Proposal: Another Price Proposal

[nhlfan9191]

Man, that's a dilemma, then.

Wouldn’t be surprised if this is a major focus for owners in the next CBA negotiations. The contract was made by us because our team can afford it but other teams aren’t so lucky.

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Wouldn’t be surprised if this is a major focus for owners in the next CBA negotiations. The contract was made by us because our team can afford it but other teams aren’t so lucky.

You mean rules to regulate contract price for all players? Man, that should be detrimental towards players.

 

[nhlfan9191]

You mean rules to regulate contract price for all players? Man, that should be detrimental towards players.

The cap is used to regulate the prices but I can see a set percentage of signing bonuses on a contract. Eventually the cap will get so high that the lower budget teams won’t be able to afford to give the signing bonuses their UFA’s will want.

 

[72hockey guy]

Crippling? Stop exaggerating. Do you think people don’t understand more cap means less cap space? There’s this think called inflation and Rinne and Lundqvist took up the same amount of cap as Price will at the beginning and it’s done nothing to stop those teams from being good. We have another expansion team coming and the natural rise of the cap as well meaning the cap will continue to grow making it look less significant in a few years. People just see the double digits and go crazy.

Oh no you dont. Price isn't getting any better. So you don't get to use the cap is going up in the future garbage. We are talking right now. He couldn't finish in top 30 in the league in goals against average this year. That's a fact, your defense isn't getting any better either.

So can it with the in the future he'll be better garbage. He is what he is until he proves he is. As of right now he's in decline.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Oh no you dont. Price isn't getting any better. So you don't get to use the cap is going up in the future garbage. We are talking right now. He couldn't finish in top 30 in the league in goals against average this year. That's a fact, your defense isn't getting any better either.

So can it with the in the future he'll be better garbage. He is what he is until he proves he is. As of right now he's in decline.

Your posts are all ridiculous. Im not expecting Price to become a better goalie, I’m expecting him to get back closer to his norm which is an elite goalie. If he has declined a little, that’s fine. he’s 30, not 37. The contract isn’t crippling. We have the money to pay it and the cap is increasing. He’s had one bad season. That doesn’t erase he finished top 4 in Vezina voting in 3 of the previous 4 seasons before this one. Your Islanders offer shows you’re doing nothing more then trying to stir the pot with ignorant posts. Either that, or you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Given every post I’ve read from you in these threads, I’d say it’s a bit of both.

 

[72hockey guy]

Your posts are all ridiculous. Im not expecting Price to become a better goalie, I’m expecting him to get back closer to his norm which is an elite goalie. If he has declined a little, that’s fine. he’s 30, not 37. The contract isn’t crippling. We have the money to pay it and the cap is increasing. He’s had one bad season. That doesn’t erase he finished top 4 in Vezina voting in 3 of the previous 4 seasons before this one. Your Islanders offer shows you’re doing nothing more then trying to stir the pot with ignorant posts. Either that, or you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Given every post I’ve read from you in these threads, I’d say it’s a bit of both.

answer one question did price decline in performance from last year to this? just answer the question. if your answer is yes, then he IS in decline. sorry for teaching you the meaning of words but its clear you must not understand english very well

his goals against average the last 4 years

1.96
2.06
2.23
3.03

his save percentage the last 4 years

.933
.934
.923
.903

so its obvious he is in decline, and this is before his 10.6M contract even begins.

You personally may be in denial and unwilling to accept the obvious, but the rest of us deal in the real world

 

[nhlfan9191]

answer one question did price decline in performance from last year to this? just answer the question. if your answer is yes, then he IS in decline. sorry for teaching you the meaning of words but its clear you must not understand english very well

his goals against average the last 4 years

1.96
2.06
2.23
3.03

his save percentage the last 4 years

.933
.934
.923
.903

so its obvious he is in decline, and this is before his 10.6M contract even begins.

You personally may be in denial and unwilling to accept the obvious, but the rest of us deal in the real world

You may use this kind of childish language to get other posters going. Won’t work on me. Teaching me the meaning of words. You type and argue like you’re are a teenager, which you most likely are.

I already answered your question. I said I expect him to get back closer to his norm next year which is an elite goalie. Last season was closer to his norm then his Hart trophy season, and closer then this season. To suggest he’s in a radical decline because he may never hit that peak season again is as foolish as saying he can’t rebound from a bad year.

I’m in denial to nothing. The contract is bad, but going around saying it’s crippling when other goalies have taken the same percentage of cap in the past and still built successful teams is ignorant. He’s a goaltender behind a very poor team right now going threw the motions and battling his own struggles. Players have bad seasons. Unless you’re one of those types that thought Kopitar was going to score 12 goals this year like he did last. He’ll be 31 next year and has good years left in him if he can stay healthy. Even if he is overpaid, it’s not to the degree you’re exaggerating it too with your insulting trade proposals. The know it all attitude I see you running around with on the mainboards doesn’t suit you.

 

[72hockey guy]

You may use this kind of childish language to get other posters going. Won’t work on me. Teaching me the meaning of words. You type and argue like you’re are a teenager, which you most likely are.

I already answered your question. I said I expect him to get back closer to his norm next year which is an elite goalie. Last season was closer to his norm then his Hart trophy season, and closer then this season. To suggest he’s in a radical decline because he may never hit that peak season again is as foolish as saying he can’t rebound from a bad year.

I’m in denial to nothing. The contract is bad, but going around saying it’s crippling when other goalies have taken the same percentage of cap in the past and still built successful teams is ignorant. He’s a goaltender behind a very poor team right now going threw the motions and battling his own struggles. Players have bad seasons. Unless you’re one of those types that thought Kopitar was going to score 12 goals this year like he did last. He’ll be 31 next year and has good years left in him if he can stay healthy. Even if he is overpaid, it’s not to the degree you’re exaggerating it too with your insulting trade proposals. The know it all attitude I see you running around with on the mainboards doesn’t suit you.

im 59 , i just dont like people like you who use specious argunents, that are false on its face, the fact is that Price is paid 20% more than any goalie NOW. the concept that other goalies will one day make more then price is immaterial until they actually receive those contracts, which is 100% speculation on your part, with no basis in reality.

I presented current evidence of his actual decline, the fact that you personally believe his level of play will return to his prior level is speculative as well and has again no basis in reality.

just because you believe something doesnt make it fact. the one with an attitude is you. because I keep calling you on your total lack of ANY EVIDENCE to back up your claims, and no your opinion is not evidence.

until you are ready to present some actual verifiable evidence keep your speculations to yourself because nobody cares, you could claim Carey Price will have a 60-0 record with a 0.49 goals against average next year but nobody will buy it until he actually does it. just because you think he will, doesnt qualify as evidence.

 

[nhlfan9191]

im 59 , i just dont like people like you who use specious argunents, that are false on its face, the fact is that Price is paid 20% more than any goalie NOW. the concept that other goalies will one day make more then price is immaterial until they actually receive those contracts, which is 100% speculation on your part, with no basis in reality.

I presented current evidence of his actual decline, the fact that you personally believe his level of play will return to his prior level is speculative as well and has again no basis in reality.

just because you believe something doesnt make it fact. the one with an attitude is you. because I keep calling you on your total lack of ANY EVIDENCE to back up your claims, and no your opinion is not evidence.

until you are ready to present some actual verifiable evidence keep your speculations to yourself because nobody cares, you could claim Carey Price will have a 60-0 record with a 0.49 goals against average next year but nobody will buy it until he actually does it. just because you think he will, doesnt qualify as evidence.

You need a lot bigger sample size then a one year drop to support your argument of steep decline, especially when you have a bunch more recent years that suggest this season could be a fluke, not to mention the team he’s playing on performance fell of a cliff this year. Just because he hit the other side of 30 doesn’t mean he isn’t capable of finding a high level of play again. I used the cap percentage arguement because the cap is constantly changing. And believe it or not, that’s calculated when contract negotiations are going on. What does it matter if he’s the highest paid right now? The cap will go up and so will players salaries which means the elite goalies, which I used Lundqvist and Rinne as comparables because they’re very similar, will also go up.

And why are you going on about speculating? It’s hypocritical for you to even use that word. By your logic, once a player struggles, until he comes out of it, you can start immediately throwing around non sense about his career being on the decline immediately because you can’t predict the future. That’s a weak safety net you’re using in arguments in an attempt to not lose one. I never said my prediction was a fact, I’m not some fortune teller. I’m basing my predictions on the evidence I find the hardest hitting in my opinion. You’re calling me out for speculating when I can flip it just as easy and say you’re doing the exact same by saying he’s never going to play at a high level again. You haven’t stated anything other then there’s a drop from .923- 2.23, .903-3.03. It’s one year, if you had 2-3 seasons as a sample size of decline, you would have a point. Dropping from the .930’s into he .920’s is not a decline. Thats simply coming down to realistic standards. Only one goalie in the history of the game has maintained .930+ multiple seasons.

 

[A Loyal Dog]

The value of Carey Price at this moment is... lmao

Carey Price + 1st 2018 for a short-term cap dump + 7th 2018

 

[T_Cage]

Price is overpaid, but this isn't Brent Seabrook we are talking about.

@6.5m, he brings back fair value...but I don't see mtl retaining that much. Probably more like price @ 8.5m for a B prospect or two

 

[72hockey guy]

You need a lot bigger sample size then a one year drop to support your argument of steep decline, especially when you have a bunch more recent years that suggest this season could be a fluke, not to mention the team he’s playing on performance fell of a cliff this year. Just because he hit the other side of 30 doesn’t mean he isn’t capable of finding a high level of play again. I used the cap percentage arguement because the cap is constantly changing. And believe it or not, that’s calculated when contract negotiations are going on. What does it matter if he’s the highest paid right now? The cap will go up and so will players salaries which means the elite goalies, which I used Lundqvist and Rinne as comparables because they’re very similar, will also go up.

And why are you going on about speculating? It’s hypocritical for you to even use that word. By your logic, once a player struggles, until he comes out of it, you can start immediately throwing around non sense about his career being on the decline immediately because you can’t predict the future. That’s a weak safety net you’re using in arguments in an attempt to not lose one. I never said my prediction was a fact, I’m not some fortune teller. I’m basing my predictions on the evidence I find the hardest hitting in my opinion. You’re calling me out for speculating when I can flip it just as easy and say you’re doing the exact same by saying he’s never going to play at a high level again. You haven’t stated anything other then there’s a drop from .923- 2.23, .903-3.03. It’s one year, if you had 2-3 seasons as a sample size of decline, you would have a point. Dropping from the .930’s into he .920’s is not a decline. Thats simply coming down to realistic standards. Only one goalie in the history of the game has maintained .930+ multiple seasons.

except i presented data for 4 years not one if season one is a baseline he's decline in goals against every year just because you say :"its simply coming down to realistic standards." doesnt mean its not a decline. it still is. the man got an 84M dollar contract for a reason, he's supposed to be elite, not on the same tier as everyone else. it IS a three year decline. No spinning the message by you changes that.

thats what i mean by your lack of evidence. evidence you dont like you try to spin away but as a matter of statistical FACT IT IS A 3 YEAR DECLINE, when considering the two most important metrics together, the first year was slight, the second was a little more pronounced, and the third was a crash. just because you personally choose to ignore the first two, doesnt mean they didnt happen.

 

[72hockey guy]

Price is overpaid, but this isn't Brent Seabrook we are talking about.

@6.5m, he brings back fair value...but I don't see mtl retaining that much. Probably more like price @ 8.5m for a B prospect or two

agreed, he's still a good goalie, the question is can he return to being an elite one

 

[nhlfan9191]

except i presented data for 4 years not one if season one is a baseline he's decline in goals against every year just because you say :"its simply coming down to realistic standards." doesnt mean its not a decline. it still is. the man got an 84M dollar contract for a reason, he's supposed to be elite, not on the same tier as everyone else. it IS a three year decline. No spinning the message by you changes that.

thats what i mean by your lack of evidence. evidence you dont like you try to spin away but as a matter of statistical FACT IT IS A 3 YEAR DECLINE, when considering the two most important metrics together, the first year was slight, the second was a little more pronounced, and the third was a crash. just because you personally choose to ignore the first two, doesnt mean they didnt happen.

What 3 year decline are you talking about? He’s been a .930 goalie once, and his 11 games in 15/16 is way to small to count. .930 + is not his norm. I’m spinning nothing while you’re reaching at the bottom of the barrel.

 

[72hockey guy]

What 3 year decline are you talking about? He’s been a .930 goalie once, and his 11 games in 15/16 is way to small to count. .930 + is not his norm. I’m spinning nothing while you’re reaching at the bottom of the barrel.

even if i accept that, and in retrospect its a valid cinsideration its still a 2 season drop off from 2014-15, not just one like you keep saying

 

[nhlfan9191]

even if i accept that, and in retrospect its a valid cinsideration its still a 2 season drop off from 2014-15, not just one like you keep saying

Like I said in one of my posts lacking evidence, only Hasek has pulled off .930+ over multiple seasons. Dropping into the mid .920’s after a unsubstainable career year isn’t some huge drop off or indicates a decline in any way. It’s still an excellent season.

 

[JuniorNelson]

Price has a bad year at an age that a high percentage of athletes go into decline. It's suspicious, but he said he was suffering from chronic fatigue. That's possibly treatable if it's a symptom of depression. An issue like that is usually held internally by the team because it's career threatening. Depression can crush a person and would certainly complicate training. The media spotlight doesn't help.

A struggling player is an indicator to others. How is he treated? Does the team support him?

One of the things that makes Vancouver such an epic loser is how they treat struggling players. Trade an alcoholic or let a chronically depressed kid go and it becomes written in stone. For real. In Vancouver, you have to be "in the club", not just on the roster. Montreal can become a pariah team, too. It's the easy way out.

 

[ahmedou]

The Price isn't right

 

[Newsworthy]

To the islanders?

Price is just a bad fit for the Isles. NY needs to draft a young guy they can develop.

 

[BB88]

Price is just a bad fit for the Isles. NY needs to draft a young guy they can develop.

I think they have that guy in Sorokin.

 

[habsgirl5000]

Price is just a bad fit for the Isles. NY needs to draft a young guy they can develop.

Price is a bad fit on ANY NHL team!!!!

He is WORSE then most backup goalies in the league!!!!

currently ranked 60th in the league with a GAA of 3.05

and 68th in the league with a SV% of .902

this guy is done....washed up.....gone.....he shouldn't even be making 5 million next season!!....even 5 million would be an over payment!!

 

[KILLger]

I guess some posters here thought that Patrick Roy was declining when he got traded to Colorado... I sure as hell hope Price doesn't get traded while his value is low and that the franchise has learnt from that crippling mistake.

 

[BrendanGallagher11]

Price isn't reclining.

He was the best goalie for 2 yrs and we will come back to the top

Goalies like Luongo price fleury lundqvist are in there prime from 20s to mid 30s

 

[Ducks in a row]

He isn't worth his cap hit never was outside of one season. Teams shouldn't be spending so much on a goalie.

 

[justafan22]

He isn't moving except in an expansion draft to Seattle. (close enough to his home in BC)