2015 NHL redraft

[22FUTON9]

Yeah no matter how leafs fan shape it Barzals just a level above Marner (for that matter rantanen as well) I just think there's no way around it. We'll have to wait for next year and see if Barzal regresses if Tavares leaves but he just looks like a franchise player everytime I watch him. Just stands out so much

 

[sabremike]

This is what I think about Barzal: I think Jack Eichel is the most criminally and ridiculously underrated player in the entire sport. He is close to a PPG player for the team offense forgot, and is dismissed because he is stuck on a team that except drafting Casey has done nothing but make gigantic mistake after gigantic mistake resulting in an embarrassing car wreck of a roster. Eichel is the real deal and if he ever gets to play with something resembling a passable NHL roster he will carry us. That said, if you want to say Barzal is better while I would significantly disagree I wouldn't say that opinion is completely insane.

 

[The Burdened]

And Provorov over Barzal and Rantanen

because #1 D > Winger

Provorov & Werenski both go ahead of Rantanen in a re-draft.

IMO it would go:

McDavid
Eichel
Barzal
Provorov
Boeser (could easily go #2 in a re-draft if he turns into a perrenial Rocket contender)
Werenski
Rantanen
Marner
Aho
Connor

then Hanifin, Konecny, DeBrusk etc

 

[Dialamo]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

 

[sabremike]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

Well at least the hockey Gods gave you Nico as a make good.

 

[Bobby Orr's Knees]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

It's amazing that the Devils passed on several franchise talents to pick Zacha. But you got Nico. He's special. So my heart isn't bleeding too much. I thought the Devils looked like a soon-to-be scary team in their series against the Bolts.

 

[CBJx614]

Sounds like Werenski might have possibly torn his rotator cuff back in game #14


And he still was tied for 2nd in goals for a Dman. I don't think 20-25+ is out of the question for him sometime in his career.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

I wonder how many Canes fans would pick Hanifin over Aho.

I would

 

[BlueBaron]

Yeah no matter how leafs fan shape it Barzals just a level above Marner (for that matter rantanen as well) I just think there's no way around it. We'll have to wait for next year and see if Barzal regresses if Tavares leaves but he just looks like a franchise player everytime I watch him. Just stands out so much

You might be right.

These things get very hard to measure for me though when you factor in team systems and match ups. Barzal without Taveres would obviously be dealing with tougher competition game in and game out. He could very well rise to the occasion.

You could also ask the question how much is offensive production affected by the Islanders system. They seem to pay no attention to D and want to trade scoring chances. How many players would see a bump in their numbers in that system?

Barzal looks like a good one though, I'm really not sure which of the two has the higher offensive ceiling, but Barzal does play C which suggests he is doing a harder job, but also in a position more prone to points.

 

[BlueBaron]

What am I supposed to say to this? "Oh yeah well Matthews would be a third liner on the Islanders! Na na na boo boo!"

Had the Leafs taken Barzal instead of Marner in 2015, or even made the trade with Edmonton for 16th overall to add Marner & Barzal, Barzal would be a massive focal point of your offense and get plenty of "opportunities". He'd be a focal point of the offense for any team that traded for that 16th overall to draft him, zero doubt in my mind.

But hey, if you want to smugly claim he'd be a 4th liner on Toronto cause Kadri & Bozak would hold him back, feel free too.

And if you want to hallucinate things people say and then rebut them to yourself I guess that's your right to.

He was not saying he'd be our 4rth line C, he's saying he would get less ice time. The guy you quoted actually used ice time as the basis of his argument. Our forward group gets it's minutes pretty evenly spread around, that was his point. Your fictional account was amusing though so I'm going to try:

"If you're saying Barzal is the best player in the league I have to tell you he is not. Na na na boo boo!"

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I would

I wouldn't. I would pick Aho > Hanifin given what I know right now. That said, it's not a slam dunk and I wouldn't complain if someone felt the other way around.

IMO, Aho is the best player on the Canes right now, and still has lots of room to grow. He's 20 years old in his 2nd season in the NHL (and on NA ice) and this season, his point total is the best a Canes player has had since Eric Staal's 70 points in 11/12. His 29 goals is also 3rd best behind Skinner's two 30+ goal seasons over that same stretch. When you take into account the complete player he is, with his incredible hockey sense and the chance that he plays center going forward, to me it's Aho > Hanifin.

 

[VainGretzky]

FORWARDS
McDavid
Marner
Eichel
Barzal
Boeser
Aho
Rantanen
Connor
Debrusk
Strome
Konency
Malgin

Defence
Chabot
Provorov
Werenski
Hanifin
Dunn
Nutivaara

 

[Estlin]

FORWARDS
McDavid
Marner
Eichel
Barzal
Boeser
Aho
Rantanen
Connor
Debrusk
Strome
Konency
Malgin

Defence
Chabot
Provorov
Werenski
Hanifin
Dunn
Nutivaara

Brandon Carlo should be in the defense category, and he's better than a few of the ones listed.

 

[izzy]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

at least he isnt a complete bust though

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Barzal would have never gotten that ice-time or opportunities trust me.

Barzal finished 10th in the entire NHL in P/60 at 3.50. He would not need that much on ice opportunities.

 

[LeafFever]

Barzal finished 10th in the entire NHL in P/60 at 3.50. He would not need that much on ice opportunities.

But he did in fact get a lot of ice-time.The coach on the Leafs never hands ice-time to any young player.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

But he did in fact get a lot of ice-time.The coach on the Leafs never hands ice-time to any young player.

I think you missed my post. Barzal is number 10 in the entire NHL in P/60 regardless of how many mins he played.

 

[mja]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

 

[mja]

But he did in fact get a lot of ice-time.The coach on the Leafs never hands ice-time to any young player.

I think you missed my post. Barzal is number 10 in the entire NHL in P/60 regardless of how many mins he played.

Never mind that Barzal gets less ice-time than Matthews and Marner only gets a minute less than Barzal.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

I wouldn't. I would pick Aho > Hanifin given what I know right now. That said, it's not a slam dunk and I wouldn't complain if someone felt the other way around.

IMO, Aho is the best player on the Canes right now, and still has lots of room to grow. He's 20 years old in his 2nd season in the NHL (and on NA ice) and this season, his point total is the best a Canes player has had since Eric Staal's 70 points in 11/12. His 29 goals is also 3rd best behind Skinner's two 30+ goal seasons over that same stretch. When you take into account the complete player he is, with his incredible hockey sense and the chance that he plays center going forward, to me it's Aho > Hanifin.

I was in agreement until the last sentence. I think aho will likely be a winger long term. And even if he is the more talented, Hanifin has 1D potential and that is more valuable than any forward minus a franchise center (which Aho is not- again in my opinion)

Regardless, I’m pumped we have both

 

[SI90]

Hey everyone! How about that Pavel Zacha guy?

*cries*

There’s always rounds 2-7 for him to slot into.

 

[LeafFever]

Yeah no matter how leafs fan shape it Barzals just a level above Marner (for that matter rantanen as well) I just think there's no way around it. We'll have to wait for next year and see if Barzal regresses if Tavares leaves but he just looks like a franchise player everytime I watch him. Just stands out so much

He's really not and neither is Rantanen.
What did Leaf fans tell all of you early in the season and no one listened when there were threads asking if Marner is the nextt Yakupov? Leaf fans stated he needs more TOI and better linemates and you'll see what he can do. The second that occurs Marner was easily as good if not better than Barzal and Rantenan the rest of the season and continued it into the playoffs.
16:28 TOI and 69 points. That says it all. He spent time on the 4th line this season.

 

[CREW99AW]

You might be right.


You could also ask the question how much is offensive production affected by the Islanders system. They seem to pay no attention to D and want to trade scoring chances. How many players would see a bump in their numbers in that system?

.

The repeated comment that the isles coaches somehow told players "Don' worry about playing defense, just score ' is one of the most ridiculous on these boards.

Why do people think JHS was banished to the ahl?
Barzal and Beau were defensively responsible and JHS was not.

Isles were hardly a strong defensive team before CDH missed half a season and Boychuk 18 straight games. Having to play four rookie or sophmore defensemen sunk the isles. It is also a sign of what a lousy job Weight and his staff did in making adjustments, when injuries hit.

 

[CREW99AW]

He's really not and neither is Rantanen.
What did Leaf fans tell all of you early in the season and no one listened when there were threads asking if Marner is the nextt Yakupov? Leaf fans stated he needs more TOI and better linemates and you'll see what he can do. The second that occurs Marner was easily as good if not better than Barzal and Rantenan the rest of the season and continued it into the playoffs.
16:28 TOI and 69 points. That says it all. He spent time on the 4th line this season.

So much focus on Barzal from Leaf fans

 

[BlueBaron]

The repeated comment that the isles coaches somehow told players "Don' worry about playing defense, just score ' is one of the most ridiculous on these boards.

Why do people think JHS was banished to the ahl?
Barzal and Beau were defensively responsible and JHS was not.

Isles were hardly a strong defensive team before CDH missed half a season and Boychuk 18 straight games. Having to play four rookie or sophmore defensemen sunk the isles. It is also a sign of what a lousy job Weight and his staff did in making adjustments, when injuries hit.

Last I checked there was no system in hockey that preached "don't pay any attention to defense" however some systems are more prone to scoring while sacrificing some defense.

Try again.