Where will Mo go?

[GrGriffins]

Are AHL player jerseys that popular? AHL players usually don't last that long with their club. Look at the current roster, only Colin Campbell and Lashoff have more than 5 years with the Griffs.

AHL jerseys are popular to fans in the AHL home team, or if a particular player ends up making it into the NHL. Some AHL players that are fan favorites usually (especially in GR) raise the most money for their jerseys when they are auctioned off (specialty jerseys).

 

[GrGriffins]

I see your point but Campbell wasn't signed to GRG this year as yet

I doubt he will be back in GR. Have 6 vets in our roster already. Great PK guy for us, but that is all that he is. He might end up with another AHL team before this season.

 

[Gniwder]

Thank you that was much more detailed. But this is a more accurate assessment than what is being presented. The Griffins are not a Red Wings play thing. I know you know that and I don't understand how anybody that has watched the AHL level can actually think that is the case. Even the teams that own their AHL operations do not deal in the way that is being suggested by several posters. The AHL is the third best league in the world and frankly it is closer to the second the KHL than the KHL is to the NHL in my opinion.

They are a real business with real objectives. It is important that they have a good relationship with their affiliated NHL team, but ultimately they work within their own construct and operate like most pro leagues. Same reason we cannot rely on Mannheim to just play him stupid minutes. The only leagues where you can more or less assert major control is in the CHL and USHL/NCAA as we have seen that lots over the years, either through trade requests or in the case of the NCAA removing a kid from the team by turning him pro or hand picking a CHL team. But it seems most hate the CHL option so make due with the fact he won't get astronomical ice time if that is the choice. The AHL is a very competitive league and while I think Seider can make a big impact he is going to have to earn his opportunities from Simon, they won't be gifted from on high, that isn't how that league works.

What?!? NHL teams have absolutely no control over NCAA players, the only option the team has is to offer the prospect an ELC and hope he takes it. Look at Chase Priskie or Adam Fox. The player can simply say no thanks...

Seider was drafted by Owen Sound. Red Wings don't get to pick a team. Not only that, but players selected in the import draft can't be traded for a year after they join the league. The Wings also have no control over his usage, though one would assume he'd get a crap load of playing time regardless. Owen Sounds have already contacted Wings management because they know the Wings control Seider's destination.

I'm not sure why you keep saying "play thing". It's not like the Red Wings are going to tell GR to play Lashoff on the power play or something ridiculous. I would imagine that the GM of the team would have some influence on player usage though. That's also how hockey teams work.

 

[GrGriffins]

It's not like the Red Wings are going to tell GR to play Lashoff on the power play or something ridiculous.

The Wings can if they want to, especially if that player has been assigned by them and they (Wings) owns his rights. But the Red Wings did tell GR to put Hronek on the PK to improve his defensive side of his game (Hronek hardly played on the PK unit before turning pro). Look how Hronek played the 2nd half of the season. When the Wings assign a player to GR, they can tell Simon what that particular player needs to improve and work on to make that player better and to get him back to Detroit. Happens all the time down here.

 

[Gniwder]

The Wings can if they want to, especially if that player has been assigned by them and they (Wings) owns his rights. But the Red Wings did tell GR to put Hronek on the PK to improve his defensive side of his game (Hronek hardly played on the PK unit before turning pro). Look how Hronek played the 2nd half of the season. When the Wings assign a player to GR, they can tell Simon what that particular player needs to improve and work on to make that player better and to get him back to Detroit. Happens all the time down here.

Well Lashoff on the PP then because he's under a Wings contract, lol. Hronek on PK is development, Lashoff on PP is a joke.

Edit: Your post though would indicate that Seider would get PP time if the Wings ask.

 

[FireBird71]

What?!? NHL teams have absolutely no control over NCAA players, the only option the team has is to offer the prospect an ELC and hope he takes it. Look at Chase Priskie or Adam Fox. The player can simply say no thanks...

Seider was drafted by Owen Sound. Red Wings don't get to pick a team. Not only that, but players selected in the import draft can't be traded for a year after they join the league. The Wings also have no control over his usage, though one would assume he'd get a crap load of playing time regardless. Owen Sounds have already contacted Wings management because they know the Wings control Seider's destination.

I'm not sure why you keep saying "play thing". It's not like the Red Wings are going to tell GR to play Lashoff on the power play or something ridiculous. I would imagine that the GM of the team would have some influence on player usage though. That's also how hockey teams work.

Imports can be traded a year after their drafted and Seider was picked in 2018...his rights can be traded but without looking there’s probably no one that can trade for one because they probably have 2 on their teams already

 

[Gniwder]

Imports can be traded a year after their drafted and Seider was picked in 2018...his rights can be traded but without looking there’s probably no one that can trade for one because they probably have 2 on their teams already

The website I read said one year after they join the CHL, not one year after draft. I can't find the actual text of the rule.

If he can be traded, they'd probably have to do one for one import trades. In any case, Red Wings can't control where he goes.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

What?!? NHL teams have absolutely no control over NCAA players, the only option the team has is to offer the prospect an ELC and hope he takes it. Look at Chase Priskie or Adam Fox. The player can simply say no thanks...

Seider was drafted by Owen Sound. Red Wings don't get to pick a team. Not only that, but players selected in the import draft can't be traded for a year after they join the league. The Wings also have no control over his usage, though one would assume he'd get a crap load of playing time regardless. Owen Sounds have already contacted Wings management because they know the Wings control Seider's destination.

I'm not sure why you keep saying "play thing". It's not like the Red Wings are going to tell GR to play Lashoff on the power play or something ridiculous. I would imagine that the GM of the team would have some influence on player usage though. That's also how hockey teams work.

What I am talking about is turning them pro or to the CHL if they are unhappy with the setup at the NCAA. Cholowski is a recent example of this isn't really working out let's cut the cord.

Yes at the CHL level they get to play a ridiculous amount more because their skill level presents the best chance to win. While the Wings can dictate PP time in GR they aren't going to dictate 20+ minutes or things like that as it is unheard of. He will be punished for mistakes and come the third period they are going to play to win. I think Seider can earn those minutes but he is going to have to earn them and live up to his early opportunities otherwise it will be practice a bit and we try again in two weeks.

NHL teams exert pressure on CHL teams a decent amount in terms of trades. We don't know what they think of Owen Sound, I think the hard part there is the pay difference if I am in Seider's camp.

 

[Konnan511]

I don't care if Seider's CHL right can be traded now or not, I don't want him in the CHL regardless.

 

[Frk It]

The Wings can if they want to, especially if that player has been assigned by them and they (Wings) owns his rights. But the Red Wings did tell GR to put Hronek on the PK to improve his defensive side of his game (Hronek hardly played on the PK unit before turning pro). Look how Hronek played the 2nd half of the season. When the Wings assign a player to GR, they can tell Simon what that particular player needs to improve and work on to make that player better and to get him back to Detroit. Happens all the time down here.

They can suggest it, but at the end of the day the coach has the autonomy/freedom to do what they think is best to win.

I'm not sure why you keep saying "play thing". It's not like the Red Wings are going to tell GR to play Lashoff on the power play or something ridiculous. I would imagine that the GM of the team would have some influence on player usage though. That's also how hockey teams work.

You have to look at this from Simon's POV. Simon is an AHL coach. The main goal of an AHL coach is to become an NHL coach. The best way to become an NHL coach is to win games, not by getting a gold star for playing all of the prospects. As an AHL coach, you are basically auditioning for the whole NHL, not just the team you are affiliate with.

 

[DInTheB]

They can suggest it, but at the end of the day the coach has the autonomy/freedom to do what they think is best to win.



You have to look at this from Simon's POV. Simon is an AHL coach. The main goal of an AHL coach is to become an NHL coach. The best way to become an NHL coach is to win games, not by getting a gold star for playing all of the prospects. As an AHL coach, you are basically auditioning for the whole NHL, not just the team you are affiliate with.

I would disagree that the main job for an AHL coach is to win games. It’s certainly necessary but NHL teams are more concerned that a coach develops their prospects. If Ben Simon won a Calder Cup this year because he only rolled two lines made up of journeymen, he isn’t going to sniff NHL jobs.

If Simon develops the kids and is eliminated in the second round he’s more likely get to sniffs from NHL teams as at least an assistant.

 

[Frk It]

I would disagree that the main job for an AHL coach is to win games. It’s certainly necessary but NHL teams are more concerned that a coach develops their prospects. If Ben Simon won a Calder Cup this year because he only rolled two lines made up of journeymen, he isn’t going to sniff NHL jobs.

If Simon develops the kids and is eliminated in the second round he’s more likely get to sniffs from NHL teams as at least an assistant.

It's OBVIOUSLY a blend of both. You can't just blatantly not play prospects. But if you don't think a guy who wins a Calder Cup is going to sniff NHL jobs, I think you're dead wrong.

Look at our AHL roster. Do you see how many veteran level guys there are? Do you realize how big of a role a lot of those guys play? There is a reason for this. You could construct our roster with mostly prospects, but teams don't do that. Saarijarvi has been buried under AHL vets most of his career so far. Turgeon has been buried under AHL vets most of his career so far.

Unless we make roster moves, even despite drafting Seider at #6, I am expecting vets like Lashoff/McIlrath to have a bigger role to start the year. Guess we will have to see what Yzerman does to address the log jam.

 

[Gniwder]

While the Wings can dictate PP time in GR they aren't going to dictate 20+ minutes or things like that as it is unheard of. He will be punished for mistakes and come the third period they are going to play to win.

I don't think anyone's looking for Seider to get ridiculous ice time in GR. Prospects don't need ridiculous ice time to develop, they need to play in all situations PP, PK, O and D zone starts. I wouldn't want him to get much more than 20 min a game in AHL, and I don't want him in DEL getting 12 either. It's not good to overload prospects with too much ice time, so I don't know where your points are coming from.

It's OBVIOUSLY a blend of both. You can't just blatantly not play prospects. But if you don't think a guy who wins a Calder Cup is going to sniff NHL jobs, I think you're dead wrong.

Look at our AHL roster. Do you see how many veteran level guys there are? Do you realize how big of a role a lot of those guys play? There is a reason for this. You could construct our roster with mostly prospects, but teams don't do that. Saarijarvi has been buried under AHL vets most of his career so far. Turgeon has been buried under AHL vets most of his career so far.

Unless we make roster moves, even despite drafting Seider at #6, I am expecting vets like Lashoff/McIlrath to have a bigger role to start the year. Guess we will have to see what Yzerman does to address the log jam.

Oddly enough, the vets you mentioned are actually on Wings contract, not GR. If the Wings wanted to, they could assign McIlrath or Lashoff to the ECH or put them on the NHL roster. (Not that they would do either...) McCrea (1 yr), Crawford (2 yr end this season), and D'Astous (2 yr) have contracts with GR.

On offense, the GR vets are Ford and Shine. Plus GR signed a bunch of kids out of juniors.

 

[Mlotek]

Yzerman pretty much confirmed CHL is off the table. During the press questioning from today's training camp.

Mention NHL/AHL/Europe as the only options for Moritz.

 

[GrGriffins]

I see your point but Campbell wasn't signed to GRG this year as yet

Sept. 12
Colin Campbell (2013-19) - Signed a tryout with Colorado (NHL)