What players wanted out of Edmonton or did not want to play for Edmonton over the years?

[LeonDraisaitl]

Didn’t Perron want to be traded?

 

[rboomercat90]

Didn’t Perron want to be traded?

That might have had more to do with coaching and management. He was one that was criticizing the handling of Mac T’s core players publicly.

 

[WaitingForUser]

Great summer post

Petr Nedved - Think this was wife related

Tobias Rieder v1.0 - Never played for the Oilers but wanted out due to depth on the wing

Jason Arnott - This broke my heart as a kid. I know it was mostly the media's fault but still I felt he didn't want to be there any longer

Doug Weight - Left for money and opportunity, couldn't blame him.

Doug Wright never wanted out of Edmonton he took less money on every deal just to stay. In fact it got to the point where the NHLPA stepped in and told him he could not take less on his next contract. Weight loved this city and has never said a bad thing about any aspect of his time here.

 

[Alberta]

Perron didn't want to be traded.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Doug Wright never wanted out of Edmonton he took less money on every deal just to stay. In fact it got to the point where the NHLPA stepped in and told him he could not take less on his next contract. Weight loved this city and has never said a bad thing about any aspect of his time here.

Just to clarify that the NHLPA legally can not tell a player to take a contract or refuse a contract. Its an association, it does not have binding weight. It is an advocacy body for players that will make recommendations. The NHLPA likely made it known that Weight continuing to take lower than value contracts in a small market was not ideal for the renegotiation of other NHLPA contracts. So pressure, yes, but not "told him".

Doesn't change things too much and the other side of it is the Oilers didn't really even make an serious offer to keep him. The org basically allowed the player to walk feeling that they could not pay for him anymore. The Oilers were in a weak revenue and expenditure position at the time. They had already had to pass the hat around to less than ideal ownership structure just to save the team and keep it floating.
Weight was one of the truly great Oilers players and the way he played here he really was one of the best and hardest to play against Centers in the game. He did this prior to hockey analysis ramping up and the full value of what he was doing out on the ice being entirely quantified. lb for lb, and it always showed in the playoffs, there were few Centers that were better.

 

[joestevens29]

I don't really get it. What could the PA really do to Weight if he didn't listen?

What does the PA really do for players other than negotiate a CBA and file grievance when a player is wronged? And what would be the odds of a grievance anyway?

This isn't your typical worker union where people go to their union for help all the time. A guy in Weight's position really would never need the union for much of anything.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I don't really get it. What could the PA really do to Weight if he didn't listen?

What does the PA really do for players other than negotiate a CBA and file grievance when a player is wronged? And what would be the odds of a grievance anyway?

This isn't your typical worker union where people go to their union for help all the time. A guy in Weight's position really would never need the union for much of anything.

Weight could have refused the advice, he could have refused the calls of colleagues that were apparently happening to be careful about his next contract. While I mentioned that the NHLPA is just an association, not a Union of sorts in which more malicious pressure can and does get exerted, the association is still powerful, tactical, and can exert influence. When you have NHLPA reps from other clubs calling you it can get awkward in a hurry. It was established in media, and the Oilers knew this as well, that the NHLPA was heavily involved. This impacted the Oilers too, who did not want to exist as a quasi blacklisted club within NHLPA elite or rep circles.

Its fairly complex, but influences were felt. To the degree that the Oilers decided not to even make a final offer to attempt to keep Weight. I think the Oilers knew they would do that at their own peril with already strained NHLPA goodwill. So the Oilers decided to abide and waved Weight goodbye.

So its not really about what the NHLPA can do tangibly, its what they could influence. If that makes any sense.

 

[joestevens29]

Weight could have refused the advice, he could have refused the calls of colleagues that were apparently happening to be careful about his next contract. While I mentioned that the NHLPA is just an association, not a Union of sorts in which more malicious pressure can and does get exerted, the association is still powerful, tactical, and can exert influence. When you have NHLPA reps from other clubs calling you it can get awkward in a hurry. It was established in media, and the Oilers knew this as well, that the NHLPA was heavily involved. This impacted the Oilers too, who did not want to exist as a quasi blacklisted club within NHLPA elite or rep circles.

Its fairly complex, but influences were felt. To the degree that the Oilers decided not to even make a final offer to attempt to keep Weight. I think the Oilers knew they would do that at their own peril with already strained NHLPA goodwill. So the Oilers decided to abide and waved Weight goodbye.

So its not really about what the NHLPA can do tangibly, its what they could influence. If that makes any sense.

Sure, but at the end of the day what would've been worse for the Oilers.

Weight coming here, but having negative NHLPA influence on a City that really already couldn't get much worse according to UFA's.

or

Lets trade Weight and watch the PA help the Oilers out and make us not the bottom of the NHL for UFA's?

 

[Drivesaitl]

Sure, but at the end of the day what would've been worse for the Oilers.

Weight coming here, but having negative NHLPA influence on a City that really already couldn't get much worse according to UFA's.

or

Lets trade Weight and watch the PA help the Oilers out and make us not the bottom of the NHL for UFA's?

Its an interesting question. Lets not forget that at the time the NHLPA, and even multiple other owners had less love for the small market teams. The NHL had rid itself already of Winnipeg and Quebec so the context needs to be seen. The Oilers doing their part in dismantling a team they couldn't afford to keep together. (also Guerin being dealt) was perceived as just fiscally prudent and responsible by Oilers management. In otherwords that the Oilers were playing ball. Were the Oilers even rewarded a few years later by the new CBA and more owners willing to go to bat for teams like the Oilers provided they were operating fiscally independently. The other owners wanted to limit any costs incurred by small market clubs.

There was a lot that went into the Oilers having to move Weight. I think in fairness to the Oilers ownership situation at the time neither the Oilers, or Weight, the NHL, or the NHLPa were at fault. It was pro sports and economics. For Winnipeg and Quebec this meant losing an NHL team period. To teams with limited pockets and revenue like the Oilers it meant the bad medicine was losing players like Weight and Guerin. Cujo as well.

 

[WaitingForUser]

Just to clarify that the NHLPA legally can not tell a player to take a contract or refuse a contract. Its an association, it does not have binding weight. It is an advocacy body for players that will make recommendations. The NHLPA likely made it known that Weight continuing to take lower than value contracts in a small market was not ideal for the renegotiation of other NHLPA contracts. So pressure, yes, but not "told him".

Doesn't change things too much and the other side of it is the Oilers didn't really even make an serious offer to keep him. The org basically allowed the player to walk feeling that they could not pay for him anymore. The Oilers were in a weak revenue and expenditure position at the time. They had already had to pass the hat around to less than ideal ownership structure just to save the team and keep it floating.
Weight was one of the truly great Oilers players and the way he played here he really was one of the best and hardest to play against Centers in the game. He did this prior to hockey analysis ramping up and the full value of what he was doing out on the ice being entirely quantified. lb for lb, and it always showed in the playoffs, there were few Centers that were better.

I hear what you are saying. The problem was with the quality of player he was at the time the PA felt that he was making harder for the other star players to get paid fair salaries if he continued to take drastic underpayments. I saw this in an interview with him years ago can’t remember when.

 

[rboomercat90]

The association itself couldn’t make Weight take a “market value” contract but the players could bully him into taking one by threatening to ostracize him from their club. Off the ice, maybe it meant no more invites to golf tournaments. On the ice, maybe it meant an extra cheap shot here and there by a neandrathal trying to earn his place in the club. I have no doubt the players put a lot of pressure on him to do what he was told. Those guys were pretty militant in that era. It was all about the union. Made me sick to my stomach how every player in the league did stuff like trade their team hats for NHLPA gear.

 

[Jumptheshark]

That might have had more to do with coaching and management. He was one that was criticizing the handling of Mac T’s core players publicly.

a week later he was traded

 

[SaltNPeca]

Headline:

Millionaire hockey player and his family hates playing in Northern Canadian city where the average temperature during the hockey season is -20 and you can't even use the bathroom without the media criticizing you.

Some say hockey is the toughest sport.
Some say Edmonton or Montreal might be the toughest NHL cities to play in.
Some players just can't handle it. They quite simply don't have the mental toughness to thrive and succeed in that crucible.

 

[Bangers]

Is there any proof that the PA put pressure on Weight to take a higher contract?

To me, it just sounds like media spin. More likely, he saw his major contract coming up, the Oilers couldn't afford it with the ownership at the time, and both sides did their best to deal with it in a way that worked out best for both parties.

And I dont begrudge him for it at all. The guy was a class act on and off the ice and gave everything he had.

Still, unless there is proof to the contrary, I have trouble believing that it was more complex than that.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Some say hockey is the toughest sport.
Some say Edmonton or Montreal might be the toughest NHL cities to play in.
Some players just can't handle it. They quite simply don't have the mental toughness to thrive and succeed in that crucible.

here is my post where people just want me to go away

When I lived in Vancouver--nuck players were able to show their face in public while on a losing streak--In Edmonton they need to pick where and when they would go somewhere

Edmonton and Montreal and TO (to a point) live and breath hockey 24/7/365 and it does make it harder for some players to play in that city

Mark Messier said it best when ask what was the difference between Edmonton and NYC "I can walk down the street in NYC"

Edmonton, despite what some would like to believe, on the grand scale of things, is not that big of a city and when you are in the public eye, you have a lot of eyes always on you.

 

[Drivesaitl]

here is my post where people just want me to go away

When I lived in Vancouver--nuck players were able to show their face in public while on a losing streak--In Edmonton they need to pick where and when they would go somewhere

Edmonton and Montreal and TO (to a point) live and breath hockey 24/7/365 and it does make it harder for some players to play in that city

Mark Messier said it best when ask what was the difference between Edmonton and NYC "I can walk down the street in NYC"

Edmonton, despite what some would like to believe, on the grand scale of things, is not that big of a city and when you are in the public eye, you have a lot of eyes always on you.

NYC is different because Hockey is one of many distractions in the Big Apple. Its not even the major sport there and is easily lost in the things to do and see hubris there. Only rarely does NHL and hockey rise above that in NY as it did briefly with the Messier led Cup win.

Vancouver is different because its a unique place with myriad natural and recreational exploration. Sure you care about sports to some degree, but if living of visiting there you care more about living in a natural playground. So that the players even could be walking on the seawall on the day of game 7 and barely even be noticed. A place where Bono is barely noticed hitchhiking. In Vancouver your eyes are constantly gazing on the magnificent surroundings. Eye contact and looking at people in Vancouver is more fleeting. The visual natural distraction in lower mainland is constant, and breathtaking. Same reason celebrities rarely get noticed in Hawaii and can go there easily enough.

 

[Jumptheshark]

NYC is different because Hockey is one of many distractions in the Big Apple. Its not even the major sport there and is easily lost in the things to do and see hubris there. Only rarely does NHL and hockey rise above that in NY as it did briefly with the Messier led Cup win.

Vancouver is different because its a unique place with myriad natural and recreational exploration. Sure you care about sports to some degree, but if living of visiting there you care more about living in a natural playground. So that the players even could be walking on the seawall on the day of game 7 and barely even be noticed. A place where Bono is barely noticed hitchhiking. In Vancouver your eyes are constantly gazing on the magnificent surroundings. Eye contact and looking at people in Vancouver is more fleeting. The visual natural distraction in lower mainland is constant, and breathtaking. Same reason celebrities rarely get noticed in Hawaii and can go there easily enough.

not really addressing my statement on the fact the playing in Edmonton is harder then playing in many other cities

you are just agreeing that in Edmonton--there is nothing else but hockey and players have no choice but to love it or leave it and this thread is about the players who picked the latter

 

[rboomercat90]

Is there any proof that the PA put pressure on Weight to take a higher contract?

To me, it just sounds like media spin. More likely, he saw his major contract coming up, the Oilers couldn't afford it with the ownership at the time, and both sides did their best to deal with it in a way that worked out best for both parties.

And I dont begrudge him for it at all. The guy was a class act on and off the ice and gave everything he had.

Still, unless there is proof to the contrary, I have trouble believing that it was more complex than that.

I’m not going to dig up articles from back then but the one I remember reading was an interview with Weight himself saying it. This is common knowledge for anybody living in Edmonton twenty years ago.

 

[Drivesaitl]

not really addressing my statement on the fact the playing in Edmonton is harder then playing in many other cities

you are just agreeing that in Edmonton--there is nothing else but hockey and players have no choice but to love it or leave it and this thread is about the players who picked the latter

On the specific point I wasn't disagreeing with you. Yes, players are not anonymous here, that has both good and bad potential connotations. But even if a person wanted to be incognito its not too hard to do so with some glasses and even a hat. its really remarkable easy to disguise, or not, as desired. What exists here, and a long lineage of it, is players that want to go clubbing and pick up a girl in each arm (even if said girl came in with somebody else) and have their cake and eat it too without being noticed..

So that they want the groupies, which they get here, but would want it on the sly?! I don't even know how that works.

Theres precious few bad things that have actually occurred to players here. One really has to dig through decades of alleged experiences to even come up with much. The reality of life is uncertainty. Just this week a German Tourist got shot in the head just outside of Calgary while driving his family on vacation. Somebody pulls right up and shoots him in the head It turns out it was a mistaken identity hit. This could happen to anybody driving a matching vehicle description.

This stated within the reality of Canada being one of the safest nations on Earth. Its ironic even that Canadian players would feel more comfortable playing in markets that have 10times the murder rates or in which their kids could get shot in school.

 

[oilers'72]

Is there any proof that the PA put pressure on Weight to take a higher contract?

To me, it just sounds like media spin. More likely, he saw his major contract coming up, the Oilers couldn't afford it with the ownership at the time, and both sides did their best to deal with it in a way that worked out best for both parties.

And I dont begrudge him for it at all. The guy was a class act on and off the ice and gave everything he had.

Still, unless there is proof to the contrary, I have trouble believing that it was more complex than that.

``I think the NHLPA has been involved in every contract signing for the last five years,'' said Chuck Fletcher, the Panthers' assistant general manager. ``They're involved in the entry levels and the unrestricteds and they have a big hand in who goes to arbitration and who doesn't

``They try to pick out a few teams where they think there's a weak link and go after them. Their motive is they try to get a good signing that they can use to help other players with other clubs. There's no question that they're very involved. They orchestrate a lot of these moves, and a lot of agents have told me confidentially that they cannot talk to me and make a deal without sending the offer to the NHLPA first.''

In discussions with five agents who did not want their names in print, three confirmed that not only have they been strategizing with the NHLPA, but all of their deals are looked at by the NHLPA before anything is agreed to.
In fact, one of the agents said the union has instructed them not to agree to anything.

Widespread Free-agent Signing Impasse Confounding League

After signing with Edmonton, Doug Weight implied that his holdout was a case of taking one for the NHL Players Association. Without coming out and saying it, he hinted that the NHLPA had told him he needed to get $4 million a season to help set the benchmarks.

And he ended up almost getting it from the Oilers. He signed for $3.9 million a season, with another $500,000 possible in bonuses. Weight had told the Oilers that he would give any difference between the two camps' figures to charity, anyway, so he's on the hook for about $500,000 a year.

Avalanche Hockey News: The Denver Post Online

 

[WaitingForUser]

Widespread Free-agent Signing Impasse Confounding League



Avalanche Hockey News: The Denver Post Online

Thank you for finding this I knew I wasn’t crazy.