You realize that trades aren't made in vacuums? The real world doesn't work like that. It's possible to lose a trade but improve your team at the same time. I don't think you understand that though.
Why do so many of the media think the Hall-Larsson trade changed the trade market?
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You realize that trades aren't made in vacuums? The real world doesn't work like that. It's possible to lose a trade but improve your team at the same time. I don't think you understand that though.
Dude. I literally explained that to you in a other post
Reading comprehension... you should work on it
Holy **** lmfao. Never said Larsson was garbage. You're making things up. I was making on overly simple example because you seemed to struggle to understand what point others were trying to make.
Just because the trade helped the team, doesn't mean that it was a good trade. That's all anyone was trying to make clear to you.
I'm going to stop. We won't get anywhere, obviously
Aceboogie
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- Aug 25, 2012
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I won't make any bets because I don't have any insight whatsoever into what the exams may or may not do. Neither do you
What I do know is oilers D is top 10 in the league by the numbers. Larsson may or may not have helped that
...and what we do know is that Nylander for Montour would be a drastic overpayment from the Leafs
Dude that's literally the point of trades. To make your team better. And if it makes your team better would that not be considered a good trade?
Or is that too logical for you?
Hockeyisl1fe
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FYI Oilers wouldn't have traded Hall if Pulju hadn't fell on their lap. They would have traded down their pick probably and picked Sergachyov. Removing Hall also gave them a bit cap space, so they were able to sign Lucic. So it was basically Pulju, Larsson, Lucic > Hall, Sergachyov, aquired pick from Vancouver/Calgary. The trade heavily depends on how good Pulju will turn out. They saw him as a good replacement for Hall and took a risk. Imo it was worth it, Pulju and McDavid together in the future could be pure magic.
After talking to many GMs about the cost of some other RHD he was interested in.
Chiarelli: "Hey Ray, want to trade us Larsson?"
Shero: "Ha, ha, ha... are you serious?"
Chiarelli: "Yeah, I'm sure we can work something out."
Shero: "I don't know... (long pause)... I'm listening"
Chiarelli: "You really need a winger, how about Eberle?"
Shero: laughing, laughing laughing...
Chiarelli: "Eberle plus?..."
Shero: "Seriously, Pete, just stop, I am about to **** myself here."
Chiarelli: "RNH?"
Shero: "No. After what Adam showed us this past year, I would need a game changer to pull the trigger ."
Chiarelli: "But one of those guys have to work... those geniuses on HF Boards say defensive minded Dmen aren't worth anything more than Eberle+pieces or RNH+pieces... because you know... goals and assists and all that stuff... yada, yada, yada"
Shero: "Yeah, those HF guys are **** clowns. I just signed Lars to a sweetheart deal and am very comfortable just sticking with my guy unless you are willing to do something that really hurts. Well, I gotta run Petey"
Chiarelli: "Wait, wait, wait... (long pause, desperation sweats, more long pause)."
Shero: "Pete you still there"
Chiarelli: "Yeah.... how about Taylor Hall for Larsson and a 2nd."
Shero: (pause, thinks to himself, holy crap, then counters) "Larsson for Hall... straight up"
Chiarelli: "You ***** *****. Fine, send me the ***** paperwork" (hangs up)
Shero is nervously smiling on the other end thinking to himself, 'that's a good trade for us, right?'
All the other GMs after the trade... "I would have given them more for a player like Taylor Hall." What they were thinking...
Snow: "I would have traded them Pulock and a 2nd.... that is way better than Larsson."
Poile: "I would have traded them Edmundson and even added a second... Edmundson is Swedish isn't he... Manitoba! WTF!"
Benning: "I just got Gudbranson, but I would have traded Erik to the Oilers... a 3rd OA is better than a 4OA, right?"
Armstrong: "I would have traded him 1 year of Shattenkirk, WTF?"
Fletcher: "I would have traded him Brodin!... and he is Swedish!.. who cares if he plays the left side"
... no GM ever mentioned the name of the "better" right-hand shot defenceman they were offering the Oilers.
Disclaimer: the above is just a dramatization.
My points are:
I believe the NJD got the better player. At the time of the trade I would have thought that Chia could have got Larsson + 2nd/good prospect for Hall but would not have wanted him to play hardball and lose the opportunity for a RHD highly effective Dman. The trade has worked out well for the Oilers and it seems NJD fans are very happy with the trade as well. It's impossible to exactly determine the EXACT effect each player has had on his team because so many other factors are at work at the same time.
I think we are seeing movement on the value of intelligent, system-effective defencemen because that is the way this league continues to transition. Dynamic players and offensive creativity are being suppressed by the rules, coaching and poor officiating. I don't think this is what any fan wants but it is reality.
Chiarelli: "Hey Ray, want to trade us Larsson?"
Shero: "Ha, ha, ha... are you serious?"
Chiarelli: "Yeah, I'm sure we can work something out."
Shero: "I don't know... (long pause)... I'm listening"
Chiarelli: "You really need a winger, how about Eberle?"
Shero: laughing, laughing laughing...
Chiarelli: "Eberle plus?..."
Shero: "Seriously, Pete, just stop, I am about to **** myself here."
Chiarelli: "RNH?"
Shero: "No. After what Adam showed us this past year, I would need a game changer to pull the trigger ."
Chiarelli: "But one of those guys have to work... those geniuses on HF Boards say defensive minded Dmen aren't worth anything more than Eberle+pieces or RNH+pieces... because you know... goals and assists and all that stuff... yada, yada, yada"
Shero: "Yeah, those HF guys are **** clowns. I just signed Lars to a sweetheart deal and am very comfortable just sticking with my guy unless you are willing to do something that really hurts. Well, I gotta run Petey"
Chiarelli: "Wait, wait, wait... (long pause, desperation sweats, more long pause)."
Shero: "Pete you still there"
Chiarelli: "Yeah.... how about Taylor Hall for Larsson and a 2nd."
Shero: (pause, thinks to himself, holy crap, then counters) "Larsson for Hall... straight up"
Chiarelli: "You ***** *****. Fine, send me the ***** paperwork" (hangs up)
Shero is nervously smiling on the other end thinking to himself, 'that's a good trade for us, right?'
All the other GMs after the trade... "I would have given them more for a player like Taylor Hall." What they were thinking...
Snow: "I would have traded them Pulock and a 2nd.... that is way better than Larsson."
Poile: "I would have traded them Edmundson and even added a second... Edmundson is Swedish isn't he... Manitoba! WTF!"
Benning: "I just got Gudbranson, but I would have traded Erik to the Oilers... a 3rd OA is better than a 4OA, right?"
Armstrong: "I would have traded him 1 year of Shattenkirk, WTF?"
Fletcher: "I would have traded him Brodin!... and he is Swedish!.. who cares if he plays the left side"
... no GM ever mentioned the name of the "better" right-hand shot defenceman they were offering the Oilers.
Disclaimer: the above is just a dramatization.
My points are:
- I am sure that Chiarelli shopped the market when trading a player like Hall.
- I am sure he did not start his negotiations for Larsson with Taylor Hall.
- All of the other GMs who criticized Chiarelli post-trade have their own individual opinions about Larsson and their own player, an opinion that may not be shared by all. So if 1, 2 or 5 GMs says Montour has more value than Nylander does that make it true?
- HF posters have no clue what goes on behind the scenes but make posts as though they do.
I believe the NJD got the better player. At the time of the trade I would have thought that Chia could have got Larsson + 2nd/good prospect for Hall but would not have wanted him to play hardball and lose the opportunity for a RHD highly effective Dman. The trade has worked out well for the Oilers and it seems NJD fans are very happy with the trade as well. It's impossible to exactly determine the EXACT effect each player has had on his team because so many other factors are at work at the same time.
I think we are seeing movement on the value of intelligent, system-effective defencemen because that is the way this league continues to transition. Dynamic players and offensive creativity are being suppressed by the rules, coaching and poor officiating. I don't think this is what any fan wants but it is reality.
21 year old rookie with 18GP.... You are (still) not being serious.
Santini could end up being the next Weber for all I and anyone knows but if you think that it is a safe bet that a 21 year old rookie in his first NHL season will replace someone who can log 20+ mins a night against the best fwds in the league then you are (still) out to lunch.
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