Speculation: Acq/ Rost. Bldg./ Cap Part XXIII: The Return of Michael Jordan

[Jasper17]

What is stepping up? If its not fighting or scoring a goal, I am not sure how easy it is to get noticed. Steady Eddies never step up their game yet get their chance.

Orlov's talents favor the offensive side more than the defensive, yet would not get a minute of PP time if he were here.

I just refuse to believe that he cannot play hockey anymore. George does not always know best in what I have seen. I have not seen Orlov falling on his face. All i saw was out for an injury, Oates moved his position, and in the NHL games he fared in most recently, looked just fine to me.

Listen, I would love to see Orlov in the lineup. But I refuse to believe Oates or McPhee have it out for the kid or something. He obviously isn't playing well enough to get into the lineup for one reason or another. Its up to him to dominate in Hershey and force an opportunity.

Which obviously has not happened yet.

 

[txpd]

If we're sticking with the 1-3-1 powerplay, Brouwer's job isn't a particularly difficult one. Firing off a one-timer from a short pass is a skill most NHL forwards possess, and regardless of who's in the slot, their position on the ice forces the defense to consider them a serious scoring threat.

here we are back to the "any monkey could do it" point of view. facts are that while brouwer's pp role is simple, its not easy or else most caps forwards put in that position was be loading up on the ppg's.

its just not true that the catch and shoot and score on it from the slot is easy. mike knuble wasn't good at it. he made up for it by being a beast on the rebounds, but he didn't score much in that slot spot and he got his chances. Laich isn't good there. He scores rebounds. Kozlov wasn't good there. Ward can score one there on occasion, but not with regularity.

Fehr is been in that spot many times over his career and could have solidified his career on that. He can't. Its not his game.

As long as the Caps have had Ov, Backstrom and Green that spot in the slot has been important. It keeps the pk from going all out to take away the point shots. brouwer last season has been the closest the Caps have had to money in that spot....now, we want to trade him because Fehr can do it? big mistake

 

[Stewie G]

here we are back to the "any monkey could do it" point of view. facts are that while brouwer's pp role is simple, its not easy or else most caps forwards put in that position was be loading up on the ppg's.

its just not true that the catch and shoot and score on it from the slot is easy. mike knuble wasn't good at it. he made up for it by being a beast on the rebounds, but he didn't score much in that slot spot and he got his chances. Laich isn't good there. He scores rebounds. Kozlov wasn't good there. Ward can score one there on occasion, but not with regularity.

Fehr is been in that spot many times over his career and could have solidified his career on that. He can't. Its not his game.

As long as the Caps have had Ov, Backstrom and Green that spot in the slot has been important. It keeps the pk from going all out to take away the point shots. brouwer last season has been the closest the Caps have had to money in that spot....now, we want to trade him because Fehr can do it? big mistake

Your argument that the shot from the slot isn't easy is that Mike Knuble couldn't do it? Yeah, because Knuble was always known for his wrist shot.

Fehr on the other hand, has just as good of a wrister as Brouwer IMO. It's not "any monkey can do it". You keep mentioning that Fehr has had his chances in that spot. I contend that he hasn't. He averaged 49 seconds on the PP last year.

That prompted me to look at PPG/60 numbers from last year.

Brouwer: 2.65 with Ribeiro and friends
Fehr: 3.58 with MP85, et. al

Hmmmmm.....

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

here we are back to the "any monkey could do it" point of view. facts are that while brouwer's pp role is simple, its not easy or else most caps forwards put in that position was be loading up on the ppg's.

its just not true that the catch and shoot and score on it from the slot is easy. mike knuble wasn't good at it. he made up for it by being a beast on the rebounds, but he didn't score much in that slot spot and he got his chances. Laich isn't good there. He scores rebounds. Kozlov wasn't good there. Ward can score one there on occasion, but not with regularity.

Fehr is been in that spot many times over his career and could have solidified his career on that. He can't. Its not his game.

As long as the Caps have had Ov, Backstrom and Green that spot in the slot has been important. It keeps the pk from going all out to take away the point shots. brouwer last season has been the closest the Caps have had to money in that spot....now, we want to trade him because Fehr can do it? big mistake

Do you think Brouwer's inability to show up for a playoff game was a factor in our league leading PP crapping the bed against the Rangers last spring?

 

[txpd]

That prompted me to look at PPG/60 numbers from last year.

Brouwer: 2.65 with Ribeiro and friends
Fehr: 3.58 with MP85, et. al

Hmmmmm.....

hmmm....how many ppg's did fehr score last season?

 

[txpd]

Do you think Brouwer's inability to show up for a playoff game was a factor in our league leading PP crapping the bed against the Rangers last spring?

sure. just like ov's 2 pts and backstrom's 3pts among others. green was the only one of the primary players that delivered much.

 

[Stewie G]

hmmm....how many ppg's did fehr score last season?

Your argument was that Fehr was given ample chances and did nothing with them. The only sample we have of a healthy Fehr in this system was last year. How many goals should he have scored in his 49 seconds per game?

Better yet, let's see your numbers backing up your claim that he isn't capable of producing in that spot.

 

[SimplySensational]

Adam Vingan ‏@AdamVingan 2m
Alex Urbom will make his #Caps debut tomorrow against the Hurricanes. Defensive partner TBD.

Not even sure if I can decide between Oleksy and Carrick.

 

[txpd]

Your argument was that Fehr was given ample chances and did nothing with them. The only sample we have of a healthy Fehr in this system was last year. How many goals should he have scored in his 49 seconds per game?

Better yet, let's see your numbers backing up your claim that he isn't capable of producing in that spot.

you posted the ppg/60 stat as if it said something. I asked a simple question and you don't have the strength to answer.

answer is 2 ppg's
the first was goal #6 in a 7-1 blow out of the panthers.
the second was in the last game of the season v boston after both teams playoff situation was locked in....iirc.

 

[Raikkonen]

I recall the reports about Orlov's play in Hershey wasn't much good even that season when he played 60 games for Caps.

Something along the lines that he can read the NHL game easier and play accordingly. But maybe my memory is fooling me.

EDIT: There is a factor in "KHL looming" and Orlov's preference. He himself stated that Voynov's example was important for him. And that it is too soon to leave NHL, not acceptable to forfeit the fight for the place in Caps. He stated it this past summer.

Voynov got his chance at 4th year AFAIR. I hope Dmitry will continue to work hard and get his chance. One day. In NHL

 

[Raikkonen]

OK, breaking news. Today CSKA has bought the rights for Telegin and Orlov, both from Metallurg Novokuznetsk.

Could it force George's hand a bit?

That is kinda more serious


PS: Fedorov is getting out of retirement to play in KHL. The same club, yeah. I mean, he himself (Fedorov as a GM) bought the rights for Orlov.

 

[Stewie G]

you posted the ppg/60 stat as if it said something. I asked a simple question and you don't have the strength to answer.answer is 2 ppg's
the first was goal #6 in a 7-1 blow out of the panthers.
the second was in the last game of the season v boston after both teams playoff situation was locked in....iirc.

This is quite possibly the most hypocritical sentence I've read on these forums.

Thanks for the laugh.

 

[Liberati0n*]

hmmm....how many ppg's did fehr score last season?

More than Brouwer. The stat you just read said so. Think of it as games played instead of /60. Brouwer played more games of PP time and put up more goals. Had Fehr played the same number of games the stats say he would have outscored Brouwer handily.

It's also laughable that your answer to a question about playoff performance is always to throw up their basic stat lines. Did you watch the games?

 

[brs03]

He does have a point in that rate stats aren't going to be particularly stable when you're looking at a sample of 2.

Of course, Brouwer shot 25% on the powerplay last year. That's hard to repeat for anyone in any scheme. So his numbers may not be all that meaningful either.

 

[txpd]

laughing here too. next?

 

[Liberati0n*]

He does have a point in that rate stats aren't going to be particularly stable when you're looking at a sample of 2.

Of course, Brouwer shot 25% on the powerplay last year. That's hard to repeat for anyone in any scheme. So his numbers may not be all that meaningful either.

Yeah I got a little carried away and exaggerated. He claimed Fehr had shown he can't perform in that role. The numbers clearly indicate that he's shown he can in a limited sample so far. We need to remember that Brouwer's incredible success there amounts to 7 goals. As you sort of say, it's not like he has that much more of a track record than Fehr. Anyway, txpd is just going to ignore facts placed in front of him and continue to post that Fehr has failed in that role (and that Laich and Knuble have when they never even played it).

 

[Halpysback*]

Prucha had that insane PP shooting % year with Jagr feeding him that one time. Lets drop everything and sign him because that's how it works

Do you even know what you're contrarianizing against anymore?

 

[Hivemind]

here we are back to the "any monkey could do it" point of view. facts are that while brouwer's pp role is simple, its not easy or else most caps forwards put in that position was be loading up on the ppg's.

its just not true that the catch and shoot and score on it from the slot is easy. mike knuble wasn't good at it. he made up for it by being a beast on the rebounds, but he didn't score much in that slot spot and he got his chances. Laich isn't good there. He scores rebounds. Kozlov wasn't good there. Ward can score one there on occasion, but not with regularity.

Fehr is been in that spot many times over his career and could have solidified his career on that. He can't. Its not his game.

As long as the Caps have had Ov, Backstrom and Green that spot in the slot has been important. It keeps the pk from going all out to take away the point shots. brouwer last season has been the closest the Caps have had to money in that spot....now, we want to trade him because Fehr can do it? big mistake

What are you even talking about? Knuble? Fehr's got chances there multiple times over his career? What?

Boudreau used the 1-3-1 for a brief moment shortly before he was fired, and Ovechkin was manning the slot while he did it. Otherwise, prior to Oates, we haven't had a "slot spot" on the powerplay for Knuble or Fehr to get chances in. Knuble (and Laich, not Fehr) played the net-front presence in an overload system, which is very different from the slot position we have now. This particular 1-3-1 adaptation of the powerplay is an Oates invention.

Joel Ward saw one game on the top powerplay unit last year (game #1 when Brouwer didn't play). He scored a powerplay goal. Otherwise, Ward and Fehr where playing reduced minutes on the second unit. You can't say their lack of production there would mean they're guaranteed a lack of production on the top unit.

 

[Liberati0n*]

What are you even talking about? Knuble? Fehr's got chances there multiple times over his career? What?

Boudreau used the 1-3-1 for a brief moment shortly before he was fired, and Ovechkin was manning the slot while he did it. Otherwise, prior to Oates, we haven't had a "slot spot" on the powerplay for Knuble or Fehr to get chances in. Knuble (and Laich, not Fehr) played the net-front presence in an overload system, which is very different from the slot position we have now. This particular 1-3-1 adaptation of the powerplay is an Oates invention.

He has been corrected about this multiple times and continues to repeat it. I don't even know what to say.

Joel Ward saw one game on the top powerplay unit last year (game #1 when Brouwer didn't play). He scored a powerplay goal. Otherwise, Ward and Fehr where playing reduced minutes on the second unit. You can't say their lack of production there would mean they're guaranteed a lack of production on the top unit.

Except Fehr hasn't lacked production there.

 

[Jasper17]

OK, breaking news. Today CSKA has bought the rights for Telegin and Orlov, both from Metallurg Novokuznetsk.

Could it force George's hand a bit?

That is kinda more serious


PS: Fedorov is getting out of retirement to play in KHL. The same club, yeah. I mean, he himself (Fedorov as a GM) bought the rights for Orlov.

I am not sure this really changes anything to be honest. Orlov is a free agent after this season and free to sign anywhere he wants. If he isn't going to play in the NHL he was always going to look at what deal he can get in the KHL. Quite frankly he would be stupid if he didn't.

If the Caps want to keep this kid they are going to have to prove to him he is in their future plans. The easiest way to do that is to get him in the lineup. But I don't think this move really changes the situation much.

 

[SimplySensational]

Fedorov for LD.

 

[Raikkonen]

If the Caps want to keep this kid they are going to have to prove to him he is in their future plans. The easiest way to do that is to get him in the lineup. But I don't think this move really changes the situation much.

While it wasn't so certain about him and his hometown team for the next year now it's 100% clear he has a good offer on the table (almost tomorrow) from CSKA.

Not giving the chance for Orlov could lead to Kuz taking notes of it. George could panic a bit and trade Orlov or just force Oates to slot him at whatever slot (even 3RD) to see if it's worth to keep Orlov high on the prospect list. It's the only logical way.

If it wasn't for CSKA, I think, GMGM could try to sell something stupid to Orlov without getting him into lineup.

While I like Orlov (and even got into conversation with him last spring in Boston) it could be really that he just isn't good enough. I would like to know it for certain though Because if it's all about waiver exempt and hand-preference - it is BS.

 

[Liberati0n*]

What I don't like about the Orlov situation is the inconsistency in the staff's approach to different players. Oates says he sees potential in Urbom and wants to work with him. He says he believes their job is to grow players' games. With Orlov the attitude seems more like "put up or shut up." Oates showed his ego and temperamental attitude as a player, and while different circumstances bring out different things in people, those things are still there. I have to wonder if he has some problem with Orlov beyond his play on the ice. (Another explanation along those lines obviously would be that Orlov has an attitude problem or something like that, but there's no evidence for that.)

 

[RandyHolt]

I call bunk he just isn't good enough. If true, they should try him at forward. And GM is not a good judge of talent, and shouldn't draft guys with concussion history so frequently.

He is an offensive minded D and they require a GM and coach with the willingness to live with them leading the league in turnovers for a few years.

He appears to have fallen out of favor. I bet he hates being shifted to LD. Cursed when Oates had Calle told him. Banned. Ask him Raik if you see him again. In Russian of course. All I know is that being shifted to LD coincides with him not being in our lineup.

While the concussion has possibly slowed him, I cant remember the last time a concussion made a prospect drop off the chart. If that has made him change his game and he is gun shy now, that sucks. I think we can gauge it by hits in Hershey.

Is he hitting in Hershey like he had in previous stints pre concussion?

 

[HTFN]

I call bunk he just isn't good enough. If true, they should try him at forward. And GM is not a good judge of talent, and shouldn't draft guys with concussion history so frequently.

He is an offensive minded D and they require a GM and coach with the willingness to live with them leading the league in turnovers for a few years.

He appears to have fallen out of favor. I bet he hates being shifted to LD. Cursed when Oates had Calle told him. Banned. Ask him Raik if you see him again. In Russian of course. All I know is that being shifted to LD coincides with him not being in our lineup.

While the concussion has possibly slowed him, I cant remember the last time a concussion made a prospect drop off the chart. If that has made him change his game and he is gun shy now, that sucks. I think we can gauge it by hits in Hershey.

Is he hitting in Hershey like he had in previous stints pre concussion?

Can't speak to Hershey, but he didn't look like anything changed in the preseason. Found at least two or three good times to step up at the blue line per game.