Post-Game Talk: A goal! Baby steps. 3-1 Wings

[Menzinger]

If you recall....Marner /Bozak, Nylander and a few others found their game playing with so called 4th liners....when they left the line their games struggled again.

The real problem is coaching and the lack of trust of coaching....anyone who ever played the game would recognize such...i see you didn't, not surprising.

Some players can react well to that type of situation, others don’t.

But point is, it’s not surprising to see a drop in production of a player if you strip their icetime down to 8-10 min a game.

I’ve played hockey too: let’s not try to fall back on that excuse to win an argument.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

Though Pookie, let’s also not ignore the fact there were reason to bring in Boyle beyond “experience “, namely the 4C position was a problem for the team all season.

I don’t really think a rebuilding to should ever be trading 2nd rounders for expiring UFA’s. Especially ones that are 1 season removed from a last place finish.

 

[Menzinger]

I don’t really think a rebuilding to should ever be trading 2nd rounders for expiring UFA’s. Especially ones that are 1 season removed from a last place finish.

I agree it remains a questionable decision.

But from management POV, the 4C position was a problem, and the team was heading to the playoffs. So while debatable there’s at least a logic behind it.

 

[Muston Atthews]

You are right.

He taught them how to win and they got all that "experience" last year. No sense talking about it.

Makes this thread odd though. All this criticism and here they have all this experience and learned how to be professional and all that.

Damn you drive narratives better than NASCAR drivers drive their cars. Do you still hold a grudge on that kid from 10th grade who you lent 5 dollars to that never paid you back?

 

[weems]

Kapanen better play next game.
If not, thats a terrible message to be sent. Even if you play great, were probaly the best forward, next game you're back to the pressbox.
We really wont know forsure what we have with either Kapanen or Leivo until we give them a nice consistent sample size of games playing with suitable linemates.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Kapanen better play next game.
If not, thats a terrible message to be sent. Even if you play great, were probaly the best forward, next game you're back to the pressbox.
We really wont know forsure what we have with either Kapanen or Leivo until we give them a nice consistent sample size of games playing with suitable linemates.

Just wait until Matthews comes back and NEITHER play.

 

[Mr Hockey]

Kapanen is a Marlie, Levio is our #13 guy... sorry if that hurts and causes anxiety. lol

 

[weems]

Kapanen is a Marlie, Levio is our #13 guy... sorry if that hurts and causes anxiety. lol

Why is Kapanen a Marlie?

He's clearly a better player than a few our of forwards.

 

[Blanche Blanche]

Why is Kapanen a Marlie?

He's clearly a better player than a few our of forwards.

Yeah, either the guys were all tired and Kappy had the freshest legs, or he really was the breath of fresh air out there tonight aka the only guy not affected by babs.

Bit of both is most likely.

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

So you think that the way to get a guy out of a slump and might be havin confidence issues is to play him less? No you show confidence in him and keep playing him

And you put another guy who is doing well down? What about Nylander playing 13 mins?

 

[Muston Atthews]

Why is Kapanen a Marlie?

He's clearly a better player than a few our of forwards.

Because that’s what coach says and coach says no wrong

 

[weems]

Yeah, either the guys were all tired and Kappy had the freshest legs, or he really was the breath of fresh air out there tonight aka the only guy not affected by babs.

Bit of both is most likely.

He's played pretty good when given the oppurtunities especially considering his linemates.

 

[IPS]

Just wait until Matthews comes back and NEITHER play.

yeah, and we put together Hyman-Matthews-Brown with Nylander on the 4th line.

I will bet every red cent I have that's what's happening.

 

[firstemperor]

All this "good pro", "play the right way" stuff is starting to remind me of the Raptors and Dwayne Casey with the "pound the rock" nonsense. Eventually, it was abandoned altogether. You either evolve and be the innovator or you fall back into mediocrity, there is nothing productive coming from overplaying old, pending UFA's. Such a completely archaic mindset, shame on me for being optimistic because Dubas seemingly favors the opposite extreme, too bad he doesn't coach the team.

For the record, I think Babcock is an excellent coach, particularly developing players and getting them to learn the right habits, etc. But some of his lineup choices are absolutely baffling. Different guys have different expectations? Sure, I can live with dangling Marner/Nylander to prove their worth before they get their next contract, but certain guys on this team don't even deserve a third of their usage/leash.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

A lot of people are overreacting. Teams go through bad stretches and I rather ours now than late into the season. The team will still make the playoffs and will go on another win streak at some point in the season

Going through a bad stretch is completely fine. Going through a bad stretch and having the coach refuse to try anything new or even admit there is a problem is why people are complaining. Our bad stretch has also been over 20 games at this point and was largely brought on by babcock's strategy

 

[Myopic]

The Leafs were playing their fifth game in seven nights.

Second night of a back-to-back.

Backup goalie.

No Matthews.

Chill the f out.

 

[Muston Atthews]

The Maple Leafs are playing their fifth game in seven nights.

Second night of back-to-back.

Backup goalie.

No Matthews.

Chill the f out.

They’ve played like this since the first of five games in seven nights

 

[MR4]

Why is Kapanen a Marlie?

He's clearly a better player than a few our of forwards.

Because mgmt was dumb enough to keep Bozak & Komarov this seaaon

 

[Brownbeard]

Another bad game where we were outplayed, and by an inferior team. A team 'we' should've beat. This loss wouldn't have hurt so much if it wasn't the third in a row, and if the team had looked to have learned from its mistakes in its past four plus games.

They're still off, taking periods off, playing from behind, chasing the game and playing sloppily. It's hard to watch and frustrating. These trends have been there all season, but have been most prominent this last week plus.

Kapanen needs to stay. He is better than Leivo, and brings a spark the team needs. Carrick also needs to get another shot. But this team should get another defender so long as it won't hurt them too much in terms of what the cost would be.

Can't blame McElhinney tonight. The team sucked in front of him for the second and first half of the third. Even then, they still had a hard time hitting the net (a trend through these games, with so many missed attempts) or sustain pressure. Larkin beat us. As did those awfully stupid penalties by Martin, Bozak.

And now we're 5th in the East, with everybody else having games in hand. The Bruins have five.

Blech

Komarov has been okay defensively, but he's not the same player he was when he first came here. I loved him then. Outside of his defense at times, he's not had a good year.

Martin has looked a lot better than last year AT TIMES, but has been mostly invisible lately.

Bozak's had an awful year.

 

[firstemperor]

Komarov has been okay defensively, but he's not the same player he was when he first came here. I loved him then. Outside of his defense at times, he's not had a good year.

Martin has looked a lot better than last year AT TIMES, but has been mostly invisible lately.

Bozak's had an awful year.

My thoughts on this:

I think Bozak is a decent hockey player, he has good vision and his short passes are solid. The issue with him is he's weak defensively and in any type of loose puck battles, 1 on 1 battles, on the cycle (and hes not a great finisher) so his problems get magnified. He's one of the worst possession/defensive players up the middle in the entire league (and I believe stats like CA/60 verify this over some large sample size). With how tight, chippy the game has gotten recently, you can't be as one-dimensional of a player he is these days and get away with it....particularly when your playing a role as important as center.

Komarov is somewhat of the polar opposite. He's strong defensively- particularly covering the points but his hockey skills have declined from mediocre->terrible. I do think the standards of today's game have risen (Subban has actually come out recently and flat out said the league is the most competitive, skilled it's ever been recently) but he's one of those players that can't drive possession the other way.....even worst, plays die on his stick, and he can't generate a solid SOG- let alone a scoring chance.

Martin provides some solid things, the expectations on him may be higher in today's game where the utility of a guy that drops the mitts is lower than ever before. His hockey skills are not great, he also suffers from the same issue that Polak does- being a bigger body, his initial few strides are poor enough that he fails to create any type of seperation or close the gap defensively on anyone with effectiveness. To me, Martin and Hyman are two of the biggest reasons we are so weak defensively in the neutral zone at ES.....both look for the home-run pass more than anyone, and while I acknowledge that may be a necessity for the breakout, those aren't the personnel you want collecting the puck anyways. I mean, genuinely, if I tracked stats from the eye-test on how many times I've seen Hyman or Martin get thrown a long stretch pass and do absolutely nothing with it, it wouldn't be a favourable stat for the Leafs. Compare this to a legitimately strong team, say Tampa (might be personnel)...it's virtually night and day.

If anything, it should be someone else looking for that stretch pass, though it's difficult for me to tell if it's a systemic or personnel issue- given Nylander and Marner are regularly the point-men on the breakout.

 

[stickty111]

Dangle was saying is it actually possible the sports science team is telling Babcock to play certain guys more for now.
Look Babs has his toys, and we know who they are. However is Babcock really this dumb with the ice time? Is he really? Look we know he makes wierd decisions at times but he is literally coaching like an ECHL coach right now. Babcock cant be this dumb. Can he? Its hard to believe he is.

Dangle also mentioned they have to be doing this on purpose(as in their style of play) right?

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

They’ve played like this since the first of five games in seven nights

That's obviously because they were rusty

 

[Nooodles]

Someone please explain what the hell is going on. Babcock killed the team, but why?

 

[Nithoniniel]

When we needed a push, Babcock decided to give Kapanen extra shifts at the expense of... Nylander.

I've been a huge fan of Babs, but I don't know how you don't criticize him for his decisions lately.

 

[Joedoggy]

Some players can react well to that type of situation, others don’t.

But point is, it’s not surprising to see a drop in production of a player if you strip their icetime down to 8-10 min a game.

I’ve played hockey too: let’s not try to fall back on that excuse to win an argument.

Exactly my point, you constantly dink 4th line players because of production yet now admits like manna from heaven 8-10 mins a game ....makes point production a tough go!

And you may have played hockey with mini sticks and all.....My references to playing are of a being "Paid to play" variety.
You have never been paid to play...your posts would suggest such if you did...sorry i do not see a Paid player in your postings.