Sea Eagles
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- Feb 7, 2012
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What Needs to Happen This Offseason?
- Thread starter The Merchant
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tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
I know that, it was before the last game. Every other team has a media session on the day after, we don't.
- Jul 25, 2006
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This organization really needs to start thinking little bit defense, they haven't drafted and developed a solid d-man since Foote and that was Quebec. Yeah they've drafted Barrie who has become a really good offensive d-man, but as far as someone that can actually play defense, it's ridiculous to think that Foote was the last guy.
McMetal
Writer of Wrongs
- Sep 29, 2015
- 14,145
- 12,135
Give the new regime a chance, I think Meloche has a lot of potential to break that streak in a few years.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
bohlmeister
...................
- May 18, 2007
- 17,854
- 456
Just watched that Sakic press conference from earlier. Jesus. If you need players who manage the game better and a smarter, why did you let Stastny and ROR go in back to back seasons. Those are game managers.
This is amazing.
You're opinion on literally everything related to the Avs is always, ALWAYS negative.
What's the point. If you're this disgruntled as a fan just stop watching, pick a new team, new sport, new anything. I hope you dont feel obligated to stay on as a fan.
Anyway. Bigras was probably the Avs best Dman for about half the games he played. Sure he had a few rough games as well, and made some mistakes. But what 20/21 Year old Rookie NHL Dman doesn't enter the league making mistakes?
Just an outright brutal post.
Freudian
Clearly deranged
- Jul 3, 2003
- 50,444
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What I didn't like about Sakic's press conference is that he basically said they know what's wrong and they'll fix it for next year. Right before game 82. Not take some time off and analyze the season. Not turn every stone.
But he was adamant it wasn't a coaching problem. He almost sneered at the suggestion that coaching would be an issue and went on a "we're in this together" speech.
The coach and GM joined at the hip is usually a bad idea. Especially when the owners view them with reverence for historic reasons. All the normal mechanisms for accountability are disabled.
- Jul 25, 2006
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Nah, I'm just fine as a fan. People on here just tend to get their hopes up alot just like they did hand full of years ago when they thought this team would win the cup by now with the Duchene, Landeskog and later the MacKinnon core.
Just because I'm being realistic, doesn't mean I'm a bad fan, I'm just not delusional. I knew this team wasn't gonna win the cup after 5 years since drafting Duchene, and people would criticise me for that as well.
The team is regressing just like I thought they would, and the core is under question mark and perhaps will be broken up.
Oh and I can name few young d-men made the NHL and out of no where and made a lot less mistakes than Bigras. You people just have too much unrealistic expectations from some players that's all. Bigras was absolutely not NHL ready
As much as I hate to agree with the_fan, he is right about Bigras this year. I feel (and hope) that he will be ready for a full time roster spot after camp. He got some good experience (I hope it did not hurt him playing for a team this poor). He made some good plays here and there, and showed big promise....but this year, he was bad.
He was the Avs most protected defender. By a long shot. The next closest defender to Bigras' 15.67% ZSO%Rel that also played 30+ games was Redmond... with 7.43%. Despite that massive sheltering, Bigras had the worst CF% of all the defenders with 30+ games at 42.75%...next was FB with 43.25% but he was the least sheltered D. To be fair to Bigras, he did have slightly better CF% than Guenin and Bodnarchuck, and they were sheltered almost as much...anyone want to argue that they were NHL quality D this year?
Similar story with Rantanen. He wasn't the most sheltered F (Duchene), but his CF% was abyssmal at 37.5%. Rendulic was as well, with 25% in his 3 games. Despite Rantanen's amazing season for SAR, he was not ready for prime time yet. He will be next year. He also needs to be played in the right position.
Zadorov on the other hand was not sheltered (-2.01% only being EJ, FB and Stuart's 6 games). Yet he had better CF% than all but the statistical anomalies (and sheltered) Gormley and Redmond. A hair behind him in both categories is Holden...im my mind showing that he was not early as bad as some make him out to be. Going into next year, Zads should be paired with Barrie (though play style may not let that work). Maybe have him up with EJ to spare FB the minutes and match styles a bit better. Holden babysitting and grooming his replacement in Bigras makes sense.
He was the Avs most protected defender. By a long shot. The next closest defender to Bigras' 15.67% ZSO%Rel that also played 30+ games was Redmond... with 7.43%. Despite that massive sheltering, Bigras had the worst CF% of all the defenders with 30+ games at 42.75%...next was FB with 43.25% but he was the least sheltered D. To be fair to Bigras, he did have slightly better CF% than Guenin and Bodnarchuck, and they were sheltered almost as much...anyone want to argue that they were NHL quality D this year?
Similar story with Rantanen. He wasn't the most sheltered F (Duchene), but his CF% was abyssmal at 37.5%. Rendulic was as well, with 25% in his 3 games. Despite Rantanen's amazing season for SAR, he was not ready for prime time yet. He will be next year. He also needs to be played in the right position.
Zadorov on the other hand was not sheltered (-2.01% only being EJ, FB and Stuart's 6 games). Yet he had better CF% than all but the statistical anomalies (and sheltered) Gormley and Redmond. A hair behind him in both categories is Holden...im my mind showing that he was not early as bad as some make him out to be. Going into next year, Zads should be paired with Barrie (though play style may not let that work). Maybe have him up with EJ to spare FB the minutes and match styles a bit better. Holden babysitting and grooming his replacement in Bigras makes sense.
Freudian
Clearly deranged
- Jul 3, 2003
- 50,444
- 17,265
Avs have a long history of bad defenders having decent corsi figures. From Elliott, O'Brien, Redmond to now Holden. It shouldn't be used to make any kind of meaningful hockey decision.
Holden stinks. Can't skate. Can't pass. Can't read the game. It's obvious he shouldn't be a regular NHL player and the quicker Avs front office realize this the better off we'll be.
Holden stinks. Can't skate. Can't pass. Can't read the game. It's obvious he shouldn't be a regular NHL player and the quicker Avs front office realize this the better off we'll be.
In sports it is always easiest to be the contrarian and pessimist and be "right" later on. If we all adapted that model odds are always in our favor and we'd look like the smartest group on HF.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
That line with Rendulic and Rantanen was a disaster, I fully believe it cost them the Boston game early in the year. That was one of the worst things Roy tried to do all year, burned 2/3 of Rantanen's look when they full well knew he wasn't going to stay and gave him another rookie to boot. Then he comes back and plays with McLeod and Skille on the 4th line. So no, I don't put much stock in whatever his numbers show from his 70 minutes of ice time in the NHL. Bigras will be fine, his last few games must really be coloring the perception around here. He actually did good things far earlier than anyone expected.
Bender
Registered User
- Sep 25, 2002
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Can you imagine the follow-up questions if he had admitted anything different than what he said? That would have certainly reached Canada and blown up here for sure.
At least they are acknowledging that they are going to need to play differently to be successful...it's a start.
- Dec 4, 2002
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It's too early to annoint anything in regards to Bigras IMO, except that he did pretty well in a number of games for a 20 year old in his first NHL stint, and he struggled at times as a 20 year old in his first NHL stint.
That said, the_fan is absolutely correct in regards to the Avs history with defensemen. I've been barking about that same thing for a decade or more. The Avalanche have never - not one single time - drafted and developed a Top 4 two-way defenseman (or a Top 4 quality defensive defenseman) in the history of their franchise. 20 years and running. They've drafted a few who developed elsewhere (Regehr, Boychuk, Shattenkirk, and to a lesser extent Gilbert/Sauer), they drafted/developed a couple who were good offensively but subpar defensively (Liles, Barrie), and they certainly traded for defensemen who came in and played well.
But draft + develop blue liners who turned into quality defensive players? Nope. The biggest success story in Colorado's 20 year history in this respect is Martin Skoula. After him, we're in Rick Berry/Jeff Finger territory.
Here's to hoping that Bigras changes this.
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Drij
Registered User
- Mar 5, 2007
- 7,335
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It's in the best interest of players on LTIR to remain in it versus retirement. Players under contract get their medical bills payed by the team. Retired players have to pay out of their pockets. And cap wise it's better for the team. It's win win for both sides.
- Dec 4, 2002
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I think that's a bit harsh. I thought he played pretty well for 20 games or so, then he tanked when the team did.
And I can't help but wonder if his concussion on March 5th affected him in some way. Because he really did struggle at times near the end of the season.
- Dec 4, 2002
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And that should tell you that this statistical analysis in and of itself doesn't tell the whole story.
- Feb 24, 2012
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Rookies almost always hit a wall at somepoint during the season. Teams get NHL tape on a kid and start exploiting their weaknesses. Happens all the time. Bigras hitting a wall was expected. How he adapts over the summer and early in next season will be important. He will be fine.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
With Bigras' talent and the progression he's shown since being drafted if they can't turn him into a regular NHL defensemen then the entire org deserves to find new careers outside of hockey.
- Feb 24, 2012
- 62,761
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100% agree... there is nothing about Bigras that should fail. He should at least be a solid #4 with any sort of development.
Foppa2118
Registered User
- Oct 3, 2003
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Because they had to make the decision one and two years ago with a cheaper Duchene and a future MacKinnon raise. Not this year where Duchene had another slow start, and Nate still hadn't taken that next step yet.
Morgan Rielly just received a 6 years $30million dollar contract. He has played basically as many games as Barrie, and Barrie has outproduced him by a fair margin. Likely Rielly is better defensively by a fair margin. I think the $5million tag is pretty fair since Barrie is never going to be a #1 type guy and will always be an offense first guy.
Do we resign Barrie if he refuses to sign unless its for more than $5million per season?
Do we resign Barrie if he refuses to sign unless its for more than $5million per season?
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