What is the fair market value of captain Andrew Ladd?

[JetsTO]

A bunch of those are RFA deals. Can't really compare.

 

[Jets4Life]

A bunch of those are RFA deals. Can't really compare.

What would you suggest Ladd is worth?

 

[truck]

Pominville
Callahan

 

[KingBogo]

Agree, King.

i don't think Ladd or Buff are with the Jets when they become cup challengers. And if they are, they are high priced veteran players no longer leading the team, but there for support.

When this team is a contender, I think guys like Trouba, Myers, Scheifele, Ehlers, Connor, Lowry, Hellebuyck, Harkins and Morrissey are leading the way. With Petan, Lemieux and Roslovic having key roles too.

Pricey six year deals for either Ladd or Buff could happen, but they are likely moved before their contracts expire.

For this to happen Chevy has to avoid any no movement clauses. Which might be a sticking point as they will both likely want to control their movement at the end of their careers. Also having the contracts back dive by what is allowed in the CBA will make them easier to move as there are always a few teams wanting to get to the cap floor while keeping actual costs down.

 

[ps241]

Jets are in an interesting spot. If they want to go for the cup with the current older core and younger core hybrid then I think a logical line in the sand (for the older core) is 2017-18. That is the last season of Little's contract. Three seasons from now Buff, Ladd, Little, and Wheeler will all be slightly past their primes but not too old to be solid still IMO. Hopefully it will be more than offset but having Myers, Trouba, Schiefele, and Lowry all in their primes, Ehlers, Morriessy, Petan, Helly, all into really productive ages and some of the younger guns like Connor, Roslovic, Harkins etc potentially coming in as young up and comers like Scheif, Lowry, and Trouba were this past season.


I kind of get why they may want to try to sign both Ladd and Buff but its all going to come down to cap management. There is a good chance it will be too expensive to get them both under contract and still be able to deal with Lowry, Trouba, and Scheifele next off season.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Agree, King.

i don't think Ladd or Buff are with the Jets when they become cup challengers. And if they are, they are high priced veteran players no longer leading the team, but there for support.

When this team is a contender, I think guys like Trouba, Myers, Scheifele, Ehlers, Connor, Lowry, Hellebuyck, Harkins and Morrissey are leading the way. With Petan, Lemieux and Roslovic having key roles too.

Pricey six year deals for either Ladd or Buff could happen, but they are likely moved before their contracts expire.

I don't know Bob. Things seem to be changing. The teams like Philly and the Leafs who used to make trades trying to build a winner quickly are all now changing their tunes to D&D. Nobody wants 30+ players for big $$$ anymore. They are putting their $$$ into RFAs instead of into UFAs. Even without movement protection built in it might be difficult to move Ladd and Buff 2-3 years into their new contracts. At any rate it would not be wise to count on that possibility. If we sign any contracts we better plan on fulfilling them ..... like Pav.

Even the option of trading them now may not payoff as well as it would have even 1-2 years ago. If a player is going to take a lot of money to sign then the trade return is reduced proportionally.

 

[truck]

I don't know Bob. Things seem to be changing. The teams like Philly and the Leafs who used to make trades trying to build a winner quickly are all now changing their tunes to D&D. Nobody wants 30+ players for big $$$ anymore. They are putting their $$$ into RFAs instead of into UFAs. Even without movement protection built in it might be difficult to move Ladd and Buff 2-3 years into their new contracts. At any rate it would not be wise to count on that possibility. If we sign any contracts we better plan on fulfilling them ..... like Pav.

Even the option of trading them now may not payoff as well as it would have even 1-2 years ago. If a player is going to take a lot of money to sign then the trade return is reduced proportionally.

The Jets were IMO cup contenders this year - it didn't work out, but they had a good shot pre-playoffs.

There is no reason to believe they couldn't make a strong push in within the next three years if they figure out a long term goaltending fix and/or add a legit top line forward. Connor, Ehlers or Petan alone could change the dynamic up front and break out with 70+. Is it likely? Hard to say, but I wouldn't rule it out.

 

[Jets4Life]

The Jets were IMO cup contenders this year - it didn't work out, but they had a good shot pre-playoffs.

There is no reason to believe they couldn't make a strong push in within the next three years if they figure out a long term goaltending fix and/or add a legit top line forward. Connor, Ehlers or Petan alone could change the dynamic up front and break out with 70+. Is it likely? Hard to say, but I wouldn't rule it out.

Long-term goaltending fix: HELLEBUYCK

Done.

 

[KingBogo]

The Jets were IMO cup contenders this year - it didn't work out, but they had a good shot pre-playoffs.

There is no reason to believe they couldn't make a strong push in within the next three years if they figure out a long term goaltending fix and/or add a legit top line forward. Connor, Ehlers or Petan alone could change the dynamic up front and break out with 70+. Is it likely? Hard to say, but I wouldn't rule it out.

I didn't realize you were such an optimist Truck. I like that line of thinking.

 

[Whileee]

The Jets were IMO cup contenders this year - it didn't work out, but they had a good shot pre-playoffs.

There is no reason to believe they couldn't make a strong push in within the next three years if they figure out a long term goaltending fix and/or add a legit top line forward. Connor, Ehlers or Petan alone could change the dynamic up front and break out with 70+. Is it likely? Hard to say, but I wouldn't rule it out.

Once the Jets stopped taking way more minor penalties than their opponents, their very strong 5v5 possession game and solid goaltending took them to a high level of competitiveness. I think that if they didn't have a bunch of key players dinged with injuries, they would have given Anaheim a much better run for their money.

I agree that they Jets are not that far off, and an injection of talent with some good health could make them a pretty hard team to beat.

 

[truck]

I didn't realize you were such an optimist Truck. I like that line of thinking.

I wouldn't call myself an optimist. I won an award for objectivity last year.

 

[KingBogo]

I wouldn't call myself an optimist. I won an award for objectivity last year.

That is why I was surprised at such an optimistic post. I on the other hand is an admitted homer and most definitely an optimist.

 

[Channelcat]

I wouldn't call myself an optimist. I won an award for objectivity last year.

You should give it back after that statement

Perhaps strange things can happen in the playoffs, but I don't believe the Jets are even close to being capable of playing the type of hockey we saw from CHI and TBL

 

[truck]

That is why I was surprised at such an optimistic post. I on the other hand is an admitted homer and most definitely an optimist.

I said going into the playoffs that the Jets had a chance to make some noise. This roster shouldn't be all that different. Granted, 8 think there has been a slight downgrade, but I'd still love to see Tlusty or Stempniak return. That said, I can still see succes as possible with a kid in that role.

Prospects are optimism. They are capable of great things until they prove they aren't.

 

[truck]

You should give it back after that statement

Perhaps strange things can happen in the playoffs, but I don't believe the Jets are even close to being capable of playing the type of hockey we saw from CHI and TBL

Nor could... well... pretty much anyone else.

That series was a perfect match up to create something special, that doesn't mean there aren't other ways to win. Chicago is legitimately awesome and tough to beat, but they can be beaten and they've been beaten in the past - this isn't even (IMO) their best cup winning team.

 

[CaptainChef]

Once the Jets stopped taking way more minor penalties than their opponents, their very strong 5v5 possession game and solid goaltending took them to a high level of competitiveness. I think that if they didn't have a bunch of key players dinged with injuries, they would have given Anaheim a much better run for their money.

I agree that they Jets are not that far off, and an injection of talent with some good health could make them a pretty hard team to beat.

Agree. But I maintain that a big reason for the level of injuries and key guys just not performing up to snuff can be attributed to overuse of the top 2-3 lines and pitiful support from the 4th line.

All things being equal with tending, I say we make the playoffs & go on a substantial run in the playoffs IF we can piece together a competitive 4th line

 

[Whileee]

Agree. But I maintain that a big reason for the level of injuries and key guys just not performing up to snuff can be attributed to overuse of the top 2-3 lines and pitiful support from the 4th line.

All things being equal with tending, I say we make the playoffs & go on a substantial run in the playoffs IF we can piece together a competitive 4th line

We definitely need a better 4th line, but it doesn't explain injuries to Enstrom, Buff and Trouba at the end of the year.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

The Jets were IMO cup contenders this year - it didn't work out, but they had a good shot pre-playoffs.

There is no reason to believe they couldn't make a strong push in within the next three years if they figure out a long term goaltending fix and/or add a legit top line forward. Connor, Ehlers or Petan alone could change the dynamic up front and break out with 70+. Is it likely? Hard to say, but I wouldn't rule it out.

I agree, they were close. I don't see the connection to my post that you quoted. I was only saying 'plan on fulfilling the contracts that we sign'.

 

[Evil Little]

Nobody wants 30+ players for big $$$ anymore. They are putting their $$$ into RFAs instead of into UFAs.

Your point--that one shouldn't sign a contract expecting to move it later--is well made but it may be a little early to start looking at a few moves as the way forward. The Oilers have been giving players $6m a year out of their ELCs for years now, and the Kesler deal looks like it could have been signed any of the past handful of offseasons.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Your point--that one shouldn't sign a contract expecting to move it later--is well made but it may be a little early to start looking at a few moves as the way forward. The Oilers have been giving players $6m a year out of their ELCs for years now, and the Kesler deal looks like it could have been signed any of the past handful of offseasons.

Perhaps it is premature but it looks like a trend to me. There have been quite a few contracts now. There is a distinct lack of interest in UFAs and a few other indicators. The GM who fails to recognize the trend will lock himself in to a very difficult position. Of course if he adapts to a trend that turns out not to be there he could have a different problem. Guess right and win. Guess wrong and become unemployed.

 

[Jets4Life]

I still wish we had signed Frolik, but no use crying over spilt milk I guess. Signing Stempniak would be great. His AAV is only $900,000. Our 4th line needs to improve. Hopefully a couple of prospects can fill the role. Giving Thorburn a 3 year, 3.6 million contract was a mistake.

 

[Channelcat]

I still wish we had signed Frolik, but no use crying over spilt milk I guess. Signing Stempniak would be great. His AAV is only $900,000. Our 4th line needs to improve. Hopefully a couple of prospects can fill the role. Giving Thorburn a 3 year, 3.6 million contract was a mistake.

So how many points do you think Thorburn would have if he played 81 games with Little, Wheeler etc, plus first pp unit. Playing 21? minutes a game?

I'm not suggesting he's as "good" as Ladd, but the difference is probably less than people think (#stirringpot) In my opinion it would be wise to move both Ladd and Buff asap and continue to develop even if it means a step backwards in the standings.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

Lawless article in the free press was his usual brown nosing to Ladd. I don't mind paying Ladd the $ but the 6 yrs is steep. Spezza only got 4 yrs in Dallas and I have Spezza as more accomplished than Ladd.

 

[ps241]

Lawless article in the free press was his usual brown nosing to Ladd. I don't mind paying Ladd the $ but the 6 yrs is steep. Spezza only got 4 yrs in Dallas and I have Spezza as more accomplished than Ladd.

Actually I think Gary's article was spot on today. I especially like the part where he mentions that "The Jets are maturing and so are the problems they face".The price of the Canadian dollar is killing us right now too. I think we may not be able to afford both Ladd and Buff (just my guess) while keeping the cap space and budget to fend off the wolves next summer.

 

[scelaton]

Actually I think Gary's article was spot on today. I especially like the part where he mentions that "The Jets are maturing and so are the problems they face".The price of the Canadian dollar is killing us right now too. I think we may not be able to afford both Ladd and Buff (just my guess) while keeping the cap space and budget to fend off the wolves next summer.

I agree about the article, ps.
My view has always been that, aside from his hockey value, they would keep Ladd out of loyalty, because he has been a great captain and that is their MO.
But term may be problem here, if Ladd wants 6 years and 5 years or less makes most sense for the team, given the bursting pipeline.
Having always pegged the likelihood of extending Ladd at 90%, f they can't reach a deal with him I will be absolutely shocked...but not necessarily unhappy. Loyalty to a fault has always been a potential achilles heel of TNSE....
Still and all, I am sticking with my 90% probability of extending Ladd and 60% for Buff.