Speculation: Will Burmistrov return to the Jets??

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truck

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Jun 27, 2012
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Burmi is a more valuable asset to the Jets while playing in North America.

This is the whole story, why are people getting their panties in a bunch attacking the kid?
 

Blue Shakehead

because lol Jets
Mar 18, 2011
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He did not "bolt". He was a (Restricted) Free agent and chose to sign with a different team AS IS HIS RIGHT. He did not break his contract with the Jets, he did everything he was asked to by the organisation while he was still under contract with them, case in point him reporting to the AHL without making a fuss even when he wanted to play in the KHL. I understand you're upset but Burmistrov is not your girlfriend who moved on with another guy so you're never gonna have her back, he's a just a hockey player. I don't understand why you're taking everything so personally

After ardently defending Burmistrov's contractual rights as a player, I find it strange that you're heaping praise on him for reporting to the AHL - which was, in fact, his contractual obligation. HE DIDN'T EVEN MAKE A FUSS ABOUT IT!!!! (Errrr..I mean until after he left when he cited publicly that being sent to the AHL was one of the reasons he bolted to the KHL).

Burmistrov isn't my ex-girlfriend who left me for another man? I'm guessing you get a lot of your ideas for this board and quite possibly life in general from The Jerry Springer Show. Oh NO I DI-ENT! JERRY, JERRY, JERRY!
 

Gump Hasek

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Nov 9, 2005
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Pretty much everyone wanted Burmi in the top 6 when Olli was dragging his feet all over the ice last season.

That is near meaningless. Using public opinion as some sort of an arbiter of what is the correct position is frankly a poor position from which to argue. Brittney Spears/Bieber and others of their ilk are usually far more popular versus more worthy artists. Popular opinion is clearly in the wrong there as such. Pubic opinions regarding the equities markets are often sampled by many professional traders so that they may do the opposite if public opinion is heavily slanted to one side - because the public is usually wrong.

What we know; many HF posters wanted Burmistrov to play ahead of Jokinen, yet a professional hockey organization chose to do the opposite. Jokinen I'm guessing wasn't paid well by Chevy at that time to play behind an inexperienced and much younger Burmistrov. He was more likely brought in to solidify an organizational weakness down the middle - a weakness they likely identified and considered Burmistrov to be a part of. Noel was clearly simply playing the veteran where his GM wanted him to play. Vets are chosen over younger kids because they on balance can be more trusted. While HF posters may have believed Burmistrov to be a better choice, the professionals at that time obviously didn't.

To reiterate, the Jets state they want character players that want to play here. Recent examples of Burmistrov's character include his laughing it up on the bench while the Jets were being drubbed by New Jersey (that directly preceded his benching you may recall); another example includes his trashing of both his coach and a teammate upon his exit. He also asked to be traded, meaning he probably didn't want to be here. To summarize, that isn't the sort of a player that a team that wants to build a winning culture would wish to retain, in my own view, though the mileage of most here clearly varies.
 
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garret9

AKA#VitoCorrelationi
Mar 31, 2012
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Again, no he cited that he didn't know why. He speculated it was to teach him lesson in the same breath.

IE: he wasn't sure why he wasn't loaned out.

Again, he could be lying, but that is the only thing he said.
 

Blue Shakehead

because lol Jets
Mar 18, 2011
3,098
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www.becauseloljets.com
Burmi is a more valuable asset to the Jets while playing in North America.

This is the whole story, why are people getting their panties in a bunch attacking the kid?

The phrase "panties in a bunch" is actually quite insulting. Maybe AIH can do a feature on this hurtful phrase in their weekly column looking at racism and sexism in sports fan culture?
 

JetsFan815

Replacement Level Poster
Jan 16, 2012
19,271
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To reiterate, the Jets state they want character players that want to play here. Recent examples of Burmistrov's character include his laughing it up on the bench while the Jets were being drubbed by New Jersey (that directly preceded his benching you may recall); another example includes his trashing of both his coach and a teammate upon his exit. He also asked to be traded. To summarize, that isn't the sort of a player that a team that wants to build a winning culture would wish to retain, in my own view, though the mileage of most here clearly varies.

You have absolutely no idea about the context of that situation. Jumping to conclusions is pointless.
 

Grind

Stomacheache AllStar
Jan 25, 2012
6,539
127
Manitoba
That is near meaningless. Using public opinion as some sort of an arbiter of what is the correct position is frankly a poor position from which to argue. Brittney Spears/Bieber and others of their ilk are usually far more popular versus more worthy artists. Popular opinion is clearly in the wrong there as such. Pubic opinions regarding the equities markets are often sampled by many professional traders so that they may do the opposite if public opinion is heavily slanted to one side - because the public is usually wrong.

What we know; many HF posters wanted Burmistrov to play ahead of Jokinen, yet a professional hockey organization chose to do the opposite. Jokinen wasn't paid well by Chevy to play behind a 21 y/o. He was more likely brought in to solidify an organizational weakness down the middle - a weakness they likely identified and considered Burmistrov to be a part of. Noel was clearly simply playing the veteran where his GM wanted him to play. Vets are chosen over younger kids because they on balance can be more trusted. While HF posters may have believed Burmistrov to be a better choice, the professionals obviously didn't.

To reiterate, the Jets state they want character players that want to play here. Recent examples of Burmistrov's character include his laughing it up on the bench while the Jets were being drubbed by New Jersey (that directly preceded his benching you may recall); another example includes his trashing of both his coach and a teammate upon his exit. He also asked to be traded. To summarize, that isn't the sort of a player that a team that wants to build a winning culture would wish to retain, in my own view, though the mileage of most here clearly varies.

Did we ever get confirmation of this? The only real quote i ever remember is him saying he was relieved he wasn't traded after the deadline.

I think his character issues are overblown. I think jets management was probably way more ok with him returning to the KHL then a lot of posters on here are.

---- unrelated to the above quote -----

the main thing I think that Garret and Truck are arguing is that some people seem to be holding spite/grudge above whats most effective for the organization.

More talent = a better organization.

whether that's talent that comes back from Russia or talent that we acquire by trading an equally talented Russian, it's all the same.

It's in every jets fans best interest for Burmi to perform well and come back. Also, other then rewriting history, Burmi looks like NHL player by any metric.

The good riddance to bad rubbish attitude about him is just illogical at it's core. I'ts like hoping for josh morrisey to bust, just because he's not the guy you wanted drafted.

i want the team to succeed. the team is more likely to succeed if A) burmi develops and come back to play for us as a useful player or B)burmi developes and were able to trade him for one, as opposed to C) burmi fails miserably and never come back from Russia cus he's flaky russian whiner.
 

JetsFan815

Replacement Level Poster
Jan 16, 2012
19,271
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After ardently defending Burmistrov's contractual rights as a player, I find it strange that you're heaping praise on him for reporting to the AHL - which was, in fact, his contractual obligation. HE DIDN'T EVEN MAKE A FUSS ABOUT IT!!!! (Errrr..I mean until after he left when he cited publicly that being sent to the AHL was one of the reasons he bolted to the KHL).

Burmistrov isn't my ex-girlfriend who left me for another man? I'm guessing you get a lot of your ideas for this board and quite possibly life in general from The Jerry Springer Show. Oh NO I DI-ENT! JERRY, JERRY, JERRY!

I used the AHL to exemplify Burmi performing his contractual obligation even when he didn't like it when some here are making it appear like Burmi "bolted" to the KHL selfishly without regard to his team or contract like Kovalchuck did. He was professional during his stay in Winnipeg, once he's no longer under contract he is allowed to tell his side of the story.

I used the gf example because some people are acting like as if Burmi did something to personally hurt them.

Not wanting Burmi back is like cutting off your nose to spite your face :shakehead
 

Gump Hasek

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Nov 9, 2005
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You have absolutely no idea about the context of that situation. Jumping to conclusions is pointless.

The context of the situation is that he was filmed laughing on the bench while the Jets were being hammered, and was then benched and then also healthy-scratched for several games immediately following that episode. That isn't on Noel, as that sort of a decision would have first been cleared with his GM.
 

JetsFan815

Replacement Level Poster
Jan 16, 2012
19,271
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The context of the situation is that he was filmed laughing on the bench while the Jets were being hammered, and was then benched and then also healthy-scratched for several games immediately following that episode. That isn't on Noel, as that sort of a decision would have first been cleared with his GM.

You have no idea why he laughed and are jumping to conclusions that it was indicator of him not caring about the team. Maybe he saw something really funny in the crowd? I'm not making excuses for Burmi but you can't use one isolated event to make such a damning point about a player.
 

garret9

AKA#VitoCorrelationi
Mar 31, 2012
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Lot of this happening:
tumblr_lon5josiZy1qzmr3jo1_500.jpg
 

truck

Registered User
Jun 27, 2012
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Did we ever get confirmation of this? The only real quote i ever remember is him saying he was relieved he wasn't traded after the deadline.

I think his character issues are overblown. I think jets management was probably way more ok with him returning to the KHL then a lot of posters on here are.

---- unrelated to the above quote -----

the main thing I think that Garret and Truck are arguing is that some people seem to be holding spite/grudge above whats most effective for the organization.

More talent = a better organization.

whether that's talent that comes back from Russia or talent that we acquire by trading an equally talented Russian, it's all the same.

It's in every jets fans best interest for Burmi to perform well and come back. Also, other then rewriting history, Burmi looks like NHL player by any metric.

The good riddance to bad rubbish attitude about him is just illogical at it's core. I'ts like hoping for josh morrisey to bust, just because he's not the guy you wanted drafted.

i want the team to succeed. the team is more likely to succeed if A) burmi develops and come back to play for us as a useful player or B)burmi developes and were able to trade him for one, as opposed to C) burmi fails miserably and never come back from Russia cus he's flaky russian whiner.

I am not really arguing anything I am just asking for a counterpoint.

Truthfully though, I don't understand all the spite. Nobody here knows the kid and he did some nice things in the community.

If he can come back and make the team better why bock?
 

Grind

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Jan 25, 2012
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I am not really arguing anything I am just asking for a counterpoint. I don't understand all the spite. Nobody here knows the kid and he did some nice things in the community. If he can come back and make the team better why bock?

Yah i don't get it.

Burmi is a capable nhlr.

burmi is property of the winnipeg jets.

burmi signed for 2 years with a KHL team as was his right.

Burmi coming back to north america is best for the jets no matter what. arguing against that for reasons about attitude etc? that doesn't make any sense. at the very least we should be for him coming back, having value, and be traded.

I don't get the hate.
 

Gump Hasek

Spleen Merchant
Nov 9, 2005
10,167
2
222 Tudor Terrace
The good riddance to bad rubbish attitude about him is just illogical at it's core. I'ts like hoping for josh morrisey to bust, just because he's not the guy you wanted drafted.

i want the team to succeed. the team is more likely to succeed if A) burmi develops and come back to play for us as a useful player or B)burmi developes and were able to trade him for one, as opposed to C) burmi fails miserably and never come back from Russia cus he's flaky russian whiner.

Not sure from where you draw that extrapolation. I'd love it if his play elsewhere enables them to trade him for more than peanuts.

Lawless and others reported that Burmistrov wanted to be traded, and that Chevy tried in vain to do so. That doesn't sound like a guy with a solid future here.

Again, it isn't simply about "good riddance to bad rubbish"; NHL history is littered with talented players that organizations intentionally move due their character. Talent isn't the sole arbiter - though some here for some reason apparently wish to claim it should be. If Chevy is a man of his word and means it when he says they only want character players that want to play here, then that speaks to that he is trying to build a winning culture in the room. Winners don't trash an organization and teammates upon their exit, and they don't place blame on others for what are the results of their own actions.
 

truck

Registered User
Jun 27, 2012
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The phrase "panties in a bunch" is actually quite insulting. Maybe AIH can do a feature on this hurtful phrase in their weekly column looking at racism and sexism in sports fan culture?

Weekly column? 3 such pieces in 3 years isn`t quite weekly - unless you are referring to Cara`s recent work.

If you have a request for her, send it via Twitter @HappyCaraT
 
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Gump Hasek

Spleen Merchant
Nov 9, 2005
10,167
2
222 Tudor Terrace
You have no idea why he laughed and are jumping to conclusions that it was indicator of him not caring about the team. Maybe he saw something really funny in the crowd? I'm not making excuses for Burmi but you can't use one isolated event to make such a damning point about a player.

Later, when asked if the TV shot that caught Burmistrov laughing on the bench during a game on the recent road trip indicated he had some maturing to do, Noel said: "I'll just put it this way: I'd sooner keep my thoughts to myself on those things. I'll let you make the assessment on what you think of it. I have my thoughts, but I don't want to share that with you guys."
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sp...rings-meech-home-197725951.html?device=mobile


If you are unable to read between those lines, and recognize that Burmistrov was summarily benched and then scratched for multiple games immediately following that incident, and that those actions would have to have been approved by the GM, then I'm afraid we are finished with this line of conversation. Have a good night.
 

Flair Hay

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I believe the Jets as an organization have handled many things well sice theyve come into the league. And the handling of Burmistrov was not one of them.

There's plenty of logic both ways as to how he was treated and how he handled himself... but I believe three things to be true:

1) it's never too late to say "I'm sorry." This applies to both parties.

2) Burmistrov is younger and a better fit here than Jokinen.

3) Burmistrov will likely be even cheaper to sign than Jokinen because he can't go anywhere besides stay in Russia unless he is traded.

Why dwell on the past, lets bring a good hockey player to Winnipeg for nothing but (for us) plentiful cap space and see what happens. He might even not suck?
 

Bartho

Registered User
Feb 26, 2013
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If you are unable to read between those lines, and recognize that Burmistrov was summarily benched and then scratched for multiple games immediately following that incident, and that those actions would have to have been approved by the GM, then I'm afraid we are finished with this line of conversation. Have a good night.

But how do you know someone wasn't kneeling behind the bench and tickling him?
 

Positive

Enjoy your flight
May 4, 2007
6,155
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It was no secret that Kane, Schief, and Burmi had issues with Noel. Benching Burmi for 4 games at a time when he was playing 2x better than Joker was a joke. The Jets wasted 2.5 years with Noel. Glad Noel is gone.

I don't know if he was 2x better than Olli.

Burmi got about 14:07 per game, ES + PP, 10 pts. Plus some PK time.
Joker got about 17:06 per game, ES + PP 14 pts. No PK time really.

Burmi's CF% 5-on-5 was 51.5% compared to Jokers 48.9%, so yeah, 2.6% there but I don't know if there's any 'twice as good' here. They both stunk to high heaven offensively. He stunk. They both stunk. It's like (I'm sure you guys will identify with this one) saying Wright was twice as good as Thorburn.
 

garret9

AKA#VitoCorrelationi
Mar 31, 2012
21,738
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Hmm, interesting. More info/link please? I'm curious as to sample etc.

Unfortunately I can't link anything more than this:

http://www.amazon.com/Rob-Vollmans-Hockey-Abstract-Vollman/dp/1490493034

... as it is hard copy not an online article. I have all the numbers for KHL, SHL, AHL, FEL, DEL, Czech Pro, CHL leagues & NCAA leagues.

It's an improvement over Desjardins methods here: http://hockeyanalytics.com/Research_files/League_Equivalencies.pdf

This is the same concept that I use also when I do the graphs for our prospects of different leagues in the prospect board.

The numbers have a lot of variance to them, as expected with fluctuation on-ice sh%; however, the trend allows to compare results of different leagues for prospects.
 

Positive

Enjoy your flight
May 4, 2007
6,155
1,490
Osborne Village in the 'Peg
Unfortunately I can't link anything more than this:

http://www.amazon.com/Rob-Vollmans-Hockey-Abstract-Vollman/dp/1490493034

... as it is hard copy not an online article. I have all the numbers for KHL, SHL, AHL, FEL, DEL, Czech Pro, CHL leagues & NCAA leagues.

It's an improvement over Desjardins methods here: http://hockeyanalytics.com/Research_files/League_Equivalencies.pdf

This is the same concept that I use also when I do the graphs for our prospects of different leagues in the prospect board.

The numbers have a lot of variance to them, as expected with fluctuation on-ice sh%; however, the trend allows to compare results of different leagues for prospects.

I thought the number might have came from this old thread. But it is far lower. It's also pretty dated and don't really like how OP came up with the number.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=716181
 
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