Why does Steven Stamkos struggle in the playoffs?

[Leonardo87]

On the GW goal last night Stamkos trusted his line-mates, dumped the puck instead of trying to carry it over. Killorn and Callahan did their thing, were able to start a play, Callahan found a wide open Coburn and Boom here we are going into the 2nd round.

When Stamkos gets a little dirty he is playing much better and opening the game up and creating chances. There was a chance by him that he redirected a pass from Killorn, if he keeps doing this he will score. He needs to be handling the puck the least on that line and getting himself in front of the net, or helping out behind the net and make those quick passes to wide open line-mates.

The days of MSL are gone, and he will need to adjust his game a little and then should be able to get back to that player we want him to be. It's not about the point production, think that has been more than fine, last night he had more heads up plays, got in position to shoot, and really thought before executing and that is the player we need him to be. If he builds up from last night the goals will come sooner than later.

 

[JayKing]

He'll get his points against the Habs like he usually does, but the question is can he be a difference maker? (but then again, will he even have to be considering how well the triplets perform against us)

 

[DFC]

He'll get his points against the Habs like he usually does, but the question is can he be a difference maker? (but then again, will he even have to be considering how well the triplets perform against us)

If we're relying on Callahan to be the difference maker, we're in trouble. That's not his role. There are 5-6 guys we look at to score big goals ahead of him. Callahan's mostly there to create space, play physically, and lead by example. Offense is secondary, and I don't think anyone believes he was signed for offense. We have plenty of offense.

 

[Leonardo87]

If we're relying on Callahan to be the difference maker, we're in trouble. That's not his role. There are 5-6 guys we look at to score big goals ahead of him. Callahan's mostly there to create space, play physically, and lead by example. Offense is secondary, and I don't think anyone believes he was signed for offense. We have plenty of offense.

Callahan was brought in to play the 2nd line with Flip and perhaps Palat. What he is doing now, and people of all fan bases need to understand he is playing a higher spot that expected. He is not a MSL, never will be.

Callahan will score those clutch goals from time to time, and put up offense, but he is not and should never be the go to guy. He is the guy who will help shutdown the opponents top forwards, and play a physical style of hockey, while checking and crashing in front of the net, also kill penalties(Not sure why Coop has not given him PK time year) and is a PP specialist.

 

[Leafs87]

He got unlucky last game

 

[sr edler]

His linemates are killorn and Callahan. Those two are like 3rd line players on most teams.

Oh, so he can't create plays on his own? He needs someone to feed him?

 

[Sky04]

Oh, so he can't create plays on his own? He needs someone to feed him?

Yeah it's a terrible excuse that even most Lightning fans don't use, it's the outside Stamkos lovers that are using that one.

Killorn has elevated his game considerably in the playoffs and Callahan has also upped his game, Steven Stamkos has not.
If Killorn is outscoring you and Callahan has the same points as you do, you certainly do not get to use the linemate excuse.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I love Tyler Johnson, but he won't be enough. Price is the great wall of China, it's gonna take a lot to get pucks past him.

 

[tntkid]

Stammer will start scoring soon.

This guy is the real deal.

 

[DFC]

I love Tyler Johnson, but he won't be enough. Price is the great wall of China, it's gonna take a lot to get pucks past him.

We only have to score more than they do. People somehow assume that only Steven Stamkos can score on TB. Our 4th line center had 15 goals.

 

[zeykshade]

Yeah it's a terrible excuse that even most Lightning fans don't use, it's the outside Stamkos lovers that are using that one.

Killorn has elevated his game considerably in the playoffs and Callahan has also upped his game, Steven Stamkos has not.
If Killorn is outscoring you and Callahan has the same points as you do, you certainly do not get to use the linemate excuse.

Stamkos is a winger. Not a center. Don't care where he plays on a line, his game (apart from the start of the 2013-14 season through Nov. 11th) is that of a winger. No one on the planet would consider his game to be anything remotely related to a play driving/puck possession pivot man. This is not to say he can't make plays. He can. But no one will confuse him for Backstrom, Tavares or Crosby. That's fine, but you need to build a line with a play making winger for him if you're going to let him be the "Center". The advent of the Triplets, Stamkos' inability to have chemistry with Filppular(too slow) and Jon Cooper's "hate" of Drouin, left Stammer with not many options for linemates.

Next season will be interesting to see where Jo Drouin lines up. Some of us have even postulated that Drouin may be in SYR to start the year. That would suck serious balls.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

We only have to score more than they do. People somehow assume that only Steven Stamkos can score on TB. Our 4th line center had 15 goals.

The league's best attack against the league's best goalie. Should be an interesting matchup.
It's good that the Lightning signed Johnson for a cheap $3.3M contract. He could ask $6-7M easily today.

 

[DFC]

The league's best attack against the league's best goalie. Should be an interesting matchup.
It's good that the Lightning signed Johnson for a cheap $3.3M contract. He could ask $6-7M easily today.

Good problems, right?

When his contract is up two years from now, we might have to pay him huge. It really can't be overstated how good he was for us this year.

 

[Wings4Life]

Stamkos struggles because it's much harder to get going when you have teams double teaming you with their top shutdown pair come the playoffs.

He is a top 10 player but he is not in the same class as Malkin, Ovechkin, and Crosby, players who have proven they can separate themselves from their peers, even in the toughest of games.

 

[Bolt32]

Stamkos struggles because it's much harder to get going when you have teams double teaming you with their top shutdown pair come the playoffs.

He is a top 10 player but he is not in the same class as Malkin, Ovechkin, and Crosby, players who have proven they can separate themselves from their peers, even in the toughest of games.

He really wasn't double teamed though. Johnson was, and he still produced. Stamkos shut himself down. Johnson did what we needed Stamkos to do, and couldn't do.

 

[Man Rocket]

I think its been a fluke, he's better than what he's shown. IIRC he draws the other teams top pairing and shutdown line? Leaving the dynamic 2nd line to take over. I think he shows up big this series

 

[Corto]

I think its been a fluke, he's better than what he's shown. IIRC he draws the other teams top pairing and shutdown line? Leaving the dynamic 2nd line to take over. I think he shows up big this series

As I understand it, teams have been matching up their top defensive players against Johnson/Palat/Kucherov for a long while now, starting somewhere in the middle of the regular season.

 

[Butchered]

He doesn't have the right linemates.

He's not dependent upon them, given he scored 40+ playing with Killorn and Callahan, but he could do so much more with the correct players.

Drouin not being permanently attached to Stamkos is absolutely criminal IMO. They are doing JD27 zero favors by sitting him on the bench. They should have just left him in juniors if this was their plan.

Stamkos needs someone who can make him move. He doesn't have that. He needs someone dangerous that can distribute the puck to free Stamkos from defender attention and allow him to sneak off to the side and set up for his shot.

He needs Drouin. One of Killorn or Callahan should stay up. A guy who can dig in the corners and get the puck to Drouin so he can go to work.

Instead, we sit him on the bench and continue to play Stamkos with two grinders.

 

[Leonardo87]

He needs Drouin. One of Killorn or Callahan should stay up. A guy who can dig in the corners and get the puck to Drouin so he can go to work.

Instead, we sit him on the bench and continue to play Stamkos with two grinders.

Stamkos needs a Drouin type and a Callahan/Killorn type. Since Callahan is an elite grinder he is the best choice, but has good heads up play making skills, like he showed on the GW goal in Game 7, and he can score goals also, potentially around 25 in a season.

Stamkos had 43 Goals and over 70 points this season, and Callahan was not on his line for the entire season, he had his best offense with Callahan than without this season. Who's to say he would not have had more points, as well as Callahan, if they were together the entire season.

I researched some numbers for Stamkos 5 on 5 over the last five seasons, this is what I got...

GF/60 (Goals for per 60 mins) GA/60 (Goals against per 60 mins) CF% (Corsi %)

2014-15 - GF/60 (3.25) - GA/60 (2.14) - CF% 53.8 w/ Callahan

2013/14 - Did not use this season because of his injury
2012-13 - GF/60 (2.95) GA/60 (2.84) - CF% 50.1 w/MSL
2011-12 - GF/60 (3.66) GA/60 (2.88) - CF% 47.5 w/MSL
2010-11 - GF/60 (3.39) GA/60 (2.35) - CF% 51.1 w/MSL
2009-10 - GF/60 (3.06) GA/60 (2.99) - CF% 49.8 w/MSL

The only season where Stamkos' numbers were significantly higher was in the 2011-12 season. No surprise on the Goals Allowed, since Callahan is a better defensive forward than MSL.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I think its been a fluke, he's better than what he's shown. IIRC he draws the other teams top pairing and shutdown line? Leaving the dynamic 2nd line to take over. I think he shows up big this series

No, Stamkos draws the second pairing because his line is really the 2nd line.
TKO is Tampa's 1st line and it's the best line in the league IMO.

 

[Bolt32]

He doesn't have the right linemates.

He's not dependent upon them, given he scored 40+ playing with Killorn and Callahan, but he could do so much more with the correct players.

Drouin not being permanently attached to Stamkos is absolutely criminal IMO. They are doing JD27 zero favors by sitting him on the bench. They should have just left him in juniors if this was their plan.

Stamkos needs someone who can make him move. He doesn't have that. He needs someone dangerous that can distribute the puck to free Stamkos from defender attention and allow him to sneak off to the side and set up for his shot.

He needs Drouin. One of Killorn or Callahan should stay up. A guy who can dig in the corners and get the puck to Drouin so he can go to work.

Instead, we sit him on the bench and continue to play Stamkos with two grinders.

To be fair I thought Killorn and Callahan both played Fantastic last series. The only reason why that line was Anchored was because of Stamkos. Both guys stepped their games up, Killorn by a crap ton. Stamkos was no where to be found.

 

[Leonardo87]

No, Stamkos draws the second pairing because his line is really the 2nd line.
TKO is Tampa's 1st line and it's the best line in the league IMO.

That really sums it up.

 

[Leonardo87]

To be fair I thought Killorn and Callahan both played Fantastic last series. The only reason why that line was Anchored was because of Stamkos. Both guys stepped their games up, Killorn by a crap ton. Stamkos was no where to be found.

Some people criticizing Callahan for not scoring any goals so he is automatically a disappearing act for the 1st round according to HF 101 standards, lol. He had two huge assists in this series that led to the GW goals, one was the series winning goals. As per Killorn he had the GW goal in game 2, and had a huge goal in Game 6. Killorn and Cally work very well together and when you have a 40 goal scorer on your line, you are prone to pass and set him up, but because Stamkos was smelling the flowers for most of the series, these guys had to take control of that line and they did and started to shoot more in the end. To blame Stamkos series performance on these guys is just not right.

 

[nhljohnson]

Stamkos needs a Drouin type and a Callahan/Killorn type. Since Callahan is an elite grinder he is the best choice, but has good heads up play making skills, like he showed on the GW goal in Game 7, and he can score goals also, potentially around 25 in a season.

Stamkos had 43 Goals and over 70 points this season, and Callahan was not on his line for the entire season, he had his best offense with Callahan than without this season. Who's to say he would not have had more points, as well as Callahan, if they were together the entire season.

I researched some numbers for Stamkos 5 on 5 over the last five seasons, this is what I got...

GF/60 (Goals for per 60 mins) GA/60 (Goals against per 60 mins) CF% (Corsi %)

2014-15 - GF/60 (3.25) - GA/60 (2.14) - CF% 53.8 w/ Callahan

2013/14 - Did not use this season because of his injury
2012-13 - GF/60 (2.95) GA/60 (2.84) - CF% 50.1 w/MSL
2011-12 - GF/60 (3.66) GA/60 (2.88) - CF% 47.5 w/MSL
2010-11 - GF/60 (3.39) GA/60 (2.35) - CF% 51.1 w/MSL
2009-10 - GF/60 (3.06) GA/60 (2.99) - CF% 49.8 w/MSL

The only season where Stamkos' numbers were significantly higher was in the 2011-12 season. No surprise on the Goals Allowed, since Callahan is a better defensive forward than MSL.

While Callahan may very well have a part in this result, there's a lot of team effects (playing in front of Ben Bishop most nights, with a collective roster that is, though younger, much improved and for a different coach / system the past two seasons) potentially at work, too.

 

[DFC]

Stamkos needs a Drouin type and a Callahan/Killorn type. Since Callahan is an elite grinder he is the best choice, but has good heads up play making skills, like he showed on the GW goal in Game 7, and he can score goals also, potentially around 25 in a season.

Stamkos had 43 Goals and over 70 points this season, and Callahan was not on his line for the entire season, he had his best offense with Callahan than without this season. Who's to say he would not have had more points, as well as Callahan, if they were together the entire season.

I researched some numbers for Stamkos 5 on 5 over the last five seasons, this is what I got...

GF/60 (Goals for per 60 mins) GA/60 (Goals against per 60 mins) CF% (Corsi %)

2014-15 - GF/60 (3.25) - GA/60 (2.14) - CF% 53.8 w/ Callahan

2013/14 - Did not use this season because of his injury
2012-13 - GF/60 (2.95) GA/60 (2.84) - CF% 50.1 w/MSL
2011-12 - GF/60 (3.66) GA/60 (2.88) - CF% 47.5 w/MSL
2010-11 - GF/60 (3.39) GA/60 (2.35) - CF% 51.1 w/MSL
2009-10 - GF/60 (3.06) GA/60 (2.99) - CF% 49.8 w/MSL

The only season where Stamkos' numbers were significantly higher was in the 2011-12 season. No surprise on the Goals Allowed, since Callahan is a better defensive forward than MSL.

Most of that is meaningless. The Corsi in particular, since TB's over all team is so much better than any year Stamkos had MSL on his wing. Our defense is light years ahead of where it was with MSL on the team.

Stamkos/Callahan got better when Killorn was added to the wing. But that's two grinders. That excuses Stamkos's drop in scoring, really. (If only that were the problem...)

But Callahan plays the wrong wing to be an ideal long-term winger for Stamkos. Drouin, when playing with Stamkos, was put on the right side a lot, because that's the spot you want someone feeding Stammer from. Callahan's not that playmaker. He's not finding Stamkos in open ice. Part of that's on Stamkos, but we shouldn't pretend a big part of that isn't about Callahan's style of play.