Helene St. James Alfredsson looking to come back

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

If we don't make any major moves to upgrade the offense, I'm in favor of a one year deal.

 

[SirloinUB]

I like Alfredsson, but I worry it signals they won't make any changes to the forward group.

And the defender UFAs aren't going to be game changers.

Pressure is mounting on Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Smith and company to be the answer. Alfredsson is ideally your2nd liner and powerplay option, not a guy who can tilt a game.

I agree with this and its why I want Alfie resigned. Offensively, he will ease the burden on the kids. Beyond that he is a great mentor. As long as he can play 60 games I will be happy; 55 and I still wont be too frustrated.

 

[icKx]

It's not like we are going to make a serious bid for any of the premier UFA forwards so why not.

 

[Point Shot]

I'm all for Alfie coming back. His leadership will be good for all the kids we'll be fielding.

 

[Winger98]

It's not like we are going to make a serious bid for any of the premier UFA forwards so why not.

Several of the premier UFA forwards have some questions to their games, though, too. Vanek has some definite compete/priority issues. Moulson is left handed and a bit on the small side. Stastny has had some injury problems. Callahan has a lot of intangibles, but questions of being able to maintain his style of game.

One year of Alfredsson and I feel pretty comfortable penciling him in for at least 20-20 and dependable two way play while fitting into our lockerroom. And he's then gone in a year to pursue someone else, or fill the spot with a prospect.

 

[Crymson]

For $4 or $4.5, welcome back Alfie!

I think $4.50 is below the minimum salary.

Several of the premier UFA forwards have some questions to their games, though, too. Vanek has some definite compete/priority issues. Moulson is left handed and a bit on the small side. Stastny has had some injury problems. Callahan has a lot of intangibles, but questions of being able to maintain his style of game.

All of them also have the question mark of being incredibly expensive. Callahan, for example, has been demanding six years at a $6.5m AAV, a contract he very obviously does not deserve. Said demand got him traded to Tampa, because the Rangers were, understandably, quite unwilling to give him that much money. Vanek is all but certain to sign in either Montreal or Minnesota, so he's more or less off the table to begin with. I can't speak to Stastny's contractual leanings, though I can say with confidence that this team doesn't need another center. Moulson I know little about, though it seems basic that we do not need another smallish scorer.

This is just a very poor UFA crop.

 

[joe89]

One year deal suits us very well with the Mantha-situation, and if our other guys are healthier Alfie will have a similar year again or possibly even better as his quality of teammates will improve.

I would rather they give him a solid base than bonuses though as we don't need cap space this season to squeeze under the cap. I understand the bonus thing is very good if he's totally ruined by injuries but I don't think he would play another year if he felt like he couldn't play 70+ games excluding playoffs.

If we say DeKeyser, Tatar, Gustavsson, Sheahan are about $8M combined we still have ~$10M over for another D and Alfie.

 

[Henkka]

If we say DeKeyser, Tatar, Gustavsson, Sheahan are about $8M combined we still have ~$10M over for another D and Alfie.

No we won't have 10 million capspace after those RFA's.

We have that 3M bonus penalty from last year and cap could lower ~1.5M than that estimated 71.1M because of the weakened Canadian dollar.

66.6M could be a realistic cap figure for Red Wings at next season.

With Alfie bonuses, you could buy some space from 2015-16 season's cap again, though. Or offer a 1-year (bonus-style +35 aged) deal for someone like Sami Salo.

 

[Crymson]

One year deal suits us very well with the Mantha-situation, and if our other guys are healthier Alfie will have a similar year again or possibly even better as his quality of teammates will improve.

I would rather they give him a solid base than bonuses though as we don't need cap space this season to squeeze under the cap. I understand the bonus thing is very good if he's totally ruined by injuries but I don't think he would play another year if he felt like he couldn't play 70+ games excluding playoffs.

If we say DeKeyser, Tatar, Gustavsson, Sheahan are about $8M combined we still have ~$10M over for another D and Alfie.

I hope to see DeKeyser given a long-term extension, perhaps along the grain of the 5/15 deals given to Filppula and Kronwall.

 

[Roy S]

No we won't have 10 million capspace after those RFA's.

We have that 3M bonus penalty from last year and cap could lower ~1.5M than that estimated 71.1M because of the weakened Canadian dollar.

66.6M could be a realistic cap figure for Red Wings at next season.

With Alfie bonuses, you could buy some space from 2015-16 season's cap again, though. Or offer a 1-year (bonus-style +35 aged) deal for someone like Sami Salo.

Capgeek takes into account the $3 million overage and it still shows a cap space of $18.67 million. Maybe the $71 million cap will be a $1 million or so lower, so then adjust accordingly. Either way, after signing their RFA's and Gustavsson, they should have about $9 to $10 million to spend and that's with 13 forwards, 6 defenseman and 2 goalies already locked up.

They have enough cap space to make one or two large salary acquisitions. Of course, most teams do as well. Plus, guys like Kindl or Andressen could be moved to clear another $3 million on top of that.

 

[Hammettf2b]

Honestly, I think Jurco and Mantha are going to be fighting for the same top-9 spot in training camp. I could even see them rotating during the season, a bit like Tatar and Nyquist did in the lockout season.

I've actually been pleasantly surprised by this thread, came in expecting 3 pages of "PLay teh kidz!!!! Holland you suck!!"
Only 1 or 2 negative nancys, everyone else acknowledging what a solid player Alfie was for us. As for him slowing down the 2nd half of the season - well he was playing with a bad back, stuck on the 3rd line with poor line-mates.

As others have said, when he was with Dats he was magic, because he has the skill, and the hockey IQ to play with Pav. Something which over the years has proven to be a truism - Datsyuk works best with skilled, high IQ players who can take advantage of his creativity, whereas Zetterberg can make anyone look good.

I can honestly see Abby take that top 9 spot and Glendening getting 4th line duties. Which is a shame because Jurco is such a great talent. As for Alfie, I think he would be money playing with the eruo twins given they're all healthy.

 

[Coffee Time]

I would love to see a healthy Pavel and Alfie together.

We all would. Iginla and Pav too.

 

[detredWINgs]

I hope to see DeKeyser given a long-term extension, perhaps along the grain of the 5/15 deals given to Filppula and Kronwall.

I've said this before, but I think Dekeyser could ask for 3M over 3 years now with a straight face. I don't see any way he takes a 5/15 deal.

By comparison, Filppula wasn't as integral a piece when he signed that deal and the cap was at $50.3M (5.9% of the cap). Kronwall was obviously more important when he landed his deal, but the cap was only $44M then (6.8% of the cap).

For comparison, if Dekeyser took 5.9% of a $70M cap, he'd be looking at $4.1M over 5 years.

I think if you want Dekeyser for 5 years, you'd be looking at ~$3.75M. And honestly, that probably isn't the worst idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he surpasses Ericsson in nearly all respects this upcoming season, and Holland has been doling out the cash willingly to Ericsson for years now.

 

[Frk It]

I've said this before, but I think Dekeyser could ask for 3M over 3 years now with a straight face. I don't see any way he takes a 5/15 deal.

By comparison, Filppula wasn't as integral a piece when he signed that deal and the cap was at $50.3M (5.9% of the cap). Kronwall was obviously more important when he landed his deal, but the cap was only $44M then (6.8% of the cap).

For comparison, if Dekeyser took 5.9% of a $70M cap, he'd be looking at $4.1M over 5 years.

I think if you want Dekeyser for 5 years, you'd be looking at ~$3.75M. And honestly, that probably isn't the worst idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he surpasses Ericsson in nearly all respects this upcoming season, and Holland has been doling out the cash willingly to Ericsson for years now.

Dude had a Red Wings license plate before he signed here... Maybe we get a hometown discount?

 

[joe89]

I hope to see DeKeyser given a long-term extension, perhaps along the grain of the 5/15 deals given to Filppula and Kronwall.

It could happen, I'm not totally against it. I figure DeKeyser isn't signed before free agency so we'll know exactly what we can spend by then. Depending on what Alfie+a D on the market cost we could give DeKeyser a longer deal. Of course, there's also a chance we'll get neither Alfie and D that suits on the market.

No we won't have 10 million capspace after those RFA's.

We have that 3M bonus penalty from last year and cap could lower ~1.5M than that estimated 71.1M because of the weakened Canadian dollar.

66.6M could be a realistic cap figure for Red Wings at next season.

With Alfie bonuses, you could buy some space from 2015-16 season's cap again, though. Or offer a 1-year (bonus-style +35 aged) deal for someone like Sami Salo.

We only have ~$49.5M tied up. 17-18M left for RFAs, Alfie and UFAs.

 

[Chance on Chance]

I've said this before, but I think Dekeyser could ask for 3M over 3 years now with a straight face. I don't see any way he takes a 5/15 deal.

By comparison, Filppula wasn't as integral a piece when he signed that deal and the cap was at $50.3M (5.9% of the cap). Kronwall was obviously more important when he landed his deal, but the cap was only $44M then (6.8% of the cap).

For comparison, if Dekeyser took 5.9% of a $70M cap, he'd be looking at $4.1M over 5 years.

I think if you want Dekeyser for 5 years, you'd be looking at ~$3.75M. And honestly, that probably isn't the worst idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he surpasses Ericsson in nearly all respects this upcoming season, and Holland has been doling out the cash willingly to Ericsson for years now.

I always find it interesting looking at the percent of the cap when comparing deals signed years ago. I think DDK could ask for 3 years 10 million

 

[detredWINgs]

Dude had a Red Wings license plate before he signed here... Maybe we get a hometown discount?

At a $70M cap (that could continue to increase), looking at what defenseman get around the league, already being a top 3 defenseman on your team as a rookie, I think willingly making an average of $3.75M at ages 26, 27, 28 is already a hometown discount for this kid. But who knows? Maybe Holland goes bananas and decides Dekeyser is worth a 7-8 year deal.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

At a $70M cap (that could continue to increase), looking at what defenseman get around the league, already being a top 3 defenseman on your team as a rookie, I think willingly making an average of $3.75M at ages 26, 27, 28 is already a hometown discount for this kid. But who knows? Maybe Holland goes bananas and decides Dekeyser is worth a 7-8 year deal.

I would love to see Dekeyser locked up for 7-8 years, Not sure If he and his agent will want to commit to that long of a contract now though. Unless he gets at least 5M a year or so.

 

[Henkka]

Wouldn't be so sure DeKeyser will get those +3millions. He has only one seasaon of games (76 total) under his belt and contract comparables are very hard to find for that kind of guy. That usually pushes the price down, just like what happened to Nyquist.

Same aged guys (under 200 NHL games) from 2008 draft:


Roman Josi, 174 NHL games, 0.43 points/game, 26:25 average IT at last season, 4.0M contract for next 6 years.
Slava Voynov, 184 NHL games, 0.43 points/game, 22:17 average IT at last season, 4.17M contract for next 5 years.
T.J. Brodie, 185 NHL games, 0.32 points/game, 24:03 average IT at last season, 2.13M contract for next 2 years.
Patrick Wiercioh, 103 NHL games, 0.43 points/game, 16:22 average IT at last season, 2.0M contract for next 2 years.
Michael Stone, 123 NHL games, 0.27 points/game, 18:12 average IT at last season, 1.15M contract for next 2 years.
Marco Scandella, 165 games, 0.19 points/game, 18:48 average IT at last season, 1.0M contract for 1 year.

Justin Schultz, 122 NHL games, 0.49 points/game, 23:20 average IT at last season, RFA
Jake Gardiner, 167 NHL games, 0.39 points/game, 21:04 average IT at last season, RFA

Dan DeKeyser, 76 NHL games, 0.32 points/game, 21:38 average IT at last season, RFA

Maybe Gardiner and Brodie could be best comparables. Hopefully we sign DeKeyser first, before Toronto makes their typical overpayment for Gardiner.

 

[Winger98]

All of them also have the question mark of being incredibly expensive. Callahan, for example, has been demanding six years at a $6.5m AAV, a contract he very obviously does not deserve. Said demand got him traded to Tampa, because the Rangers were, understandably, quite unwilling to give him that much money. Vanek is all but certain to sign in either Montreal or Minnesota, so he's more or less off the table to begin with. I can't speak to Stastny's contractual leanings, though I can say with confidence that this team doesn't need another center. Moulson I know little about, though it seems basic that we do not need another smallish scorer.

This is just a very poor UFA crop.

It wouldn't be so bad if we were looking for a depth guy, but we'd much rather find a guy who can carry a bigger share of the load now and then. With contracts, I'm not sure what will be really overpaid and what is something we may just need to get accustomed to with the ever increasing cap. Reference detredWINgs' post below about cap percentage and cap hits where an equivalent cap hit to Filppula's bridge deal would be $4.1m now.

Callahan wanting $6.5m seems high, and it is just over 9% of a cap for next season, but I'm if he was signing for around $5.2m a few years ago when the cap was $56m, would we still feel it was way high, even though it's the same percentage of the cap?

And all of this aside from what I really wanted to hit on which was the need for a center. I think it depends what we expect of Weiss and how concerned we are about lack of depth there. Something that gets brought up a lot around here is our lack of a young top6 center coming up through the minors. Stastny is only 28, and could legitimately fill that spot for the next 5-7 years. If we're going for a high end UFA forward this summer, I think it's hard to turn down the best player available at the most important forward position. We might have to shift someone to wing at that point, but that's not necessarily a negative. It also virtually guarantees the ability to play Z&D together.

I've said this before, but I think Dekeyser could ask for 3M over 3 years now with a straight face. I don't see any way he takes a 5/15 deal.

By comparison, Filppula wasn't as integral a piece when he signed that deal and the cap was at $50.3M (5.9% of the cap). Kronwall was obviously more important when he landed his deal, but the cap was only $44M then (6.8% of the cap).

For comparison, if Dekeyser took 5.9% of a $70M cap, he'd be looking at $4.1M over 5 years.

I think if you want Dekeyser for 5 years, you'd be looking at ~$3.75M. And honestly, that probably isn't the worst idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he surpasses Ericsson in nearly all respects this upcoming season, and Holland has been doling out the cash willingly to Ericsson for years now.

Going long term at a good cap isn't the worst thing with Dekeyser. I don't think he has the offensive upside some see in him, though, and I'd be leery of locking myself in that long with him - especially with so many kids knocking on the door from GR.

If we could get a deal done without a NTC/NMC, I'd like it a lot more. Good point about cap percentages, too. I always have a hard time reading RFA contracts, though. For instance, I would have pushed harder for a long term deal with Smith and kept anything with Kindl shorter, but Kindl is the one who got rewarded a bit (and now we're grumbling a bit over).

I would love to see Dekeyser locked up for 7-8 years, Not sure If he and his agent will want to commit to that long of a contract now though. Unless he gets at least 5M a year or so.

I like Dekeyser, but as I said to detredWINgs, I don't like those long deals for Dekeyser. Nice player, really solid, but I don't see him being another McDonagh or anything. I know it's hard to see right now with how weak our blueline has been, but I'd want the ability to move on from him in the 3-5 years.

 

[Goalie guy]

Additionally, he should be able to spend more time with 13 and/or 40 this year. Due to injuries and depth he obviously wasn't able to spend as much time with them as we'd have liked to see, but when they did play together they were very good. You could instantly see that he had the hockey sense to play with them. It was night and day Alfie vs Abdelkader.

This is my hope right here! He can still be a very very good player.

 

[Henkka]

Wouldn't be so sure DeKeyser will get those +3millions. He has only one seasaon of games (76 total) under his belt and contract comparables are very hard to find for that kind of guy. That usually pushes the price down, just like what happened to Nyquist.

Jake Gardiner, 167 NHL games, 0.39 points/game, 21:04 average IT at last season, RFA

Dan DeKeyser, 76 NHL games, 0.32 points/game, 21:38 average IT at last season, RFA

Maybe Gardiner and Brodie could be best comparables. Hopefully we sign DeKeyser first, before Toronto makes their typical overpayment for Gardiner.

Gardiner rumored to have 2-year bridge-deal worth between 2.25M - 3.0M

http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/526110

 

[icKx]

Several of the premier UFA forwards have some questions to their games, though, too. Vanek has some definite compete/priority issues. Moulson is left handed and a bit on the small side. Stastny has had some injury problems. Callahan has a lot of intangibles, but questions of being able to maintain his style of game.

One year of Alfredsson and I feel pretty comfortable penciling him in for at least 20-20 and dependable two way play while fitting into our lockerroom. And he's then gone in a year to pursue someone else, or fill the spot with a prospect.

All of them have question marks, but hey that's the nature of free agency. If they didn't have some warts they wouldn't be hitting the market, they would be locked up.

I know the prevailing opinion is that we only need defense, defense, defense (never mind that there are no elite guys available) but I want a scorer so we're less dependent on D & Z to do everything and we can better weather Franzen's cold streaks.

Colorado, Anaheim and Chicago aren't great defensive teams, but they can score in bunches so that helps. Plus I still believe Howard is better than he was this year. Maybe more offense with Howard playing back at a high level wins us more games and even a playoff round or two. With Ehrhoff or Niskanen Boston still crushes us in 5. With Vanek or Gaborik it's a much closer series imo.

This is just a very poor UFA crop.

Every year it's the same thing: either the talent sucks or the prices are outlandish or both. I don't know what people expect. We're never going to see another Hossa begging to play here.

 

[Winger98]

All of them have question marks, but hey that's the nature of free agency. If they didn't have some warts they wouldn't be hitting the market, they would be locked up.

I know the prevailing opinion is that we only need defense, defense, defense (never mind that there are no elite guys available) but I want a scorer so we're less dependent on D & Z to do everything and we can better weather Franzen's cold streaks.

Colorado, Anaheim and Chicago aren't great defensive teams, but they can score in bunches so that helps. Plus I still believe Howard is better than he was this year. Maybe more offense with Howard playing back at a high level wins us more games and even a playoff round or two. With Ehrhoff or Niskanen Boston still crushes us in 5. With Vanek or Gaborik it's a much closer series imo.

I think it's a much closer series either way. The kids were clearly in over their heads once the playoffs rolled around, and having another go-to guy up front would have helped a lot. But our third pair was also a sieve (-6 for the series, iirc).

That said, I'm with you in wanting to see a forward brought in along with a D. I don't think it will happen, as I think we'll have to settle for Alfredsson re-signing and banking on Weiss being healthy, but I wouldn't complain about adding another unquestionable top6 forward.

 

[Brandel*]

Dreger just now on TSN

"Alfredsson is believed to be coming back but he hasn't made it 100% certain yet that he's coming back to the National Hockey League, he works on his own time frame, very similar to Teemu Selanne, but I'm also told he's willing to be flexible"

whatever that means