Speculation: Acq/ Rost. Bldg./ Cap Part XXIII: The Return of Michael Jordan

[RandyHolt]

Thanks HT

So let's presume he still wants to hit. If he had lingering effects that is where I would think it would be easy to see. What happened to all of his promise?

I am sure he was miffed to not get a game against Boston. But he was far from alone ignored for much of the series. Then came the move I think caused it all. Shifting to LD. Until I hear a better answer, I may stick to it. Just like Alzner struggled at RD, Orlov is at LD. Hillen was brought in. Schmiddy. Urbom. Icing is Oleksy moved to LD for a game. Boom. He may have simply lost all confidence since the team shows him none.

Maybe just maybe, where a guy played his entire career > handedness. Lets see how Erat does at LW. So far, its not so good.

The KHL still believes in him, good move by them. I bet they stick him at RD and he does just fine.

 

[HTFN]

He looked like a young, nearly 30 point defenseman the year he played, with tons of room for improvement. Maybe he's one of my points of bias, but there's no reason not to play him, even on his apparent off side. Kid looked tougher to play against than half the defensive corps anyway. Damn sure tougher to play against than Carrick, and I like the kid.

 

[RandyHolt]

Usually a position of little organizational depth, RD has become crowded. Kundratek, Oleksy, Carrick are lined up behind Green and Carlson. Suppose Orlov is on track, all is good. Does anyone see him PP time within the next three years, ahead of Green and Carlson? I don't. PP2 with Fehr in mop up duty is no way to develop his offensive game.

So even moving him back to RD doesn't look promising.

Our teams gaping hole is at all situation LD. He may be our best hope to fill that internally and thus George is desperate for him to work and its not, but George and Oates don't want to give up.

I just get the sense we are fumbling another guys development. We dont want to get older, e.g. Carrick, Urbom etc. I don't know.

On a random note I saw Brooks today at a parking meter in Georgetown looking a bit perplexed. Its a sign. He scores next game.

 

[HTFN]

Usually a position of little organizational depth, RD has become crowded. Kundratek, Oleksy, Carrick are lined up behind Green and Carlson. Suppose Orlov is on track, all is good. Does anyone see him PP time within the next three years, ahead of Green and Carlson? I don't. PP2 with Fehr in mop up duty is no way to develop his offensive game.

So even moving him back to RD doesn't look promising.

Our teams gaping hole is at all situation LD. He may be our best hope to fill that internally and thus George is desperate for him to work and its not, but George and Oates don't want to give up.

I just get the sense we are fumbling another guys development. We dont want to get older, e.g. Carrick, Urbom etc. I don't know.

On a random note I saw Brooks today at a parking meter in Georgetown looking a bit perplexed. Its a sign. He scores next game.

I guess when he's on the ice isn't the only time he can't find loose change.

 

[Jasper17]

While it wasn't so certain about him and his hometown team for the next year now it's 100% clear he has a good offer on the table (almost tomorrow) from CSKA.

Well I doubt they will try to steal him while he is under contract with the Caps. Even if he is not in the NHL he still has a contract with the Caps.

I call bunk he just isn't good enough. If true, they should try him at forward. And GM is not a good judge of talent, and shouldn't draft guys with concussion history so frequently.

He is an offensive minded D and they require a GM and coach with the willingness to live with them leading the league in turnovers for a few years.

He appears to have fallen out of favor. I bet he hates being shifted to LD. Cursed when Oates had Calle told him. Banned. Ask him Raik if you see him again. In Russian of course. All I know is that being shifted to LD coincides with him not being in our lineup. QUOTE]

First, if the kid can't switch from the right to the left side on D. How the hell is he going to switch from D to forward. I hate to say it but that is a terrible idea.

Second, he has clearly fallen out of favor. But I think Connor Carrick proves that the Caps are more than willing to play a young player and let him grow and learn from mistakes if he earns it. Orlov clearly has not earned it for whatever reason.

 

[RandyHolt]

Sometimes players just end up in the doghouse. He could have told George to **** off for all we know. You say he is not good. We dont know anything other than what we see on the ice. I have not seen any struggles from Orlov. Have you?

But don't fool yourself, playing forward is easy compared to playing defense.

I am wondering if its a good idea to go ahead and scratch Erat so he can request his trade, and we can move on. Or is it unfathomable that he could be included in a deal for a 2LD.

 

[Jasper17]

Sometimes players just end up in the doghouse. He could have told George to **** off for all we know. You say he is not good. We dont know anything other than what we see on the ice. I have not seen any struggles from Orlov. Have you? .

Yes, he did not look that great in training camp and from what I understand he has not exactly dominated in Hershey. Carrick and Hillen both looked better in training camp.

But don't fool yourself, playing forward is easy compared to playing defense.

This is a joke. If you really think this is true you know nothing about hockey. So unless Orlov has some secret forward experience I am not aware of. He has no chance of making it as a forward at the KHL, AHL or NHL level.

I am wondering if its a good idea to go ahead and scratch Erat so he can request his trade, and we can move on. Or is it unfathomable that he could be included in a deal for a 2LD.

That would be a terrible idea. Erat is a much better player than Volpatti or any LW in Hershey. Even if he is only getting 10 minutes a night. He is giving us much more in those 10 minutes than anyone else could. Or at the very least hurting us less than anyone else would.

 

[BobRouse]

I dont see Erskine as being physically injured, however he may be mentally injured. He may be shouldering too much responsibility, and its impacting his ability to do what he does best (hit and jam opponents). He seems to be thinking too much out there, from where I sit.

I agree with the rest of your post as well. We are not aggressive enough to win with the talent we have. We are not talented enough to play a non-aggressive style. We are cauight in the middle here, as while I think Oates style of play could win big in the league, they are trying to pigeon-hole far too many players into roles that they cant handle.

Laich, Fehr, Erat, Erskine are 4 major ones, just off the top of my head. When you field a squad of 18 skaters every night, having more than 20% of them misplaced will not lead to victory often. We win on pur offensive guile from Ovechkin, thats about it.

Good points about the bolded and good way to put it. The 2010 WAS talented enough to win like that. This years team (and pretty much all teams we had since) are somewhere in the middle it seems despite trying to shift more and more to a balanced team.

Personally I still like the approach and we are getting more physical. But it will take more time to let that develop. The question is if our window is shrinking rapidly or not?

I will say this RE: Misplaced players. Last year we were all up in arms about Ovie being switched to the right side and then being forced to play with Crab and Beagle. In the end it worked out amazingly for him. Perhaps there is a method to Oates' madness? Perhaps he is trying to extract an extra gear from Erat and the other guys?

Oates is a sharp guy and at this point deserves the benefit of the doubt.

Urbom is starting tonight so maybe he will suprise us.

I love Erskine but the way he has looked in these 3 games (and the last 4 in the Rags series) I'm not so sure he's even a great 3LD at this point to be honest. Now it is only 3 games and he was coming off a knee injury but at his age I'm not sure he can get back to the point he was at least year prior to the Callahan hit in game 3.

All that being said ...we aren't going to win very many games if our #1 goalie has a 85 sv pctg. Holtby is a slow starter so things will get better. Also our players outside of Grabo and Ovie are having some tough luck shooting percentage wise and I expect that to normalize as well.

No need to panic just yet. We have some young D Orlov/Urbom/Carrick who will get better as the season matures as will guys like Latta and Wilson.

 

[Ridley Simon]

I don't disagree with you re: Oates. However, Ovechkin is a generational talent. Top 2 or 3 of his era. So what he can do (switching positions, etc), really should not be used as a marker for what everyone else can do.

Playing sports has a LOT to do with confidence, even the greatest players needs it. Playing a new role, at a later stage in your career, is just not something you will be internally confident about. I don't care what they say, they won't be.

Oates needs to let the players play his system, at their old positions, and we can fill with what we have left. His systems seems to be a challenges as it is (both Laich and Erat are still new at it, remember), so to add a position change on top of it is asinine.

Again, this is just all from where I sit.

And yeah, Holtby will play better. He has too.

 

[Raikkonen]

By the way, I don't have complaints about Green's game in first 3. If only he could play with Urbom maybe?

That would be even better -> Alzner-Carlson as shutdown pair.

I believe Green is aiming for team Canada spot and this time it's not in "I don't know what to do to impress Yzerman" fashion. He's just doing what he can do better than most. Moving the puck, passing and shooting. No experiments, no brickwall-like pretending.

No complaints, again. Backstrom looks good also, would be nice to see more shots.

 

[BobRouse]

I don't disagree with you re: Oates. However, Ovechkin is a generational talent. Top 2 or 3 of his era. So what he can do (switching positions, etc), really should not be used as a marker for what everyone else can do.

Playing sports has a LOT to do with confidence, even the greatest players needs it. Playing a new role, at a later stage in your career, is just not something you will be internally confident about. I don't care what they say, they won't be.

Oates needs to let the players play his system, at their old positions, and we can fill with what we have left. His systems seems to be a challenges as it is (both Laich and Erat are still new at it, remember), so to add a position change on top of it is asinine.

Again, this is just all from where I sit.

And yeah, Holtby will play better. He has too.

Well Ovechkin did credit Oates with believing in him. "Coach have trust in you is important" or something. He mentioned Hunter had trust and confidence in other guys but Oates believed in him..even at the begining of the year when the whole Hockey world was laughing at Ovie and suggesting the Caps should buy him out.

I don't agree with Fehr at Center. Shifting from one wing to another is one thing but to put a forward on D or a winger to Center is much harder.

I see what Oates and GMGM are trying to do. They are trying to get our best players on the ice anyway they can. Will it work? I don't think we have the luxury of time to find out and stick with it if our 3rd line continues to suck like it has.

I agree Holtby will play better. And if not I feel confident that Neuvirth will so not too worried about the goaltending just yet.

The D is another matter entirely despite how well Alzner/Carlson/(and to an extent) Green have started.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Jokinen off to a good start in Pittsburgh.

 

[Ajax1995]

Jokinen off to a good start in Pittsburgh.

Not as good as Hertl, the guy picked right after Wilson, in San Jose. Another McPhee fail...

 

[Burakovsky95*]

I really wish we could get a fresh start at GM. If Leonsis had really any type of actual knowledge about sports we probably would have 3 years ago.

 

[Hivemind]

Not as good as Hertl, the guy picked right after Wilson, in San Jose. Another McPhee fail...

Really can't tell if this is supposed to be sarcastic. Hertl was the 17th pick. Plenty of teams passed on him. It's a two game sample size less than 18 months removed from the draft.

 

[BobRouse]

Really can't tell if this is supposed to be sarcastic. Hertl was the 17th pick. Plenty of teams passed on him. It's a two game sample size less than 18 months removed from the draft.

Pretty sure that was sarcastic as a response to the "we could have had Jokinen!" crowd...

I'll reiterate...Jokinen sucks. He got benched in the playoffs for Pitt for good reason. He is a better version of Wolski.

People can hate on the Erat trade but to bring up Jokinen as a viable alternative GMGM should have went after does not paint them in a good light.

Oh also did I mention that Jokinen sucks and is buttery soft? He did so well with Carolina (one of the worst teams in the league last year) that they just salary dumped his arse.

 

[Ajax1995]

Pretty sure that was sarcastic as a response to the "we could have had Jokinen!" crowd...

We have a winner folks!

 

[Halpysback*]

I'll reiterate...Jokinen sucks. He got benched in the playoffs for Pitt for good reason. He is a better version of Wolski.

People can hate on the Erat trade but to bring up Jokinen as a viable alternative GMGM should have went after does not paint them in a good light.
.

Jokinen was free and Jokinen had half the cap hit of Erat. He had some good years in Carolina and a history of clutch play. The year he was having when Carolina gave him away was no worse than the year Erat was having when we gave up a guy we drafted 11th overall less than a year prior.

He was absolutely a viable alternative to Erat given that all we were looking for was a short term LW push/Laich replacement, since it's clear as day that it was a panic trade and nothing more. I would rather have Jokinen and Forsberg than Erat and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. And I would take Jokinen over Erat straight up if all you're gonna do is play them on the 4th line, since one is a lot cheaper than the other and the impact on the ice is the same. You're simply on the wrong side of the argument here just like you were on the Grabovski and Erskine.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Jokinen was free and Jokinen had half the cap hit of Erat. He had some good years in Carolina and a history of clutch play. The year he was having when Carolina gave him away was no worse than the year Erat was having when we gave up a guy we drafted 11th overall less than a year prior.

He was absolutely a viable alternative to Erat given that all we were looking for was a short term LW push/Laich replacement, since it's clear as day that it was a panic trade and nothing more. I would rather have Jokinen and Forsberg than Erat and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. And I would take Jokinen over Erat straight up if all you're gonna do is play them on the 4th line, since one is a lot cheaper than the other and the impact on the ice is the same. You're simply on the wrong side of the argument here just like you were on the Grabovski and Erskine.

Thanks for saving me the trouble of typing that up. The best thing about Jokinen is that when he sucks, you can just waive him. You don't have that luxury with Erat. Instead you give him 6 minutes a night on the 4th line and have him telling reporters that he's considering asking for a trade.

 

[Ajax1995]

So that is it then? The final verdict on the Erat trade has been returned? I mean I don't know but with basically 2 seasons on his contract and what he has already shown in his NHL career I think we are going to see more from him.

And I wouldn't have made the deal to begin with but I have no problem saying that it is likely going to take a lot more time before we really know how it plays out.

 

[BobRouse]

Jokinen was free and Jokinen had half the cap hit of Erat. He had some good years in Carolina and a history of clutch play. The year he was having when Carolina gave him away was no worse than the year Erat was having when we gave up a guy we drafted 11th overall less than a year prior.

He was absolutely a viable alternative to Erat given that all we were looking for was a short term LW push/Laich replacement, since it's clear as day that it was a panic trade and nothing more. I would rather have Jokinen and Forsberg than Erat and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. And I would take Jokinen over Erat straight up if all you're gonna do is play them on the 4th line, since one is a lot cheaper than the other and the impact on the ice is the same. You're simply on the wrong side of the argument here just like you were on the Grabovski and Erskine.

Oh my...there is little hope for you my friend.

If what Jussi had to offer was so good I wonder why so many teams just chuck him to the scrap heap? They see what I see. He's not a competitor and fades when the light shines on him.

Pitt did much better when they inserted Tyler Kennedy (a vastly underrated player ala Matt Cooke) in their lineup in the playoffs last year. Jokinen started the playoffs but quickly found himself in the pressbox for reasons NOT due to injury.

Look I admit when I make mistakes and am wrong. But some people (check the mirror) are so hell bent into their view that they lose all perspective on the situation. (notice how Laich and Brouwer are struggling a bit...difference between Grabs and Ribs...Ribs involves his linemates. I have yet to see Grabo do that altho he does give supreme effort)

I would not take Jussi Jokinen for FREE. Meaning ZERO cap hit or assets required. The guy is flat out a waste of a roster spot. Just like Wolski he'll score a goal here and there when given a chance and does really really good in shootouts. Everything else about him sucks.

 

[Halpysback*]

I can't believe we made up our minds on the final verdict on Jeff Schultz. HE HAD ANOTHER WHOLE YEAR ON HIS CONTRACT!!!

 

[Hivemind]

McPhee does nothing but dumpster dive! RABBLE RABBLE RABLLE

McPhee should have dumpster dove instead of the move he made! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

So that is it then? The final verdict on the Erat trade has been returned? I mean I don't know but with basically 2 seasons on his contract and what he has already shown in his NHL career I think we are going to see more from him.

And I wouldn't have made the deal to begin with but I have no problem saying that it is likely going to take a lot more time before we really know how it plays out.

Note to self. We shouldn't have an ongoing discussion about Caps moves. Let's check in on this one after the Forsberg/Latta retirements.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

McPhee does nothing but dumpster dive! RABBLE RABBLE RABLLE

McPhee should have dumpster dove instead of the move he made! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE

Alternatively. Don't make stupid moves. Make smart ones.