Eric Lindros refused to play for the Nordiques, so the precedence was set quite some time ago.
Prospect Info: All Prospect Talk Part 3
- Thread starter Kurtosis
- Start date
- Status
How was he a semi-bust when all he did was improve on his production every year? What are prospects supposed to do except improve on whatever team they're on? He was having a great Jr. year last season even after the mini-suspension and up until the leg injury and multiple surgeries. He was right on pace for improving on his Sophmore stats. I'd hardly consider him going down last year at a .925 PPG pace a bust trajectory.
Last edited:
Quit your *****in' about collegiate prospects since drafting foreign players is not a given either (Rensfeldt, Hoefflin), as well as one Russian prima donna (Shalunov).
Taze em
Registered User
- Apr 20, 2012
- 8,295
- 595
We just signed a UDFA junior defensemen who had those numbers.
If you're a first round pick that goes to college then you should put up some numbers immediately.
I didn't say he was a big Beach level bust, just that he wasn't playing as well as a 1st rounder until this year.
He'll be a good NHLer, probably 3rd liner, maybe 2nd liner. We're about to sign Hjalmarsson anyways so it isn't a huge loss. Hjalmarsson+2nd rounder for Hayes trade is getting $1.25 on the dollar.
Blackhawkswincup
RIP Fugu
Shalunov has come over
Hoefflin and Rensfeldt weren't deemed to be worth investment from Hawks POV
Hardly comparable to 2 quality prospects walking away after 4 years of development
The Chicago Blackhawks could draft a CHL prospect in the first round and pull an "Eric Lindros vis-Ã -vis Le Nordiques".
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
That was a generational franchise talent TWO CBA's ago. Apples and garden hoses.
Immediately? Really, that's absurd. What is a freshman coming in to a defending NCAA Championship program supposed to do or expected to contribute? Let's get real. Reference John Hayden's freshman campaign this year for Yale. Hayes was a low 1st Rder---of the major scouting services I only recall Central Scouting uniformly putting him in the 1st, many others had him as a 2nd Rd. pick. Seeing as many higher half 1st Rders don't go to the NCAA route and for where he was taken in the bottom of the 1st he's met expectations every year as a college player IMO. Considering the scoring leader in 2013 had a whopping 53 pts it's pretty safe to assume that Hayes had it not been for his season-ending injury would have at least been in the Top 15 in scoring based on his production.
Carl Dahlström scored his first goal among the "big boys" during today's quarter final in the Swedish play off. He tied the game 1-1. His team won and the series goes to game 7, which will be played on thursday.
Stan Bowman was in the stands, I guess also checking out Simon Hjalmarsson.
Stan Bowman was in the stands, I guess also checking out Simon Hjalmarsson.
Taze em
Registered User
- Apr 20, 2012
- 8,295
- 595
Look at Nick Bjustad drafted a few spots ahead of Hayes. Played for a power in Minnesota.
Kevin Hayes is one of 4 players to have not played an Nhl minute in that 1st round.
Also, Hayden has out produced Hayes in their freshman seasons and Hayden was a late 3rd rounder so... Not really helping your argument.
Hawkaholic
Registered User
Sorry, mixed up Pirri with Hayes. Hard to keep up with the Chicago to Miami/Fort Lauderdale shuttle these days.
Bjustad scored 6 more pts than Hayes their freshman yr comparables and then definitely outpaced him if we compare their sophmore stats. . .and then Hayes IMPROVED his Jr. yr. How was Hayes' pts performance trajectory his Jr. yr not comparable to Bjustad's Jr. yr at Minnesota but for the leg injury? Hayes' development got thrown off track with needing four surgeries on the same leg. He recuperated, rehabbed and came back even better as we all concede his Sr. year. I don't see a "problem". I actually have no reason to believe the Hawks wouldn't have signed him after his Jr. year like many NCAAers are, i.e. Bjustad if not for uncertainty about how he would look upon returning to hockey.
As for Hayden my argument was about freshman tending to not be superstars on very high-end NCAA programs---the correlation was they both went to current defending NCAA champs. Wow! So Hayden had 2 more pts in 2 more GP than Hayes in their freshman years, that's real out production!
Taze em
Registered User
- Apr 20, 2012
- 8,295
- 595
1. Who is the tweeter source who spread this rumour or truth to Myers? Is she a reliable source? Or did she merely mean Hawks cannot sign Hayes to a contract for this year to get in games now if BC loses before Hawks season ends? Maybe cause we are at 50 contracts max now? OR is it true..because after they dumped Jimmy off to FLA,K. Hayes and the Hayes family mad at the Hawks?Maybe wants to play in FLA with Jimmy? Or in CGY with Johnny Hockey? Tampering would be hard to prove..the anger over Jimmy gone easier to justify why he would not sign in Chicago..Anyway a mid 2nd in a poor draft year of depth is not going to get us much..UNLESS of course Stanbo takes my advice and grabs one of.my goalie targets possibly still on the board in the mid 40s..cause our pipeline stinks in good goalie prospects with any real NHL ability. BUT unless this is MasonMcDonsld who is in the Q. Or the Finland Jr. Kaapo Kahkonen .the other targets are going the NCAA route and so we risk losing them in 4 years too..It seems a big waste of a first rounded if Hayes signs elsewhere especially if his blossoming this year as a score is for real and not merely because he wS on the top line with Gaudreau at BC.. So if he becomes a big NHL star..then Standard loses big..unless as I said he gets us a gem goalie with the comp pick..but we will need to wait 4-5 years to find out..Meantime Hayes could star from next year..seems like a 4 yr possible loss to me. BUT what can you do..if the guy wants no part of Chicago..what are you gonna do? The comp rule should be adjusted back to a first rounded for a lost first rounded..at the very least.BUT it is what it is.. Of course we get nothing if Johns signs elsewhere.. But remember..2 can play at this game..Maybe Stanbo steals Connor Helleybuck from the WG pipeline.Then we would have a real goalie star in the making. Or there Willie opportunities in other years to sign NCAA guys who refuse to sign with their drafting team..maybe the Shultz precedent will set a pattern leading to the regular rejection by drafted Seniors of their drafting team.If that is the new norm..no NCAA draftee is certain for the pipeline and it becomes a free for all anyway..In that light,if Chicago is deep in certain positions we could lose drafteres feeling they have no immediate chance at the NHL with us..If we are weak at some positions. .then drafters of teams who are strong at those positions may lose their drafted Senior graduates to us..It can work both ways..So if we lose Hayes and Johns. ..maybe Stan finds a goalie from some other pipeline whose NHL team is stacked deep in goalie respects..Such a goalie might think he can challenge Rata for our back-up right away or at least be the #1 in Rockford whereas in his drafting org maybe he is only an NHL back-up or has to go to the ECHO to start..So it can work to our Advantage too..In the last teams would not poaching too many graduating drafted Seniors because most would automatically sign with their drafting org..But clearly agents are not advising that now..It is not fir higher money..but thicker perceived advancement to the NHL and chances to best succeed there.So the system can work against us If ee lose such first and second founders who decide opportunity is best elsewhere..but it can work for us too if we grab guys from other pipelines who are thinking they have better opportunity with us.
Hayes is a RW..sees HOSSA and KANE as our top 2 RWs for years yet..does not want to be bottom 2 lines..so makes sense his agent says better chance elsewhere to be in top 2 lines and score more..make more $$$$..SO I can understand if he walks...especially after Jimmy gone. ..But maybe there is a goalie situation on a team already deep in pipeline goalie such that a top already drAfted NCAA goalie gets advised by his agent about how weak Chicago"s goalie pipeline is and the opportunities to advance quickly to at least NHL back-up with CHI.. So we may benefit from other org's loss just as some team will sign Hayes who does not see a clear path to where he wants to get with us.
Hayes is a RW..sees HOSSA and KANE as our top 2 RWs for years yet..does not want to be bottom 2 lines..so makes sense his agent says better chance elsewhere to be in top 2 lines and score more..make more $$$$..SO I can understand if he walks...especially after Jimmy gone. ..But maybe there is a goalie situation on a team already deep in pipeline goalie such that a top already drAfted NCAA goalie gets advised by his agent about how weak Chicago"s goalie pipeline is and the opportunities to advance quickly to at least NHL back-up with CHI.. So we may benefit from other org's loss just as some team will sign Hayes who does not see a clear path to where he wants to get with us.
The Chicago Blackhawks would be awarded a second round draft pick in 2015 if Kevin Hayes does not sign with the Chicago Blackhawks.
Paragraphs ????????????????????????????????????
pvr
Leather Skates
- Jan 22, 2008
- 4,705
- 2,104
2nd round picks:
2011 Clendening and Saad
2010 Rensfeldt, Holl, Simpson, and Johns
2009 Pirri
2008 None
2007 Sweatt and Aliu
2006 Makarov and Danis-Pepin
2005 Blunden and Brophey
As of now, really only Saad has had an NHL career as a second round pick by the Hawks. That's one out of thirteen, or a poor 7.7%, not counting the too-early-to-tell 2012 and 2013 drafts. if you add Pirri, then it goes to 15.4%. A crapshoot at best.
Absolutely agree. At the minimum he's a potentially very attractive trade chip. For the Hawks, perhaps he would have developed into that elusive point producing power forward, or third line center.
Yes..my bad..forgot that he cannot sign with any other club till after Aug 15th I believe..We have till then to sign him or lose him since he is a graduating Senior from the NCAA..So the comp pick comes next draft..2015..so I guess the scouting dept.has to bone up on 2015 draft eligible..particular goalie at the point in round two where the comp pick is awarded.. AT LEAST 2015 is a deeper draft..we should get something of value.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
Pepe Silvia
Registered User
Anyway..Hawks needed a big 3rd line 2 way centre more than a bottom six RWwhich is all Hayes could be with us given the HOSSA and Kane clog at RW on the top 2 lines.. So if the Hawks thought Hayes was a better wing than true centre maybe they like the Carey option for 3C better than Hayes there. You do not like to lose prospects from the pipeline but if they come.out in the exchange contracts in actually better positional structure..that is not so bad..Still gotta get something good back with the comp.pick..Anyway if this is true about Hayes not signing or being signed then I hope.BC loses their next game and is eliminated from advancing in their Regional and to the Frozen Four. Apologies to Chris Calnan. .but if Hayes is a gunner I hope he.loses.
Taze em
Registered User
- Apr 20, 2012
- 8,295
- 595
Clendening, Johns and Pirri are all NHL players. Saad is a stud. Also, why include picks pre-2009. This regime wasn't in place.
So, for Stan and Co. I'd say that hit % is a lot higher than you are letting on. Plus they found the 4th best player in the draft in the second round with Saad.
Blackhawkswincup
RIP Fugu
- Status
Ad
Latest posts
-
-
-
GDT: ECQF Game 4: Boston Bruins vs Toronto Leafs:, | 8pm, | SN
- Latest: WetcoastOrca
-
