Who’s this years scapegoat? Or spacegoat?
- Thread starter Obe2kenobe
- Start date
OgeeOgelthorpe
Baldina
- Feb 29, 2020
- 17,225
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I think Larkin has a lot of pride and knows that his last two seasons were garbage. We also have much improved ability to get the puck out of our zone that we simply haven't had since Lidstrom retired so that will help Larkin to not play 45 of every 60 seconds in his zone. Seider is incredible at reading the forecheck and making a play despite pressure. Leddy is also the best LD we've had since 2015 Nik Kronwall.
My worry is that Houda, being the "brilliant" tactician that he is along with Blashill's low impact system will restrain these two. They can both skate and pass really well but if we see that they aren't jumping into the play and pushing things forward, or if they're chipping it off the glass as often as they are running a structured breakout then they need to can these f***ing coaches.
BinCookin
Registered User
If the point is to find out who everyone will complain about... I predict Zadina and Rasmussen for not "living up to expectations". (Mostly because those are unrealistic expectations, but so be it).
Spacegoat.. Vrana kills it this year.
Spacegoat.. Vrana kills it this year.
Number1RedWingsFan52
Registered User
Agreed. DDK will take abuse if the team gets scored on while he's on the bench. Blashill will take abuse while he's on the bench.
Runners up: Anyone not acquired by Yzerman.
Henkka
Registered User
jkutswings
hot piss hockey
- Jul 10, 2014
- 11,047
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There's nobody to blame for what went wrong...
...WHEN NOTHING WENT WRONG!
Wings win the President's Trophy!
Wings win the Stanley Cup!
Vrana wins the Richard!
Zadina wins the Art Ross!
Larkin wins the Selke!
Seider wins the Norris and Calder!
Nedeljkovic wins the Vezina!
Suter wins the Lady Bing!
Blashill wins the Jack Adams!
Alright alright. I'm done kidding around.
But I do think that regardless of wins and losses, there will start to be enough fun this year that no scapegoat will be necessary.
...WHEN NOTHING WENT WRONG!
Wings win the President's Trophy!
Wings win the Stanley Cup!
Vrana wins the Richard!
Zadina wins the Art Ross!
Larkin wins the Selke!
Seider wins the Norris and Calder!
Nedeljkovic wins the Vezina!
Suter wins the Lady Bing!
Blashill wins the Jack Adams!
Alright alright. I'm done kidding around.
But I do think that regardless of wins and losses, there will start to be enough fun this year that no scapegoat will be necessary.
Ricelund
̶W̶e̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶o̶u̶r̶ ̶t̶e̶a̶m̶
Zadina or Larkin.
I can already hear the "Larkin's not doing enough to motivate the team! Give Seider the 'C'!"
I can already hear the "Larkin's not doing enough to motivate the team! Give Seider the 'C'!"
Gniwder
Registered User
Too late, everyone's already responding to this one.
That's a good pick right there, Houda.
Houda spacegoat? You da spacegoat, lol.
ricky0034
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2010
- 15,060
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Vrana
he's the shiny new guy that did well in the handful of games he played here last year
I don't think people will react well to the reality of what a full year under Blashill will do to him
most of the other guys people are naming in this thread were already bad last year so I don't think the reaction will be quite the same
he's the shiny new guy that did well in the handful of games he played here last year
I don't think people will react well to the reality of what a full year under Blashill will do to him
most of the other guys people are naming in this thread were already bad last year so I don't think the reaction will be quite the same
If the Blashill black hole of offense is so dramatic, why have Nyquist and Tatar not yielded any discernable difference in their offense since leaving?
Certainly if the effect is strong enough to post about as often as it is done so on this forum, we'd be able to measure it somehow with the quality players that have left the roster.
And to say nothing of someone like AA, who had a career year with Blashill well beyond what he demonstrated with new coaches.
Mantha had 4 goals in 19 games with the Capitals. Those 4 goals game in the first 4 games he played. Zero in the next 15. Streaky scorer on Detroit, leaves Detroit, oh my streaky scorer still.
I know he's an easy target because he's been the boss to the worst Wings teams of our generation, but if he's genuinely handicapping players I feel like we would have something by now that shows when they leave it's a dramatic difference. Instead these guys perform about the same, more or less.
ricky0034
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2010
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because it does long-term damage, nobodies gonna just leave here and be instantly better it'll take time to recover from if they ever even do
Nyquist went to a Columbus team that was also really bad offensively(his 42 points were 2nd on the team and nobody on the team even hit 50 points) and still produced pretty similarly in his first full year there to what he's historically done(then got injured this year so hasn't played since then)
Tatar is just an awful example on your part, he was a bit worse this year than the last couple but his first full year in Montreal was pretty similar to his career best as a Wing(and certainly better than he'd been since then) and then only 14 Wingers put up more points than Tatar did in 2019-20,that's his career best by a lot and it came in a year where he lead his team in scoring by 14 points to boot
AA has never proven capable of producing anything close to his 30 goal year so there's something of a fluke element there as well, so far he's had only the one shortened season(on another bad offensive team) away from here and produced pretty similarly, it remains to be seen how he does once he's had a bit more time away
Mantha has yet to even start a season with another team yet
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Lazlo Hollyfeld
The jersey ad still sucks
- Mar 4, 2004
- 28,657
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I don't hate Blash as much as many here, but I do think last season was the absolute peak of "low event hockey" we've seen from him as coach of the Red Wings.
Now that he's got a few more guys that can move the puck and a brand new contract, hopefully he'll loosen the reigns a tiny bit.
Obe2kenobe
Registered User
Gonna be tough call for “spacegoat” this year. Probably Larkin if he doesn’t get back to his old self. But I think (hope) he gets his mojo back.
It will probably be whoever Blashill gives a bigger role than they have had in the past, and doesn’t perform/produce. I’m going with Rasmussen.
I don’t expect much from Dekeyser is why I didn’t go with him.
It will probably be whoever Blashill gives a bigger role than they have had in the past, and doesn’t perform/produce. I’m going with Rasmussen.
I don’t expect much from Dekeyser is why I didn’t go with him.
Run the Jewels
Make Detroit Great Again
I'd go with Zadina because there are still people holding a candle for him to become a 30+ goal scorer. He doesn't appear to be that guy and there will be lots of back and forth about how he ain't what we thought he was and the defenders complaining about how Blash misuses him. I thought about choosing Rasmussen but I don't think anyone really holds out hope any longer that he can be a scoring line pivot. The question is whether he's a bottom 6 center or winger. I think he's ultimately a winger.
You've got built-in excuses for every scenario.
If they remain the same offensively, well, that's because they've been ruined. And undoing such ruining takes...years?
Or you say Tatar is a "terrible example" but also "first full year in Montreal was pretty similar to his career best as a Wing."
Yes, that's the point. All these players look basically identical to how they did on Detroit under the black hole of Blashill. Although you did skip over Tatar's failure in Vegas and how he just spent the entire playoffs a healthy scratch on a roster that was dying for scoring. Hmm, he's a bit up and down at times it seems. Like always.
Anyway, if Blashill was such a serious detriment (as you imply he ruins players for a long time), you'd think there would be a single and concrete example of a player doing significantly better away from him.
Retire91
Stevey Y you our Guy
- May 31, 2010
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No scape goat for me. At this point all the absurdly bad old era players are gone. I think it will just be a fun season of low ecpectations and if anyone breaks out.
Zero debate that the Wings hockey lately has been safe and defensive. It's dull.
But I don't see any other scenario possible with the rosters he's had. You play the cards you have and when your cards suck, even with the best strategy, the results are still going to mostly suck.
This isn't to say he's brilliant or he's the only coach that could accomplish this or anything like that. I'm pretty indifferent to him, honestly. What I see on the ice is a lot of players over their head and mental gaffs. How much of that is on him? It's really tough to quantify. Some, perhaps.
But the way people act like he's singlehandedly responsible for all the woes and the offensive stagnation of some players is completely unfounded.
But more to your point, if you recall back the Blashill's AHL days, he coached teams that didn't play a shell and did want to move fast on the transition. I have no doubt the reason Blashill is even still with the Wings is because he likely shares Yzerman's vision to install a Cooper/Tampa-like system the second the roster has the horses. I know many jaded fans think Yzerman just keeps him around as a placeholder until a REAL option emerges but... Is that at all on brand with how Yzerman runs his ship? It certainly doesn't gel with the staff changes he has done or the buyouts of guys like Abby. Some folks have their mind made up though and I'm not here to change their mind, but provide some insight as to why some of us don't think he's the worst thing to happen to Detroit in decades.
ricky0034
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2010
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I think you're mischaracterizing my response here a bit with Tatar
when I say "similar to his career best as a Wing" that's not me saying that his performance didn't change much from where it had been at, I mean that literally, as in 2014-15, as in so long ago that Jeff Blashill literally wasn't even the teams coach yet
as far as Vegas goes that's just another example of how this takes time, these guys aren't gonna go to another team in the middle of the season and suddenly be a different player literally overnight it takes time to unlearn everything a Coach that bad drilled you and it stands to reason that that's not even something everyone that's been with him for a while will even be capable of doing
Tatar is literally the concrete example you're looking for which is why he is a terrible example for you, there were 14 Wingers that had more points than him his second year in Montreal
let's look at how many there were year by year for his career:
2013-14: 69
2014-15: 28
2015-16(first year Blashill was Coach): 48
2016-17: 52
2017-18: 93
2018-19(first year in Montreal): 28
2019-20(second year in Montreal): 14(and lead his team in scoring by 14 points, this is way better than anything he ever did in Detroit)
2020-21(shortened season, wonky divisions etc): 52
he had a down year in the shortened season this year where he regressed to the level he was at a few years ago but how is that not literally what you've been asking for?
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If this was true, you wouldn't need these parts.
Right, if we just remove all the bad stuff...
So I'd buy this narrative about his resurgence in Montreal a bit more if he wasn't so radioactive they didn't play him during their most important run in 30 years.
Finally, you're locked in on points, but you'll see his actual goal scoring with and away from Blashill is basically identical. I'd hope away from Blashill and historically bad Detroit teams he could pick up a few more assists.
If Blashill was that bad, wouldn't his actual goals go up?
Basically, everything you've laid out can be explained by statistical variance year to year. He's not really better than he was in Detroit. And it's why he's going to his 3rd team in 4 seasons since being traded.
