Why did the Sharks fire Sutter and Lombardi?
- Thread starter Audio Outlaw
- Start date
It wasn't until sutter went to Calgary and was a gm then his second tenure before he became the coach he is today. He was a good coach with the sharks he's a great coach now it was that experience that led him to where he is now as others have mentioned before. As for Lombardi look at him as well and know you gain that experience to move to another team learn from mistakes. We were starting a new era that time. I believe he was fired right around after Nolan was moved. it's really hard to compare what was then what is now. Drafting development have to be part of this conversation as well. There's no guarantee if those two were still here that the sharks would necessarily have a cup.
Audio Outlaw
Jaded Sharks Fan
That is kind of my point. Where would the Sharks be right now if they still had the Sutter/Lombardi tandem?
Sutter and Lombardi have shown the ability to evolve and overcome their mistakes and obstacles. Can the same be said for McLellan/Wilson? Personally I don't think so. I don't see our staff getting any better. I mean... Jay Woodcroft? Really?
Sutter and Lombardi have shown the ability to evolve and overcome their mistakes and obstacles. Can the same be said for McLellan/Wilson? Personally I don't think so. I don't see our staff getting any better. I mean... Jay Woodcroft? Really?
SoftDumpInTheCorner
Registered User
http://www.mercurynews.com/sharks/ci_25890916/purdy-sutter-lombardi-haunt-sharks
Interesting article about the insight of that 2002 team that imploded.
Interesting article about the insight of that 2002 team that imploded.
RexFeral
Registered Boozer
- Aug 10, 2011
- 192
- 0
You're right! Let's call Tortarlelelooll and recycle somebody's dimwitted ACs and watch our team reign supreme.
Sounds about right; that's basically what I remember.
I also think that Sutter didn't know how to handle some of the higher profile players, cause I do remember that Sutter and Teemu got into a shouting match where Sutter told Teemu to take his Ferrari back to Anaheim or something along those lines...
magic school bus
***********
Sharks were changing owners. They also wanted a new style of play. They said they were going to copy the Ottawa Senators model. They managed to do that, lots of regular season success, no Cup for San Jose.
Sutter style was out, Ron Wilson style in.
Dombardi didn't want Sutter gone and didn't want to be GM anymore. Also, Dombardi was a lousy GM while he was with the Sharks. Every year there were players who he would sign late, messing with the team chemistry. He managed to make probably every mistake possible as a GM while he was here.
I think the new owners wanted Marleau to be the centerpiece. I think that was probably a mistake.
Sutter style was out, Ron Wilson style in.
Dombardi didn't want Sutter gone and didn't want to be GM anymore. Also, Dombardi was a lousy GM while he was with the Sharks. Every year there were players who he would sign late, messing with the team chemistry. He managed to make probably every mistake possible as a GM while he was here.
I think the new owners wanted Marleau to be the centerpiece. I think that was probably a mistake.
In regards to Selanne, I think Nolan didn't like Selanne. Selanne was a good player, but he disrupted the team chemistry and he couldn't hit an open net.
I think Sutter was pissed that Selanne tended to float around and not be productive while he was here. Picking up Selanne was supposed to be the final piece, but it actually destroyed that team.
I think Sutter was pissed that Selanne tended to float around and not be productive while he was here. Picking up Selanne was supposed to be the final piece, but it actually destroyed that team.
Audio Outlaw
Jaded Sharks Fan
From my perspective, that is what I remember hearing about. Sutter was hard on players like Marleau and Teemu because he thought they were too comfortable playing in small market San Jose. The organization wanted to keep Marleau and not Sutter, which I agree was probably a mistake.
Audio Outlaw
Jaded Sharks Fan
Selective memory? And yes, I do like Larry Robinson. That would be the obvious exception.
Gene Parmesan
Dedicated to babies who came feet first
SactoShark
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Linkster
Beard goggles!
Lombardi's reputation was pretty tarnished during / after the Nabokov and Stuart contract holdouts. I thought they had a pretty solid D on paper, but missing Stuart was a big setback.
Lombardi then remained in the GM "wilderness" as a Philly pro scout for 3 years. I guess LA had potential, but it was nowhere near the playoff map in 2006.
In fact, the Doughty contract holdout had eerie echoes of Stuart / Nabby, but Deano pivoted off of it into positive territory. Probably used some hard-learned lessons.
There's one positive from the Sharks' 2002-03 season that I still remember to this day. Cap Raeder coached one NHL game, between Sutter's departure and Wilson's arrival. And that game made Cap Raeder the winningest coach in NHL hockey history: one game, one win, resulting in a points percentage of 1.000.
Lombardi then remained in the GM "wilderness" as a Philly pro scout for 3 years. I guess LA had potential, but it was nowhere near the playoff map in 2006.
In fact, the Doughty contract holdout had eerie echoes of Stuart / Nabby, but Deano pivoted off of it into positive territory. Probably used some hard-learned lessons.
There's one positive from the Sharks' 2002-03 season that I still remember to this day. Cap Raeder coached one NHL game, between Sutter's departure and Wilson's arrival. And that game made Cap Raeder the winningest coach in NHL hockey history: one game, one win, resulting in a points percentage of 1.000.
I remember the fans liking Lombardi even when he was fired. He was instrumental in building a respectable team. Looking back on it, he was probably handcuffed by ownership and the scapegoat for missing the playoffs. He took the fall because of the Nabakov and Stuart holdouts which crippled the season. I blame the players more than the GM, but the Sharks had high expectations and unfortunately Lombardi got fired. Firing Lombardi was probably a bad move, but I think the organization was also very confident in Doug Wilson so they were able to make that move. I think Wilson is every bit as good a GM as Lombardi.
Sutter, on the other hand, wasn't all that great a coach in SJ. He wasn't bad either, but there were definitely complaints among a lot of fans in Sutter's coaching. He had gained a rep for being able to take a team to the playoffs consistently (he was/is a good motivator most of the time and knew how to get a lot out of his players) but there was the thought that he couldn't coach a good system, especially for skilled players, and as a result he wouldn't be able to lead a team deep into the playoffs. I remember the Sharks PP being a sore spot during his tenure and somewhat bad rapport with both younger and skill players (Marleau, Korolyuk, Selanne). Even a guy like Friesen put on 10lbs at the expense of some of his speed to appease Sutter and be more of a grinder.
Sutter has probably learned a lot in the 10 years he's been gone, but even now, Kings fans still moaned about his unwillingness to play guys like Toffoli last season and Pearson this season. Young players that many thought were ready for the NHL, but Sutter sent back to the A. Both guys got called up late in the season and had a big impact on the Kings stretch and playoff runs.
Sutter, on the other hand, wasn't all that great a coach in SJ. He wasn't bad either, but there were definitely complaints among a lot of fans in Sutter's coaching. He had gained a rep for being able to take a team to the playoffs consistently (he was/is a good motivator most of the time and knew how to get a lot out of his players) but there was the thought that he couldn't coach a good system, especially for skilled players, and as a result he wouldn't be able to lead a team deep into the playoffs. I remember the Sharks PP being a sore spot during his tenure and somewhat bad rapport with both younger and skill players (Marleau, Korolyuk, Selanne). Even a guy like Friesen put on 10lbs at the expense of some of his speed to appease Sutter and be more of a grinder.
Sutter has probably learned a lot in the 10 years he's been gone, but even now, Kings fans still moaned about his unwillingness to play guys like Toffoli last season and Pearson this season. Young players that many thought were ready for the NHL, but Sutter sent back to the A. Both guys got called up late in the season and had a big impact on the Kings stretch and playoff runs.
It's been over 10 years. Does it really matter at this point? They earned their pink slips even if they did a lot of good in their time here. Makes little difference now and them getting canned probably helped them evolve as people in their positions.
I truly believe the Sharks would have won the Cup in 2004 if the new ownership didn't interfere that season and we had kept Nolan.
OrrNumber4
Registered User
- Jul 25, 2002
- 15,947
- 5,209
Lombardi was let go specifically because he did not do what the Sharks's owners wanted...they wanted to shed salary and obtain value for players like Selanne and Damphousse. Lombarid overplayed his hand and got nothing for those players.
OrrNumber4
Registered User
- Jul 25, 2002
- 15,947
- 5,209
The Sharks should never have let Mike Ricci and Vincent Damphousse go. Those guys would have provided a lot of nice veteran leadership to the Sharks's teams from 2006-2008 (in theory, Damphousse doesn't retire). DW spent a part of those years just trying to acquire a player like Ricci back...
Tkachuk4MVP
32 Years of Fail
dwood16
Registered User
Look at you guys making excuses for Doug Wilson and the current Sharks.
Please. Lombardi is great GM and always was.
The fact is Lombardi got Carter, Richards and Gaborik instead of the Sharks getting any of that action. And that has made the difference. Did he attain Justin Williams too? Who drafted Kopitar and Quick?
Please. Lombardi is great GM and always was.
The fact is Lombardi got Carter, Richards and Gaborik instead of the Sharks getting any of that action. And that has made the difference. Did he attain Justin Williams too? Who drafted Kopitar and Quick?
hohosaregood
Banned
- Sep 1, 2011
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Well it wasn't Tim Burke. It is just as likely that Tim Burke would still be the head of scouting regardless of Lombardi staying and that essentially means we would not draft Kopitar or Quick anyways. Probably wouldn't even have been in a situation to draft Kopitar either way.
Justin Williams was also looking to be one of the biggest bandaid boys in the league as well when he came to LA. 2 years in a row he only played 30-40 something games.
Doug traded for Boyle who is the leading scorer among Defense. Traded Coyle for Burns. Moved POS Toskala and a guy looking at Jail time for DUI in Mark Bell for a 1st round pick which became Couture.
Drafted Hertl, Couture, Vlasic.
Just because the Sharks haven't one a cup doesn't mean Doug hasn't made good moves. Or that LA makes all the right moves.
Also if they Kings were so good at drafting why did they take Teubert over Karlson? Or Thomas Hickey over Couture, Shattenkirk, McDonagh, Eller, Perron?
See you can play that game two ways.
TomasHertlsRooster
Don’t say eye test when you mean points
Wilson has been more consistent in his GMing where as Lombardi has been better the past 3 years. Wilson took a team that had just missed the playoffs and made the playoffs with them for 11 straight years. Just never really got that mix of luck, injuries, and easy opponents that the Kings got the past 3 years. I'd say Wilson has been the better GM in their tenures with their teams. Lombardi has made a lot of mistakes too. He has 3 albatross contracts on his team in Richards, Brown, and Quick. All 3 of these are absolutely awful.
It can be argued that if Wilson was able to pick up UFAs like Williams, Scuderi (two Kings UFAs off the top of my head), he may have won the cup, and it can also be argued that Lombardi being in LA vs Wilson being in SJ is a reason for Wilson's inability to sign UFAs.
It can be argued that if Wilson was able to pick up UFAs like Williams, Scuderi (two Kings UFAs off the top of my head), he may have won the cup, and it can also be argued that Lombardi being in LA vs Wilson being in SJ is a reason for Wilson's inability to sign UFAs.
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