16 contracts ending this summer - who to re-sign?

cdavis*

Guest
no, you didn't claim everything you said was fact. you didn't claim anything you said was fact. when some people responded with their opinion (he has intangibles for example), you shot them down for not having any facts. in response, i went to your "proof" or reasoning response and pointed out that you indeed didn't have facts that supported your arguments. you had facts, but none of them supported your position. only your opinion did. and i'd doing to you what you did to someone else. call them out for not having facts that support their argument.



you challenged them to do something you failed to do, then got pissed at them for doing what you did.



we have a misunderstanding here. i like latendresse. i want to resign him. where we disagree is you not wanting to resign condra. you not only do not want to sign him, you think he is a bad player, which is strange because most other people disagree with you. i'm not saying the majority is always right, but when you're discussing something with people that are just as knowledgeable as you, and observe the subject as much as you do, and you are in the minority for an opinion, you better be able to back it up. so far all you have is "condra is average at best at penalty killing." and "he's not that great of a defensive player". it's fine to say that, but you have an uphill battle that you need to bring the big guns for (ie you have to SHOW us that condra is not that great in those areas of his game, not just say he isn't).



condra isn't here to score, he's here to be an excellent defensive player and be an energy guy, and he is great in that roll. that is the paradigm. the onus is on you to prove otherwise.

WATCH HIM PLAY! He doesn't do anything on the PK at all! One person says he does and it catches on and then a bunch of parrots repeat it on every Sens board until everyone believes it. He just stands there in gingerbread man-stance hoping the puck hits him, he barely ever gets the puck out. If you're a hockey player and you say you aren't here to score, you are benched. That isn't an excuse for no contribution on the scoresheet whatsoever. He is the worst forward on the team, bar none [except Kassian- who actually has the tools to be a role (not roll) player]

How convenient, Condra isn't here to score! I wonder why when this happens when he gets a chance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm0RH37WRQg

He's not going to be a fixture here, he's going to go the way of Butler and Daugivins at some point (both of whom I'd likely pick over Condra any day).

Annnnd paradigm blah blah blah onus.
 

KAPOW

has no rispeck
Nov 12, 2008
1,215
65
at home
UFAs
Alfredsson It's up to him
Latendresse Yes
Regin No
Gonchar Maybe.. yes if term and price is right
Lundin No
Benoit 2 way contract for depth as an emergency call-up only
Jessiman Maybe on 2 way but 50/50 on that
Lawson "Maybe" but depends on the progress of 2 drafted kids. If 1 makes the jump to the AHL then "No"

RFAs
Condra Yes - short leash.
Hoffman Yes - possible 2 way
Wiercioch Yes 1 way
Da Costa Yes - 2 way
Cowick Yes 2 way
Borowiecki Yes 2 way
Dziurzynski Yes 2 way
Caporusso No

i don't think we should mind gonchar's price at all. we are in no cap trouble so i'd say if the coaching staff thinks he's got another year (or two) left and he wants to stay, then give him 5m/yr (or 8m for two).
 

HavlatMach9

streamable 3rah1
Mar 17, 2011
13,445
394
Ottawa
he's going to go the way of Butler and Daugivins at some point (both of whom I'd likely pick over Condra any day)
Agreed. Definitely see Condra being traded before Butler and Daugavins. Pretty obvious from who Paul MacLean likes to play and who Bryan Murray likes to trade away.
 

KarlssonnSchultz

Registered User
Feb 5, 2013
759
0
Ottawa
Solves it, doesn't it?

Michalek Spezza Greening
Latendresse Turris Alfie
Conacher Zibanejad Silfverberg
Condra Smith Neil
Obrien

This solves it doesn't it? All lines have proven chemistry?

EDIT: I guess many people might not like that idea. But to me, I'd like for Spezza/MM, Turris/Alfie, Zbad/Silf and Smith/Neil together as pairings, with whoever of the interchangeable sliding on those lines.
 

ATdaisuki

Registered User
Dec 4, 2012
2,068
757
Ottawa
WATCH HIM PLAY! He doesn't do anything on the PK at all! One person says he does and it catches on and then a bunch of parrots repeat it on every Sens board until everyone believes it. He just stands there in gingerbread man-stance hoping the puck hits him, he barely ever gets the puck out. If you're a hockey player and you say you aren't here to score, you are benched. That isn't an excuse for no contribution on the scoresheet whatsoever. He is the worst forward on the team, bar none [except Kassian- who actually has the tools to be a role (not roll) player]

How convenient, Condra isn't here to score! I wonder why when this happens when he gets a chance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm0RH37WRQg

He's not going to be a fixture here, he's going to go the way of Butler and Daugivins at some point (both of whom I'd likely pick over Condra any day).

Annnnd paradigm blah blah blah onus.

i do watch him play, lol. that's exactly what i said. you're arguing with people that are just as knowledgeable as you, and who watch him just as much as you do. the "watch him play" doesn't work for you, because we watched him and came to a conclusion. you completely ignored the last part of my post, which points out the mistake you've been making this entire time. you have to prove your point. you have to find clips, you have to have stats, you have to have something that shows your point because you are in the minority. that's the way it is.

condra is a great pk'er WATCH HIM PLAY (see, it doesn't work on you because you've watched him play and came to a different conclusion). the reason why i don't have to prove my point with stats or video is because informed people agree with me. they watch the games, and have made their own opinion. when more informed people reach the same conclusion, that conclusion is more likely to be right. but it's not always right, which is where you come in. if you can prove that we are wrong, then we'll accept that we are wrong, and change our opinion. you have not come even close to doing that. you have provided no evidence.

condra is better than daugavins because he is actually a better penalty killer and is a better forechecker than him. he backchecks harder, is better defensively, breaks up more plays, and is better in the neutral zone.

condra is better than butler because butler was a one-dimensional player that wasn't good enough at his forte to succeed.

as for his offense: he plays a roll, and is extremely effective in that roll. neil plays a roll, and is extremely effective in that roll. they have the same amount of points, while neil gets power play time. condra has four less points than zack smith. his offense is right there in the fourth line range. he's just frustrating in that sense because he could get more points if he had any finish. i do think he has better playmaking skills than he has shown this year from watching him last year though. i wonder if he can find that offense again. i might be in the minority in that opinion, but i'm not going to argue with anyone because i don't have proof, it's an observation i made that could very well be wrong.
 

Sensinitis

Registered User
Aug 5, 2012
15,936
5,526
WATCH HIM PLAY! He doesn't do anything on the PK at all! One person says he does and it catches on and then a bunch of parrots repeat it on every Sens board until everyone believes it. He just stands there in gingerbread man-stance hoping the puck hits him, he barely ever gets the puck out. If you're a hockey player and you say you aren't here to score, you are benched. That isn't an excuse for no contribution on the scoresheet whatsoever. He is the worst forward on the team, bar none [except Kassian- who actually has the tools to be a role (not roll) player]

How convenient, Condra isn't here to score! I wonder why when this happens when he gets a chance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm0RH37WRQg

He's not going to be a fixture here, he's going to go the way of Butler and Daugivins at some point (both of whom I'd likely pick over Condra any day).

Annnnd paradigm blah blah blah onus.

I highly doubt you have ever played competitive hockey based on everything you said(or half of what you said, cuz you know, blablabla) and especially since you think he doesnt do anything on the PK which makes arguing about specific parts of Condras game with you pretty useless
 

Sensinitis

Registered User
Aug 5, 2012
15,936
5,526
I don't believe I ever claimed all my statements to be fact I simply said that I did indeed include facts, whereas the people contending my opinion were not supplying facts or points whatsoever.

I don't need your little pot of gold chocolate-like legend to find my way around your gap-filled rant. I also never took or claimed others' opinions as false, I just challenged them to provide some facts behind their arguments and defended myself from two, now three sarcastic elitists.

Just watch a hockey game or two, you'll see what I mean. Tonight's game has a totally different outcome if Latendresse isn't setting up that game winner. When is the last time Condra ever came forward and did something like that? Condra has 2 points in his last 19, Latendresse has 8.

In conclusion, I hope you improve your hockey-watching and stat-researching skills. Craig Davis need not mature because he as mature as can be, poopy biatch. Thanks for inviting me to your version of Oprah's Lifeclass.

LOL! Who took a crap in Craig Davis' mouth??
 

aragorn

Do The Right Thing
Aug 8, 2004
28,620
9,131
Eric Condra is an excellent defensive forward & PK specialist. However, he is also one of the players IMO near the bottom of the forward depth chart in Ottawa. I would place Spezza, Michalek, Turris, Alfredsson, Zibanejad, Silfverberg, Greening, Z. Smith, Conacher & Neil ahead of him in terms of importance to the team. Kassian also plays an important role in Ottawa but I don't think he is ahead of Condra. Condra is a coach favourite for all the little things he does well but I would think eventually the prospects with the most hype will get their opportunity at his expense.

Having said that, I think that one of Stone, Noesen, Puempel, Hoffman, Grant or DD eventually knocks Condra off the roster depending on when they will be NHL ready. I think Stone is NHL ready now & could be on Ottawa's roster next season. Ottawa is lucky enough to have a number of players who can also kill penalties but in addition to that add much more offence than Condra. I also think that Latendresse is a bubble player & could also be replaced by a prospect sooner than later. Regin should be gone next season & I suspect that JOB's time in Ottawa could also be limited just based on the number of times he was a healthy scratch this season. Replacing Condra with Stone gives Ottawa much more size & offence in the top nine while others would have to pick up the defensive side of things including on the PK in the absence of Condra. I think Condra is re-signed next yr but he could also be traded if the right deal were to come along.
 

DG

Registered User
Sep 19, 2006
18,810
1
Toronto
Michalek Spezza Greening
Latendresse Turris Alfie
Conacher Zibanejad Silfverberg
Condra Smith Neil
Obrien

This solves it doesn't it? All lines have proven chemistry?

EDIT: I guess many people might not like that idea. But to me, I'd like for Spezza/MM, Turris/Alfie, Zbad/Silf and Smith/Neil together as pairings, with whoever of the interchangeable sliding on those lines.

I'm fine with that too... I was just trying to show that having Condra wasn't a "problem".
 

ATdaisuki

Registered User
Dec 4, 2012
2,068
757
Ottawa
Having said that, I think that one of Stone, Noesen, Puempel, Hoffman, Grant or DD eventually knocks Condra off the roster depending on when they will be NHL ready. I think Stone is NHL ready now & could be on Ottawa's roster next season.

stone will probably be ready for third line line duties next year, but why not have him wait a little longer? if alfie decides to play for one more year, the year after that there will be an open roster spot he can take. latendresse can hang around for a little longer, but i think he could eventually be replaced by noeson. then condra stays on the team, unless someone else from the list bumps him off. i like hoffman, but i don't know if there's room for him on this team.
 

mcnorth

Registered User
Jun 28, 2011
4,266
3
Eric Condra is an excellent defensive forward & PK specialist. However, he is also one of the players IMO near the bottom of the forward depth chart in Ottawa. I would place Spezza, Michalek, Turris, Alfredsson, Zibanejad, Silfverberg, Greening, Z. Smith, Conacher & Neil ahead of him in terms of importance to the team. Kassian also plays an important role in Ottawa but I don't think he is ahead of Condra. Condra is a coach favourite for all the little things he does well but I would think eventually the prospects with the most hype will get their opportunity at his expense.

Having said that, I think that one of Stone, Noesen, Puempel, Hoffman, Grant or DD eventually knocks Condra off the roster depending on when they will be NHL ready. I think Stone is NHL ready now & could be on Ottawa's roster next season. Ottawa is lucky enough to have a number of players who can also kill penalties but in addition to that add much more offence than Condra. I also think that Latendresse is a bubble player & could also be replaced by a prospect sooner than later. Regin should be gone next season & I suspect that JOB's time in Ottawa could also be limited just based on the number of times he was a healthy scratch this season. Replacing Condra with Stone gives Ottawa much more size & offence in the top nine while others would have to pick up the defensive side of things including on the PK in the absence of Condra. I think Condra is re-signed next yr but he could also be traded if the right deal were to come along.

Agreed. I've been thinking about Condra a lot lately, actually.

I love Condra and appreciate what he brings but to me he is the guy who other teams want who we can afford to move. And that's a compliment to him, really. If we are to go after a Ryan or Fleischman or any of the names being bandied about in various scenarios, I think Condra could very well be the guy who we have to 'give to get.' I don't see many teams being too amped up over Greening, and the scratch and Bingo guys like JOB and DaCosta look good going away from our side of the deal, but probably don't get too many NHL GM's too excited. COndra could very well be the 'roster player' in any package of picks/prospects + roster player.

I want to resign Latendresse for another year just to see if he and Spezza can gel and all of the sudden Lats is a 30 goal guy. He has finish and touch, just no dash. But Spezza is one of those guys like Pierre Turgeon who creates without always doing it with speed and counter-attack - I really think that's reflective of the type of players we have on the Turris and Zibanejad lines rather than some sort of team philosophy which I've sen other posters imply here. But, you know, if we can get someone way better, thanks and see ya Lats. ;)
 

aragorn

Do The Right Thing
Aug 8, 2004
28,620
9,131
stone will probably be ready for third line line duties next year, but why not have him wait a little longer? if alfie decides to play for one more year, the year after that there will be an open roster spot he can take. latendresse can hang around for a little longer, but i think he could eventually be replaced by noeson. then condra stays on the team, unless someone else from the list bumps him off. i like hoffman, but i don't know if there's room for him on this team.

That could happen, but Ottawa this yr was starving for scoring in more than a few games & Stone brings more offence, that is why I believe the team is hungry to bring him in sooner rather than later. He is having a pretty good season in Bingo & is tied for the team lead in scoring after missing a number of games through injury. I don't think he will play in Ottawa this season depending on how Bingo & Ottawa do in their playoff run but I do think he will be on the roster for next season. We'll see.
 

ATdaisuki

Registered User
Dec 4, 2012
2,068
757
Ottawa
That could happen, but Ottawa this yr was starving for scoring in more than a few games & Stone brings more offence, that is why I believe the team is hungry to bring him in sooner rather than later. He is having a pretty good season in Bingo & is tied for the team lead in scoring after missing a number of games through injury. I don't think he will play in Ottawa this season depending on how Bingo & Ottawa do in their playoff run but I do think he will be on the roster for next season. We'll see.

starving for goals, but missing spezza, karlsson, and michalek for long stretches. goal scoring shouldn't really be an issue until alfie retires.
 

aragorn

Do The Right Thing
Aug 8, 2004
28,620
9,131
starving for goals, but missing spezza, karlsson, and michalek for long stretches. goal scoring shouldn't really be an issue until alfie retires.

Scoring goals has been an issue all year with Alfredsson in the lineup because of Spezza & Karlsson out. I guess you assume that both Spezza & Karlsson come back from injury & play at the same level they were at before their respective injuries. Maybe, we'll see, there is no guarantee that either come back this yr although most think Karlsson could be back. Again we'll see.
 

ATdaisuki

Registered User
Dec 4, 2012
2,068
757
Ottawa
Scoring goals has been an issue all year with Alfredsson in the lineup because of Spezza & Karlsson out. I guess you assume that both Spezza & Karlsson come back from injury & play at the same level they were at before their respective injuries. Maybe, we'll see, there is no guarantee that either come back this yr although most think Karlsson could be back. Again we'll see.

yeah, i wouldn't count on them coming back this year either. in fact, if both of them can't come back 100% healthy and in game shape, i don't know if i want either of them. just one of those players coming back and the team doing even better would put the pressure (pressure most likely coming from the still injured player to get back and help the team) on the other to come back. i don't want either of them hurt worse than they already are. next year, as long as alfie comes back, i don't see stone on the team. the right wingers next year could be
michalek
alfie
silfverberg
neil

with condra playing the left

greening
conacher/hoffman
latendresse/hoffman/conacher
condra

i do think both spezza and karlsson will be 100% next season
 

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