Pre-Game Talk: Winnipeg Jets @ the Detroit Red Wings Jan 13th maybe

[Jack7222]

A little of that "tough love" is OK. But I mean very little. If it is leave them there until they learn how to grind and check, eff that. A game or 2, maybe 3, just to see how the other half lives, OK.

If we had a more talented 3rd line that was expected to score, we would have a suitable place to use to ease them in. As it has been it was either top 6 or a choice between shutdown or energy/PK. Neither of which is very good for top 6 candidates who play a high skill game.

Yeah, agree 100% here. I'd like to have a third scoring line for just this reason.

 

[Jack7222]

I think we should be following best practice when integrating kids. Look at the top teams and how they do it and emulate it.

I guess I have a hard time with the concept of earning it in professional sports. What does that even mean? Every player has different strengths and weaknesses and this plays differently.

I mean I imagine a tonne of players looked visibly busier on the ice then Lidstrom but Nik didn't need to look busy to be among the best at his position.

If a kid has played well enough at a lower level to earn an NHL opportunity then they should be used in a role they have been groomed for.

I think for me, "earning it" means working hard every day to be your best. It has nothing to do with being busy on the ice.

I'm not talking about months of 4th line duties and then 'scoring your way out of it'; just saying I do see the sense in bringing a rookie in for a couple of games lower in the lineup to reinforce the culture.

I'm also not so sure that top teams always plop all their rookies on their top two lines right out of the gate... but I honestly don't know.

 

[surixon]

I think for me, "earning it" means working hard every day to be your best. It has nothing to do with being busy on the ice.

I'm not talking about months of 4th line duties and then 'scoring your way out of it'; just saying I do see the sense in bringing a rookie in for a couple of games lower in the lineup to reinforce the culture.

I'm also not so sure that top teams always plop all their rookies on their top two lines for their very first games...

I think most teams put them on the second pair with a vet or on a sheltered offensive third line.

The Dubois line is probably the closest we have to that Sheltered offensive line given Lowry wants to hard match the Scheifele and Lowry lines against the other teams best.

So to me I'm not really looking at it as top 6 vs bottom 6. I'm looking at it as let's put him out with good players against softer competition which I think Lowry is doing playing him with Dubois and Conner.

If you need to send a kid down the line up due to needing something else or inconsistent play from time to time sure. But for these kids you need to balance that against the kids confidence level. Keeping that confidence high while they are breaking in is probably the biggest thing that needs to happen.

 

[ps241]

As it stands today, I would not attend a game, even with reduced capacity. Triple vaxxed.
But judging from the way things are going, I think that might change pretty quickly.
The information we are being given is very poor, at best. The guidance is contradictory and confused. So I am doing the best I can to aggregate what's available and to read between the lines. I still see hints at reasons for optimism, like the quick rise and fall of Omicron in South Africa, among others.

I still keep one eye on new cases, but those numbers are less meaningful than they used to be - and it turns out they were never as meaningful as they should have been. But I am mainly following hospital/ICU admissions and deaths, in Manitoba and around the world.

Yea I find the entire thing an interesting study in human nature.

Case counts obviously are impossible to monitor accurately now due to the system being legit overwhelmed. Hospitalization #’s and ICU #’s reporting is interesting…..do I trust our leaders to not game this……..no.

I am doubled vaxed and have had Covid now so I assume I will get back out to a game when/if the restrictions lift.

Taking it day by day right now and keeping two hands on my wallet at all times.

 

[Jets 31]

I think most teams put them on the second pair with a vet or on a sheltered offensive third line.

The Dubois line is probably the closest we have to that Sheltered offensive line given Lowry wants to hard match the Scheifele and Lowry lines against the other teams best.

So to me I'm not really looking at it as top 6 vs bottom 6. I'm looking at it as let's put him out with good players against softer competition which I think Lowry is doing playing him with Dubois and Conner.

If you need to send a kid down the line up due to needing something else or inconsistent play from time to time sure. But for these kids you need to balance that against the kids confidence level. Keeping that confidence high while they are breaking in is probably the biggest thing that needs to happen.

Agreed, pretty sure Perfetti was drafted because of his offensive talent so putting him on the 4th line doesn't really use him to the abilities he was drafted for. When Wheeler gets back i really hope Lowry tries to make 3 scoring lines.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think every player in the NHL has worked their ass off to be where they are. I just want coaches putting the right guys in the right spots so that they can succeed and the team does too.

That too.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Yea I find the entire thing an interesting study in human nature.

Case counts obviously are impossible to monitor accurately now due to the system being legit overwhelmed. Hospitalization #’s and ICU #’s reporting is interesting…..do I trust our leaders to not game this……..no.

I am doubled vaxed and have had Covid now so I assume I will get back out to a game when/if the restrictions lift.

Taking it day by day right now and keeping two hands on my wallet at all times.

Fortunately, there are legit experts who are not directly answerable to the politicians. I think they can be trusted to a fairly high degree, though they will all have their interests to serve. Bias is everywhere.
I think we all need to find a voice we can trust at times. Just don't find that voice on FB or IG or FOX.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I could see the tough love approach being applicable if the kid in question wasn't bringing it everyday or had work ethic issues.

I think it worked when we sent Conner down after camp in 2017 and it hammered home he needed to work every day.

Interesting enough the one player that maybe needed more of that tough luck approach was Laine.

With regards to Cole I see no indication that he's not putting in the work. As a result I don't really see a need to send a message.

He seems like such a smart kid that I expect he has it pretty much figured out.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Ultimately, yes. But I also think the players' psychology is something you have to consider and balance, and even though all players have undoubtedly worked hard, some are also harder workers than others. For all we know Svechnikov has been busting his ass to take it to the next level and putting "the new kid" on the fourth or third line for a game is a show of respect to others' hard work.

IMO Maurice took this approach way too far, to the point where he was afraid of upsetting his seniority apple cart. But I just don't think it's hurting anyone to see a rookie on a lower line for a game or two to try to keep a fire lit under his ass.




I don't think it's about there being a "work ethic problem" you need to try to address. I think it can just be a reinforcement of a culture of hard work and discipline, and a show of respect to other guys who've earned it. Again, I'm not talking about spending the season on the 4th line, but a game or two I can see the rationale, personally.

And yeah, interesting comment on Laine. I do sometimes wonder if he needed some tougher intervention earlier.

Actually, I think Maurice did take a fairly tough line with him. Had Laine PO'ed a few times. Not saying a little tougher wouldn't have been a good idea, but it is a fine line.

I had one child who simply would not ever accept any punishment. Made the punishments less than worthless. Did more harm than good. Fortunately that one did learn by example and by making mistakes. Turned out fine in spite of me. But my point is that the person being 'instructed' needs to accept it as fair in order to learn the lesson.

Connor dogged it through TC in '17. Got sent down for a whole 4 games and came back a different player. I credit Maurice for sending him down at the right time and I credit Connor for taking it the right way. Seems to have remembered that lesson ever since. Just 2 years later he was a star making over 7 mil per and he didn't let up when he got the big contract.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

all these restrictions are dumb. if you're double vaxxed you should be able to go fs.

Double vaxxed, even triple vaxxed, you can still get Covid. Odds are good that you won't require hospitalization, much less ICU or morgue. But some triple vaxxed people will still need those things, depriving others of needed medical care.

Also, being vaccinated doesn't prevent people from carrying and spreading the virus.

Honestly, IMO we are getting closer to the point where we can take that attitude. But we are not quite there yet. Hospitalizations, ICU admissions and deaths are all just starting to rise in response to Omicron. We need to watch what happens for a another couple of weeks to see how bad that is going to get before backing off on the precautions. Right now the medical system is wounded. If we try to just rip off the band-aid, the system will collapse under the weight of admissions.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

I might cancel my season tickets until this is all resolved, getting fed up with covid. I've been at the lake working remotely since Omicron hit.

Also glad I'm not playing beer league because all the cases in Winnipeg are coming from hockey rinks. I would but I'm way... too busy with work.

 

[voyageur]

They should tack on an additional two weeks at the end of the season

then, start the playoffs

Playoffs already start in May. I think if you push the playoffs back even more, have the Stanley Cup in July you are not getting prime TV, as many will tune out, for the short summer.

They should just play the games.

 

[Jets 31]

Think the Jets and Wings really go at it but the blue team gets a couple more shots in.

 

[Pandemonia]

Has anyone made a credible calculation as to how much money the Jets will lose by playing in an empty arena compared to their normal home crowd?

 

[Guardian17]

Has anyone made a credible calculation as to how much money the Jets will lose by playing in an empty arena compared to their normal home crowd?

@jimsabo21 did an analysis of Jets revenues on this thread a few years ago.

Analysis - Jets Home Game Revenues - Playoff $

 

[surixon]

Has anyone made a credible calculation as to how much money the Jets will lose by playing in an empty arena compared to their normal home crowd?

It's been speculated they'd lose $1.4 million a game.

 

[SUX2BU]

Playoffs already start in May. I think if you push the playoffs back even more, have the Stanley Cup in July you are not getting prime TV, as many will tune out, for the short summer.

They should just play the games.

that’s the problem, games aren’t being played

 

[Pandemonia]

It's been speculated they'd lose $1.4 million a game.

Wow, that's some serious change. As in, almost a thousand pairs of Manolo Blahniks serious.

Thanks to both of you for the numbers.

 

[Snot Rocket]

Just thought we could have a thread to talk Jets with all these days off between games, did i say i hate Covid? Hopefully we can get back to a somewhat normal soon and a full arena or season ticket holders might be doing this to get a seat.

There's a few CFL teams that might be interested in her services.
Sweet Jebus, she destroyed him AND the chair.

 

[Joe Hallenback]

Guys lets not get into a conversation about Covid it always ends bad

FYI
Perfetti should be with Dubois and Connor. He is perfect fit for those 2 IMO. He can trail Dubois into the corners and he can also find both with passes

 

[Pandemonia]

Perfetti should be with Dubois and Connor. He is perfect fit for those 2 IMO. He can trail Dubois into the corners and he can also find both with passes

Agreed, as long as he keeps his head up when he comes out of the corner to the front of the net.

 

[Snot Rocket]

Double vaxxed, even triple vaxxed, you can still get Covid. Odds are good that you won't require hospitalization, much less ICU or morgue. But some triple vaxxed people will still need those things, depriving others of needed medical care.

Also, being vaccinated doesn't prevent people from carrying and spreading the virus.

Honestly, IMO we are getting closer to the point where we can take that attitude. But we are not quite there yet. Hospitalizations, ICU admissions and deaths are all just starting to rise in response to Omicron. We need to watch what happens for a another couple of weeks to see how bad that is going to get before backing off on the precautions. Right now the medical system is wounded. If we try to just rip off the band-aid, the system will collapse under the weight of admissions.

Yep, wife is triple and tested positive.
My son and I have tested negative but we're both definitely rocking some symptoms...but we're both passing rapid tests.
We've taken every precaution, both triple vax'd, boy double vax...not eligible for 3rd yet.
Agreed, if they open things up too early it could fubar they system completely.

 

[kanadalainen]

Perfetti should be with Dubois and Connor. He is perfect fit for those 2 IMO. He can trail Dubois into the corners and he can also find both with passes

What a fantastic line that would be.

IMHO of course.

 

[surixon]

Guys lets not get into a conversation about Covid it always ends bad

FYI
Perfetti should be with Dubois and Connor. He is perfect fit for those 2 IMO. He can trail Dubois into the corners and he can also find both with passes

Agreed, they need to give him some time to adjust to the NHL as well.

 

[voyageur]

Guys lets not get into a conversation about Covid it always ends bad

FYI
Perfetti should be with Dubois and Connor. He is perfect fit for those 2 IMO. He can trail Dubois into the corners and he can also find both with passes

He's going to get a shot there. It looks like. I am not sure that's a great line, as Perfetti has to do some of things that Svetchnikov did, and more recently Harkins, to bring success, and that's some digging. Defensively it will be interesting to see if he can have the success either of those two guys were.

I'm more worried about the impact of Stastny's injury. This team has shown all year to have a drop off when Stats isn't in the lineup.

If the result is Copp being pushed up to the top 6, and Harkins taking Suess's spot when he comes back, frankly that's not a great top 9.
4th line is ok. But there is a talent shortage at forward. If Stanley is out for a minute, I hope we bring Heinola up, and use Beaulieu as 7th d on the PK.

I don't know how the Covid situation with the Moose will affect callups, but this roster is thin, I don't know any way around it. Somebody is going to have to step up with a big game. You would expect the Michigan guys to be amped up, and some of the Ontario players might get the chance to play in front of family. Detroit's lineup is improved, particularly their defense, I think the Jets chance to win the game is being stronger up the middle.