Post-Game Talk: Woody doesn’t even last NNN

CupofOil

Knob Flavored Coffey
Aug 20, 2009
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NYC
The only reason they were good enough is because of their historical f***ing PP thats never been done in the history of the league and 150 + 128 + 100 point seasons and Skinner saving us from Campbell if you expected them to replicate that this year then I don't know what to tell you

even a blind man could see this regression coming
Oh please. Nobody and I mean nobody saw THIS coming unless they had Marty McFly's Sports Almanac showing future scores.

It wasn't just the PP. The team was far better in all aspects last season. Don't act like you saw THIS coming because you didn't unless you can find posts of yours predicting this.

Personally, I never bought into them being a true Cup contender but what's happening now was unimaginable for everybody.
 
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KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
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not only that...Woody doesn't hold the top players accountable at all
man if we benched Connor and Leon we'd have people up in arms about our best players being benched in a 3-2 game. Benching players is a lose-lose situation, look at Huberdeau and the shit he had to answer to the press after he was benched all of 3rd. Benching them does nothing when they themselves know they are shit
 

Soundwave

Registered User
Mar 1, 2007
72,159
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Well yeah, I had a feeling this team would have struggles and still be a playoff team. Not a cup team, but a playoff team.

Fighting for worst in the league? No one saw this coming.

Well let this be a lesson to the Blackhawks. Don't f*** around for years with your D and goaltending. It can blow up in your face in ways you can't possibly imagine.

Don't do what the Oilers have done. Get serious about D and goaltending early in the game.
 

guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
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he could easily sit Bouchard for a period, or even Drai...to least send a message that dumb mistakes aren't tolerated, no matter who you are
I completely agree.
I especially hate these shifts where a player puts in little to no effort.
Leon and Bouchard are at the top of the list on this team.

There should be ZERO tolerance for that bullshit.

Dustin Neilson made a good point...Leon skated stiff legged on (I think the 1st goal). Basically just quit.

What does Woody do? he puts Leon back with McDavid.
That is a joke.

As Neilson said though...its like there is an organizational mandate that you cant bench the 2 superstars.
 
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Soundwave

Registered User
Mar 1, 2007
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I completely agree.
I especially hate these shifts where a player puts in little to no effort.
Leon and Bouchard are at the top of the list on this team.

There should be ZERO tolerance for that bullshit.

Dustin Neilson made a good point...Leon skated stiff legged on (I think the 2nd goal). Basically just quit.

What does Woody do? he puts Leon back with McDavid.
That is a joke.

As Neilson said though...its like there is an organizational mandate that you cant bench the 2 superstars.

A coach who is periods away from getting fired isn't going to bench Draisaitl.

He got this far riding that gravy train, Woody will down with the Titanic in that case.
 

KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
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he could easily sit Bouchard for a period, or even Drai...to least send a message that dumb mistakes aren't tolerated, no matter who you are
see I'd agree with you IF we had players who played less minutes and made less mistakes.

Imagine sitting Bouchard and Drai and sending Deshairnais and Ryan over the boards in their place and they get dummied and scored on. I'd be laughing my ass off if I was Bouch/Drai
 
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Behind Enemy Lines

Registered User
Feb 19, 2003
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My buddy texted me a good question..."What would Vegas do"?
Would Vegas pander to their best players?
I've heard this before and feel it's an apples and bananas scenario. Vegas is a top destination for talent backed up by attractive considerations like being a global entertainment hub, warm weather and no tax jurisdiction. The talent spigot is likely to always be open to sustaining competitiveness ... especially so with one of the elite management groups in the game.

Edmonton is a cold weather Northern most NHL franchise that has historically been challenged to attract quality free agents (at least without overpay); it faces reality of being among the top no-trade destinations every year; boils within a caldron of 24/7 365 single attention in a one-horse sports entertainment market; and had chaotic organizational management for like twenty years.

Vegas can afford to bury its mistakes in the Desert. Edmonton cannot.
 
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Drivesaitl

Finding Hyman
Oct 8, 2017
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Well yeah, I had a feeling this team would have struggles and still be a playoff team. Not a cup team, but a playoff team.

Fighting for worst in the league? No one saw this coming.
Yeah. My take to be clear was playoff spot in division or wild card. I felt this would not be a first place club and that it would be a possible first round exit again. But that feeling due as well to continuance of present coaching staff. I'd actually be open to different views if a coaching reset works. Many teams have recovered through mid season coaching changes and altered their probable path.

All as fans we can do is hope for it. Its a certainty the team is not getting a rebound with present coaching. its the worst I've ever seen.
 

CycloneSweep

Registered User
Sep 27, 2017
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see I'd agree with you IF we had players who played less minutes and made less mistakes.

Imagine sitting Bouchard and Drai and sending Deshairnais and Ryan over the boards in their place and they get dummied and scored on. I'd be laughing my ass off if I was Bouch/Drai
Would you be laughing? Or would you feel f***ing embarassed that those guys are a better option than you at the moment?
 

rboomercat90

Registered User
Mar 24, 2013
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I guess I can’t say I’m really surprised but even with a loss to the Sharks last night and now a 2-9-1 start to the season, not a whisper from the organization that changes are needed. If the third loss to Vancouver wasn’t enough and especially last nights loss to San Jose then what is? The players have quit on this coaching staff and or the organization as a whole. Things aren’t turning around any time soon and whoever is in charge of the Oilers is content with allowing it to continue. Much like Woody was content to keep rolling with Skinner in last years playoffs even though he was failing every night. Hard for fans to continue to care what this team does anymore when they don’t care themselves.
 

guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
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I've heard this before and feel it's an apples and bananas scenario. Vegas is a top destination for talent backed up by attractive considerations like being a global entertainment hub, warm weather and no tax jurisdiction. The talent spigot is likely to always be open to sustaining competitiveness ... especially so with one of the elite management groups in the game.

Edmonton is a cold weather Northern most NHL franchise that has historically been challenged to attract quality free agents (at least without overpay); it faces reality of being among the top no-trade destinations every year; boils within a caldron of 24/7 365 single attention in a one-horse sports entertainment market; and had chaotic organizational management for like twenty years.

Vegas can afford to bury its mistakes in the Desert. Edmonton cannot.
Thats fair...Edmonton is a less desirable location and always will be from an NHL perspective. Especially without a generational player like Connor.
However there is something to be said for an organization being less concerned about feelings (and appearances) and being more concerned about winning.

Case in point...there are so many examples of Leon quitting on a play, Bouchard too.
There is no excuse for these players to be quitting on a play and what are the consequences?
The answer of course is that there are no consequences.
Even on the first goal against yesterday...Leon (once again) quit. What does Woodcroft do?
He puts Leon wth Connor.
I mean WTF?

Winning teams just dont do that shit.

I guess what I am saying is that you either commit to being a winning organization or you dont.
Accountability is a huge part of that from the top down.
If Vegas wasnt committed to winning then their location and weather (and everything else) wouldnt have nearly as big of an impact.
So Edmonton being located where it is and it being a less desirable destination are just excuses IMO.
 
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KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
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Would you be laughing? Or would you feel f***ing embarassed that those guys are a better option than you at the moment?
ah yes, the coach thinks the guy that hasn't scored a 5 on 5 goal in over 200 days and constantly bleeds goals and the Dman who gets walked more than a border collie thinks those guys are better than me, my ego sure would be bruised
 
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Drivesaitl

Finding Hyman
Oct 8, 2017
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Edmonton is a cold weather Northern most NHL franchise that has historically been challenged to attract quality free agents (at least without overpay); it faces reality of being among the top no-trade destinations every year; boils within a caldron of 24/7 365 single attention in a one-horse sports entertainment market; and had chaotic organizational management for like twenty years.

Vegas can afford to bury its mistakes in the Desert. Edmonton cannot.
Lots of stuff gets buried in glaciers. its a joke, and its somehow apt. lol

Reference to how slowly things move here. Careful Holland Sloth, that thar glacier is moving..

1699647251101.png
 

iCanada

Registered User
Feb 6, 2010
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Well yeah, I had a feeling this team would have struggles and still be a playoff team. Not a cup team, but a playoff team.

Fighting for worst in the league? No one saw this coming.

I definitely saw the warning signs @Drivesaitl was talking about. Didn't think we'd turn into this kind of tire fire though.


This is a start to the season that the decade of darkness would be embarrassed about.
 

Behind Enemy Lines

Registered User
Feb 19, 2003
15,121
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Vancouver
Thats fair...Edmonton is a wastland and always will be from an NHL perspective. Especially without a generational player like Connor.
However there is something to be said for an organization being less concerned about feelings (and appearances) and being more concerned about winning.

Case in point...there are so many examples of Leon quitting on a play, Bouchard too.
There is no excuse for these players to be quitting on a play and what are the consequences?
The answer of course is that there are no consequences.
Even on the first goal against yesterday...Leon (once again) quit. What does Woodcroft do?
He puts Leon wth Connor.
I mean WTF?

Winning teams just dont do that shit.
I'm not slagging on Edmonton. It's a fine city however in terms of attracting an affluent, young global and mobile talent pool it is a real disadvantage.

Macro View: The two hockey organizations are also significantly different. Vegas ascension was immediate as a start-up with a zero cap and finally favourable expansion draft terms. They've been backed by stable, elite management who have been able to navigate through their blunders and address issues in a number of ways. Oilers are mired at the back end of multiple failed management eras (4 including interim K. Gretzky) which bungled precious draft capital; eroded NHL level players; and bucked against the cap ceiling for much of it.

Micro View: The Oiler team is broken right now. As we heard from Draisaitl's broken media avail there's no answer, everything that can go wrong has gone wrong. They're shellshocked. As to the hard fixation of running out an ineffective Stack Line, I've long believed this is due to McDavid hiding a hand/wrist injury going back to before his 22% face-off game against Nashville. But regardless, nothing this team or its coach has done has mitigated the self-mistakes, poor decisions and bad habits, corrosively demoralizing bad goaltending that's gained snowball momentum running down hill.
Team accountability is lacking and now secondary on a shortened roster within an existential struggle.
 

Old Boys Club

Anita Max Wynn
Nov 3, 2013
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Weirdest thing (not directly related to the Oilers org.) in all this to me is all the Canuck fans coming out of the woodwork to troll/hate post about the Oilers. Even scrolling on social media (IG, Facebook, twitter, etc.) it seems half the shit flinging posts have Nucks avatars. I never realized there was such an animosity from their fanbase, when, and I speak generally, most Oiler fans I've met give 0 shits about the Canucks. Some haters for sure, but a drop in the Ocean compared to the Calgary hate.
 

oXo Cube

Power Play Merchant
Nov 4, 2008
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Weirdest thing (not directly related to the Oilers org.) in all this to me is all the Canuck fans coming out of the woodwork to troll/hate post about the Oilers. Even scrolling on social media (IG, Facebook, twitter, etc.) it seems half the shit flinging posts have Nucks avatars. I never realized there was such an animosity from their fanbase, when, and I speak generally, most Oiler fans I've met give 0 shits about the Canucks. Some haters for sure, but not a drop in the Ocean compared to the Calgary hate.

Vancouver fans are worse than Toronto when their team is good.

People have forgotten this since they haven't been good in a decade.
 

McOilers97

Registered User
Jan 10, 2012
6,496
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Oh please. Nobody and I mean nobody saw THIS coming unless they had Marty McFly's Sports Almanac showing future scores.

It wasn't just the PP. The team was far better in all aspects last season. Don't act like you saw THIS coming because you didn't unless you can find posts of yours predicting this.

Personally, I never brought them being a true Cup contender but what's happening now was unimaginable for everybody.
Yeah, maybe it was *reasonable* to anticipate a regression from 6th in the league with 109 points down to 10-12th with around 100 points, but nothing was there to indicate they were going to implode like this.

Goals for last year was 3.96 per game, this year is 2.58.
Goals against last year was 3.17 per game, this year is 4.17.

So goal differential has swung from +0.79 to -1.59 per game.
A -2.38 goal differential per game difference with largely the same players that had this group at 109 and 104 points the previous 2 seasons, and on pace for 105 and 97 in the 2 shortened years before that.

McDavid dropping from 153 points last year to like 120-130 this season would be a "reasonable" expectation, not all the way down to 80-something.

And there's no logical reason for the entire team defense (which was never amazing, but was at least serviceable the past few years) to totally shit itself, AND both goalies to do the same.
 
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BertMcDrai

Middle old guy loving sports
Nov 26, 2018
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Nobody fired yet??

Thats surprising...hope something is gonna happen today...or make a trade...please just do something!

Still wondering what happened to McD...he was off even before his injury.
 

Kerberos

Hound of Hades
Nov 4, 2021
4,030
6,313
Nobody fired yet??

Thats surprising...hope something is gonna happen today...or make a trade...please just do something!

Still wondering what happened to McD...he was off even before his injury.

This organization doesn't hold anybody accountable so if you're expecting firings or any sort of introspection, don't hold your breath.
 
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guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
33,175
13,039
I'm not slagging on Edmonton. It's a fine city however in terms of attracting an affluent, young global and mobile talent pool it is a real disadvantage.

Macro View: The two hockey organizations are also significantly different. Vegas ascension was immediate as a start-up with a zero cap and finally favourable expansion draft terms. They've been backed by stable, elite management who have been able to navigate through their blunders and address issues in a number of ways. Oilers are mired at the back end of multiple failed management eras (4 including interim K. Gretzky) which bungled precious draft capital; eroded NHL level players; and bucked against the cap ceiling for much of it.

Micro View: The Oiler team is broken right now. As we heard from Draisaitl's broken media avail there's no answer, everything that can go wrong has gone wrong. They're shellshocked. As to the hard fixation of running out an ineffective Stack Line, I've long believed this is due to McDavid hiding a hand/wrist injury going back to before his 22% face-off game against Nashville. But regardless, nothing this team or its coach has done has mitigated the self-mistakes, poor decisions and bad habits, corrosively demoralizing bad goaltending that's gained snowball momentum running down hill.
Team accountability is lacking and now secondary on a shortened roster within an existential struggle.
I didnt think that you were slagging on Edmonton.
You were just highlighting the reality of Edmonton as an NHL destination.

That said the crux of your post was entirely on Vegas as a destination city and thats why I switched gears to focusing on the organization...not the city.
Its the organization and how its run that ultimately matters and thats were the focus should be.

So your Micro and Macro views are much more relevant than Vegas as a city.

Now in terms of the Macro view...Vegas did start off with a favorable roster but they didnt have the 2 best offensive players in the League to build around. The Oilers also (back in 2015) had plenty of cap space to start off with as well.
Its the stable and elite management in the Vegas organization that stands out to me. Thats were winning starts and the Oilers under Katz ownership failed right form his first day under his ownership. It could be argued that they have never recovered and have now wasted multiple years (possibly even their careers as Oilers) of the 2 best offensive players in the game.

So the micro view as you laid it out is really just an extension of the macro.
It represents a logical conclusion.

So all of this doesnt really take away from my initial point that winning organizations like Vegas just do things differently. You might even say that they are 180 degrees different form how the Oilers organization operates.
Accountability has been built in to their organization right from the start of their current ownership.
Katz has never done that with the Oilers and despite some moderate success this organization has been chasing his tail ever since.
 
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