Who should Detroit avoid at 4th ?

[Marky9er]

Huh? If you’re talking about the WJC, he didn’t make it because he was 17 and it’s just incredibly tough to make that team at 17.

He absolutely blew the doors off for Canada at the Hlinka. I have not heard these concerns about his defensive play or work ethic at all.

I said it because he nearly made the team, and it was likely the difference. Keep the comparison to Rossi in mind because that was the context.



Let the concern be heard, then.

 

[HisNoodliness]

I would take Sanderson over Drysdale every time, because he is left handed defenseman. Best picks for us would be Rossi,
Sanderson, Raymond, Askarov exactly in this order. I would not touch Perfetti, that dude have word bust written all over him.

See for me while Sanderson is left handed, in my viewings Drysdale is better at pretty much everything. I've heard some compelling arguments from people that think Sanderson is the better defender because he gaps up very well and has superior size... But it hasn't been what I've seen. I see Drysdale being more engaged with the play, having much better offensive contributions, being the higher IQ and faster player. He's smaller and a RD. That's it for disadvantages IMO. I project Sanderson as a middle pairing, defensively responsible D. He can PK but not PP at the next level. His skating is great, and he can seperate guys from the puck. Once he has it though, I don't see him having the vision, hands or passing to get it up the ice to our forwards. He's not going to get you controlled possessions and offensive zone entries at the NHL level.

I project Drysdale as a true #1 defenseman and better than anyone we have in the organization. He'd run both our PP and our PK. He's a better prospect than Seider by a lot for me because his skating and vision are just better. He projects as a far more complete defenseman than Hronek for me because of how well he can defend. He's the guy with the fewest question marks and the highest upside besides Raymond (whom has way more question marks) here.

If we end up with too many good RD, we can move one. The talent disparity is such that handedness shouldn't even begin to matter IMO. Drysdale is strictly superior to Sanderson IMO. His skating is strong enough that he can always be between his opponent and the net, angle them to the boards, and when he gets it evade pressure for a controlled exit and then a controlled entry. Once in the offensive zone he has the vision to set up his teammates and lateral mobility to walk the line and get shooting and passing angles.

 

[HisNoodliness]

I voted no on Raymond, Perfetti and Drysdale. IMO they're 7-10 range guys, and I'm still not convinced that Drysdale is going to be anything special on D.

You and I are apparently sworn enemies. Those three are the highest upside options for me here. Drysdale is clearly the best prospect IMO. He's arguably the best skater in the draft class and does everything really well. Raymond could turn into an absolute star because his tools are elite. His production struggled with his limited opportunity, but he also stepped up against his peers. Perfetti is super smart and has great offensive tools. I worry that he can't skate well enough to be an NHL center, but his hands and smarts make him super intriguing.

Holtz is Zadina lite (similar shot but weaker overall offensive capabilities), Sanderson projects as a 2nd pairing D, Rossi has serious questions about his size and speed making his game ineffective at the NHL level (I'd take him before Perfetti tbh), Askarov has fallen apart too much and is a goalie.

 

[ArmChairGM89]

You and I are apparently sworn enemies. Those three are the highest upside options for me here. Drysdale is clearly the best prospect IMO. He's arguably the best skater in the draft class and does everything really well. Raymond could turn into an absolute star because his tools are elite. His production struggled with his limited opportunity, but he also stepped up against his peers. Perfetti is super smart and has great offensive tools. I worry that he can't skate well enough to be an NHL center, but his hands and smarts make him super intriguing.

Holtz is Zadina lite (similar shot but weaker overall offensive capabilities), Sanderson projects as a 2nd pairing D, Rossi has serious questions about his size and speed making his game ineffective at the NHL level (I'd take him before Perfetti tbh), Askarov has fallen apart too much and is a goalie.

We are sworn allies I guess

 

[lilidk]

I said it because he nearly made the team, and it was likely the difference. Keep the comparison to Rossi in mind because that was the context.



Let the concern be heard, then.

"And he lost it to Jimmy Drysdale"
Elite talent.
Is he Zadinas brother from another mother?

 

[Dan10900]

Holtz and Sanderson for sure, I wouldn't pick Perfetti or Drysdale, I could defend Lundell or Askarov, but ideally you go Raymond or Rossi (or not ideally.. leave the better players for the ducks...)

 

[MBH]

See for me while Sanderson is left handed, in my viewings Drysdale is better at pretty much everything. I've heard some compelling arguments from people that think Sanderson is the better defender because he gaps up very well and has superior size... But it hasn't been what I've seen. I see Drysdale being more engaged with the play, having much better offensive contributions, being the higher IQ and faster player. He's smaller and a RD. That's it for disadvantages IMO. I project Sanderson as a middle pairing, defensively responsible D. He can PK but not PP at the next level. His skating is great, and he can seperate guys from the puck. Once he has it though, I don't see him having the vision, hands or passing to get it up the ice to our forwards. He's not going to get you controlled possessions and offensive zone entries at the NHL level.

I project Drysdale as a true #1 defenseman and better than anyone we have in the organization. He'd run both our PP and our PK. He's a better prospect than Seider by a lot for me because his skating and vision are just better. He projects as a far more complete defenseman than Hronek for me because of how well he can defend. He's the guy with the fewest question marks and the highest upside besides Raymond (whom has way more question marks) here.

If we end up with too many good RD, we can move one. The talent disparity is such that handedness shouldn't even begin to matter IMO. Drysdale is strictly superior to Sanderson IMO. His skating is strong enough that he can always be between his opponent and the net, angle them to the boards, and when he gets it evade pressure for a controlled exit and then a controlled entry. Once in the offensive zone he has the vision to set up his teammates and lateral mobility to walk the line and get shooting and passing angles.

Drysdale is not equal to or better than Sanderson on the defensive side of things.


His offense will get there. He's got all the tools.
He's already pretty good. His offense really heated up in the last month of the year.
He's younger than most guys in the draft.
His dad scored nearly 400 goals and was a speed demon. Jake Sanderson has the hockey IQ.

You draft Sanderson and if he and Seider turn out the way they should, we're set on defense for 15 years.
That's our Pronger-Niedermayer.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

You and I are apparently sworn enemies. Those three are the highest upside options for me here. Drysdale is clearly the best prospect IMO. He's arguably the best skater in the draft class and does everything really well. Raymond could turn into an absolute star because his tools are elite. His production struggled with his limited opportunity, but he also stepped up against his peers. Perfetti is super smart and has great offensive tools. I worry that he can't skate well enough to be an NHL center, but his hands and smarts make him super intriguing.

Holtz is Zadina lite (similar shot but weaker overall offensive capabilities), Sanderson projects as a 2nd pairing D, Rossi has serious questions about his size and speed making his game ineffective at the NHL level (I'd take him before Perfetti tbh), Askarov has fallen apart too much and is a goalie.

You mean in one tournament for two weeks once...

 

[Marky9er]

Looking forward to going in circles in this discussion for months on end. Player x is too small we should take players y or z who are also small. OHL is no defense league, we should take player b also from the OHL. Goalie votes are worth 4. 2021 is loaded with LHD so let's reach on one in 2020. Repeat.

I was really hoping we would spend this summer showing off red Lafreniere shirts and watching his clips but this makes the beer go down, too.

 

[Hen Kolland]

If Perfetti had half the defensive effort of Rossi, he'd have been on Team Canada and a top 3 pick. Instead he is garnering comparison to Art Kaliyev. He's an elite offensive talent, and he's brilliant but that's not the question. Will he put in the work? That's the question because you can't Brendl your way to the show.

If there was any truth to any critique you’ve made here, I’m sure we all would have been super aware of it from sources with a lot more credentials than you.

Nobody questions his work ethic, nobody compares him to Arthur Kaliyev. That’s an outrageous suggestion.

 

[Hen Kolland]

I said it because he nearly made the team, and it was likely the difference. Keep the comparison to Rossi in mind because that was the context.



Let the concern be heard, then.

Oh okay, my mistake. In my last post I thought you had no support. This YouTuber definitely has a finger on the pulse of the professional scouting community. Perfetti is allergic to defense and effort and isn’t going to work hard.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

If there was any truth to any critique you’ve made here, I’m sure we all would have been super aware of it from sources with a lot more credentials than you.

Nobody questions his work ethic, nobody compares him to Arthur Kaliyev. That’s an outrageous suggestion.

There are people that don't think he plays with enough urgency. I have heard it.

I don't agree with it, but again I don't agree with almost anything being said by the Rossi crowd. You see what you see I guess.

 

[Marky9er]

If there was any truth to any critique you’ve made here, I’m sure we all would have been super aware of it from sources with a lot more credentials than you.

Nobody questions his work ethic, nobody compares him to Arthur Kaliyev. That’s an outrageous suggestion.

Guilty of hyperbole, you got me. But in comparison to Rossi he is closer to Kaliyev on the defensive side of things and that is swept under the rug when comparing their offense.

Look, I am saying Perfetti has unlimited potential but he also has a lot work to do and there's personal sacrifices that come with that. I don't think that is outrageous at all. I don't know him, I don't know if he has it in him, I just view him as high risk. I don't have credentials, if you don't want to listen to St. Pierre who I like a lot that's fine. I've been watching junior hockey for 25 years and I'm not trying to be an analyst, I'm just a fan. I think he's boom/bust, and he can boom if he wants it.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Guilty of hyperbole, you got me. But in comparison to Rossi he is closer to Kaliyev on the defensive side of things and that is swept under the rug when comparing their offense.

Look, I am saying Perfetti has unlimited potential but he also has a lot work to do and there's personal sacrifices that come with that. I don't think that is outrageous at all. I don't know him, I don't know if he has it in him, I just view him as high risk. I don't have credentials, if you don't want to listen to St. Pierre who I like a lot that's fine. I've been watching junior hockey for 25 years and I'm not trying to be an analyst, I'm just a fan. I think he's boom/bust, and he can boom if he wants it.

But I would guess Devellano and Osgood have a good understanding of that and with him playing where the Wings see him constantly, if they make that pick they don't have those concerns. If he had compete level issues in their eyes he wouldn't even be talked about we know that about Yzerman's staff. He seems to be a guy they like by the rumors so that says a lot about where they think he could wind up and if they think he has a winning makeup to get better. Maybe they are wrong, it does happen.

I think he has work to do for sure. I think he does have a lot of room to grow though. I think Rossi has work to do once he gets to this level where his size and skating will be exploited, I don't think he has very much room to grow would be my argument.

 

[HisNoodliness]

You mean in one tournament for two weeks once...

Yeah I suppose so, but it's most of what I've seen of Askarov and was his biggest tournament of the year. Those were the games that I expect an elite player to elevate their game. Instead he let in a lot of squeakers and was obviously shaken. I'm gun-shy about taking a goalie with a first at all, let alone at 4th OA. If I do, he is going to have to impress in pretty much every viewing. He hasn't.

Honestly watching Askarov I can't argue he's a bad pick technically. He is big, moves well, and tracks the play really well. He can make that desperation save but rarely has to. He also let's pucks through him and I've seen that haunt goalies. Anders Lindback would have been one of the best goalies in the league if he could stop pucks between his arm and his body and five-hole. I have no confidence trying to project that Askarov will improve there and continue to grow in general. He still has a lot of developing to do and goalies are so unpredictable for me.

So if he wanted to be picked 4th, he had to look really good at the WJC. Even if he'd done great there, I'd rather Raymond, Drysdale, Perfetti etc.

 

[Dotter]

If Yzerman drafts any of these guys I'll be consumed by anger:

Rossi
Lundell
Holz
Sanderson

My PLEASE (for the love of god) DRAFT:

Perfetti
Drysdal
Askarov

My heart and my head says Yzerman is drafting PERFETTI. He seems like the consensus guy and makes the most sense. And has the highest upside and could be the best blue-chip prospect available in the group.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Yeah I suppose so, but it's most of what I've seen of Askarov and was his biggest tournament of the year. Those were the games that I expect an elite player to elevate their game. Instead he let in a lot of squeakers and was obviously shaken. I'm gun-shy about taking a goalie with a first at all, let alone at 4th OA. If I do, he is going to have to impress in pretty much every viewing. He hasn't.

Honestly watching Askarov I can't argue he's a bad pick technically. He is big, moves well, and tracks the play really well. He can make that desperation save but rarely has to. He also let's pucks through him and I've seen that haunt goalies. Anders Lindback would have been one of the best goalies in the league if he could stop pucks between his arm and his body and five-hole. I have no confidence trying to project that Askarov will improve there and continue to grow in general. He still has a lot of developing to do and goalies are so unpredictable for me.

So if he wanted to be picked 4th, he had to look really good at the WJC. Even if he'd done great there, I'd rather Raymond, Drysdale, Perfetti etc.

I guess if that is your sample size, he pretty much single handled stole the U-18s the year before, beating a historically good USA side. He was lights out in that tournament and has been fantastic at the Hlinka. The WJCs along with a stretch coming in and out of them so about really a months time is the only time Askarov has looked really human for the last three years.

I could go a lot of different ways at four. I think we need a homerun swing so I am more on the Raymond, Drysdale, Perfetti and Askarov train. Those guys could all be big time impact players. I also have a belief that Sanderson can turn into a really good player, but that has a longer build feel to me. I like his package but I see him as more the McDonagh or ultimate ceiling left handed Pietrangelo than an explosive offensive D-man. I realize Pietrangelo puts up good numbers and really has improved his shot but I always thought of him as defense first which is how I feel about Sanderson. I think sometimes people forget how important it really is to defend, he is a player your coach is always going to trust.

I think if you draft Drysdale at some point in the next three years we are likely trading out Hronek. Now that should bring back a massive asset, but I do think drafting Drysdale impacts him significantly. If they think he is the best player though they should pick him, I really am BPA there are just a few guys I don't see the ceiling on for a 4th pick.

 

[lilidk]

Drysdale is not equal to or better than Sanderson on the defensive side of things.


His offense will get there. He's got all the tools.
He's already pretty good. His offense really heated up in the last month of the year.
He's younger than most guys in the draft.
His dad scored nearly 400 goals and was a speed demon. Jake Sanderson has the hockey IQ.

You draft Sanderson and if he and Seider turn out the way they should, we're set on defense for 15 years.
That's our Pronger-Niedermayer.

Wonder if they going 4 and 5

 

[Killerjas]

If Yzerman drafts any of these guys I'll be consumed by anger:

Rossi
Lundell
Holz
Sanderson

My PLEASE (for the love of god) DRAFT:

Perfetti
Drysdal
Askarov

My heart and my head says Yzerman is drafting PERFETTI. He seems like the consensus guy and makes the most sense. And has the highest upside and could be the best blue-chip prospect available in the group.

I understand not liking Sanderson and Lundell, but why don't you like Rossi? Also, you want us to pick Askarov with our 4th overall pick when he is projected to go between 10 and 20? You want us to drop down?

 

[Marky9er]

But I would guess Devellano and Osgood have a good understanding of that and with him playing where the Wings see him constantly, if they make that pick they don't have those concerns. If he had compete level issues in their eyes he wouldn't even be talked about we know that about Yzerman's staff. He seems to be a guy they like by the rumors so that says a lot about where they think he could wind up and if they think he has a winning makeup to get better. Maybe they are wrong, it does happen.

I think he has work to do for sure. I think he does have a lot of room to grow though. I think Rossi has work to do once he gets to this level where his size and skating will be exploited, I don't think he has very much room to grow would be my argument.

Honestly I was painting a shelf in the garage pondering if the Wings connected in Saginaw had told him to mail it in a little so they could scoop him. Yes that's ridiculous but I'm bored af. As far as Rossi I think he might actually get some pro games in before the draft so that'd be something to gauge. I get the argument that he's close to a finished product, but I have also seen a dedication to his craft and I wouldn't bet against that. I think he could top out a little lower than we'd like, I don't argue that. My gut is saying Raymond but he's one I'm less familiar with and I'm not convinced 100%. I think he's our best shot at a true super star, but just a gut feeling.

 

[HisNoodliness]

I guess if that is your sample size, he pretty much single handled stole the U-18s the year before, beating a historically good USA side. He was lights out in that tournament and has been fantastic at the Hlinka. The WJCs along with a stretch coming in and out of them so about really a months time is the only time Askarov has looked really human for the last three years.

I could go a lot of different ways at four. I think we need a homerun swing so I am more on the Raymond, Drysdale, Perfetti and Askarov train. Those guys could all be big time impact players. I also have a belief that Sanderson can turn into a really good player, but that has a longer build feel to me. I like his package but I see him as more the McDonagh or ultimate ceiling left handed Pietrangelo than an explosive offensive D-man. I realize Pietrangelo puts up good numbers and really has improved his shot but I always thought of him as defense first which is how I feel about Sanderson. I think sometimes people forget how important it really is to defend, he is a player your coach is always going to trust.

I think if you draft Drysdale at some point in the next three years we are likely trading out Hronek. Now that should bring back a massive asset, but I do think drafting Drysdale impacts him significantly. If they think he is the best player though they should pick him, I really am BPA there are just a few guys I don't see the ceiling on for a 4th pick.

Yeah I think because of when we've viewed him as well as different philosophies on team building (I just don't think top 5 NHL goalie is as valuable an asset as an average first line forward or defenseman), we're going to be at odds about Askarov.

I totally agree that we need to swing for the fences and get a high impact player, and that's why I'm big on Drysdale and Raymond at 4. I think either has a very good shot at being the best Red Wing- full stop.

If we end up trading Seider or Hronek because we draft Drysdale and all three are great, that's totally fine with me. Presumably we'll get equal value back in the trade and be able to address a weakness- hopefully at center. I'm not quite full-on BPA as I think goalies and wingers are less valuable than centers and defenseman, but the prospects have to be really close for me to let position (and handedness even moreso) factor into it. So whatever the result of taking Drysdale, I think he's the BPA so I take him.

Yeah I like the McDonagh comparison for Sanderson. But I think prime McDonagh is his best case scenario and modern second-pairing McDonagh is his realistic projection. I think there are guys that will impact the game a lot more than that available so I'm a hard no on Sanderson. Drysdale just has so much more potential and is even safer. His game is already so mature. I really think he's going to be a first pairing D in the mold of a faster Heiskanen. I love guys that skate like him. It's why I also love Stutzle and Drysdale is an even better skater IMO.

 

[SantosHalper]

Never trust a goalie. They aren’t normal people.

This.

Never draft them, sign them from College, Europe or UFA markets. Or trade surplus prospects for a young goalies.

 

[Hen Kolland]

This.

Never draft them, sign them from College, Europe or UFA markets. Or trade surplus prospects for a young goalies.

You’re starting to understand. Just play without one

 

[Bench]

The fact people are more spooked at the idea of drafting a goalie in the top 5 than a god damn 5'8" smurf center to play NHL hockey is pretty yikes from where I'm sitting.

 

[Syckle78]

I don't know anything about them. So I'm just going to say what I always so. Do.Not.Draft.Anyone.With.Average.or.Worse.Skating.