still the best after the 5 freebies tacked on.

 

[57special]

Yet Carolina fans seem not to like it. Why do you suppose that is?

They are convinced that Jarvis is a future #2C capable of scoring 50-60 pts, I guess.

My point is that Chychrun has actually done it, is just entering his prime, and is signed for 3 more years at a reasonable rate for - let's call him a top 3 guy on a good team(I've certainly seen him play like a top pairing guy before). His numbers are down this year, and that's a concern, but I am of the mind that the atrocious state of ARI has brought everyone down. Chychrun's talent is obvious, and far more proven than Jarvis's. That matters to gm's.

I still think that ARI is crazy to move a young Dman like Chychrun. Makes absolutely no sense to me. I would understand it if his deal was up, or he was 27+ yo. At 23 yo, the guy has a decade of good hockey ahead of him.

 

[rt]

They are convinced that Jarvis is a future #2C capable of scoring 50-60 pts, I guess.

My point is that Chychrun has actually done it, is just entering his prime, and is signed for 3 more years at a reasonable rate for - let's call him a top 3 guy on a good team(I've certainly seen him play like a top pairing guy before). His numbers are down this year, and that's a concern, but I am of the mind that the atrocious state of ARI has brought everyone down. Chychrun's talent is obvious, and far more proven than Jarvis's. That matters to gm's.

I still think that ARI is crazy to move a young Dman like Chychrun. Makes absolutely no sense to me. I would understand it if his deal was up, or he was 27+ yo. At 23 yo, the guy has a decade of good hockey ahead of him.

So how do you fix the trade? Ditch the retention? Does that make it fair?

 

[rt]

Alright I'll break it down.

Arizona ask:
1st: check
Former 1st: Jarvis, check
Former 1st: Morrow, for sake of discussion we can say check.

This is theoretically what Arizona is asking for to trade a full price Chychrun.

You are "asking" for the following freebies.
1. Cole dump
2. 50% retention.
3. Gardiner dump.
4. Boyd.
5. The weird conditional pick.

Even if we presume that 1st Jarvis Morrow is the "best" offer that matches the ask, there's no way it's still the best after the 5 freebies tacked on.

Thanks! Which of the four need to be eliminated before this is acceptable?

 

[rt]

Jarvis, Morrow, and a 1st? That's quite a bit. I think Canes hang up quickly on this

There are some non-Yotes fans making some pretty good cases in the last few replies. Can you chime in with why you think Carolina would hang up the phone quickly?

 

[Bevans]

Thanks! Which of the four need to be eliminated before this is acceptable?

All of the freebies. Then it's a matter of who blinks first.

It could be that Carolina fans don't want to trade Jarvis at any price which is fine. But the solution to that is to not make the trade. You don't hope Armstrong suddenly becomes Santa and takes on all your cap problems.