What is Dion Phaneuf? Statistical View

[Phaneuffan3]

Here's the article by the way

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1467&mode=print&nocache=1362268029

Dion is 5th best in league at breakout %.... therefore we must get rid of him and bring in Girardi who is 15th WORST in the league... wow

Or better yet, to the poster thinking Schenn could replace dion.. LOL if people think dion is a poor skater with low IQ, they clearly didn't watch any games that Schenn suited up for the blue and white.

Dion is a Number 1 D. Get over it.

 

[mikebel111*]

dion is a # 1 d man. The funniest excuse that haters come up with is that lupul should be captain because dion is bad with media. bad with media based on what?

these are the same people that ran sundin out of town. Dion should have one heck of a heart to actually tolerate this amount of hate. Dion is worth 7.0 to 7.5 million easily.

 

[Phaneuffan3]

dion is a # 1 d man. The funniest excuse that haters come up with is that lupul should be captain because dion is bad with media. bad with media based on what?

these are the same people that ran sundin out of town. Dion should have one heck of a heart to actually tolerate this amount of hate. Dion is worth 7.0 to 7.5 million easily.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[zeke]

A lot of people on here always seem to have excuses for Phaneuf

excuses for what?

being top-10 in every important offensive, defensive, and physical category in hockey, and leading his team to the playoffs?

the only excuses around here are made by the haters, trying to "excuse" the fact that he's a league leader amongst defensemen across the board.

 

[zeke]

Here's the article by the way

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1467&mode=print&nocache=1362268029

yep. the top-20 most efficient defensemen in moving the puck out of their zone in the 11-12 season:


Player Touches Success%

1.Erik Karlsson 258 38.0%
2.Keith Yandle 225 35.1%
3.Grant Clitsome 162 32.1%
4.Brian Campbell 287 31.7%
5.Dion Phaneuf 200 31.5%
6.Nick Lidstrom 211 30.8%
7.Brent Burns 194 30.4%
8.Ryan Suter 205 30.2%
9.Sergei Gonchar 182 30.2%
10.Tyler Myers 156 30.1%
11.Mark Fayne 147 29.9%
12.Joni Pitkanen 211 29.9%
13.Alec Martinez 124 29.8%
14.Jake Gardiner 196 29.6%
15.Toni Lydman 149 29.5%
16.Andrej Sekera 163 29.4%
17.Christian Ehrhoff 150 29.3%
18.Brent Seabrook 265 28.7%
19.PK Subban 221 28.5%
20.Steve Montador 229 28.4%

Minimum 100 puck touches

 

[LeafOfBread]

Well honestly, do you actually believe he is an intelligent hockey player? Do you think he is a good skater?

99% of the time when a goal is scored and he is out of position, people blame Gunnar. Hell, even after he made that ridiculous run at Horton in the playoffs last year, most people around here still ended up blaming O'Byrne and Reimer for the goal.

I like the guy as a player, but not as a $6.5 million #1. I think most "Phaneuf haters" would agree.

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1467&mode=print&nocache=1362268029

Phaneuf is one of the best puck-rushing d-men in the league. Note: there is a difference between puck rusher and PMD.

 

[LeafOfBread]

oops, beaten to it. Good work Harrison

 

[Zybalto]

Phaneuf will always suffer from his insane early success and his first rough couple of years in Toronto. He has been amazing the last couple of years (when not overplayed) and is a needed weapon at the back for Toronto to compete in the Atlantic.

8 more years at 6.5 would be epic to lock him up at and will look like a steal halfway through the contract.

 

[hockeyfanz*]

excuses for what?

being top-10 in every important offensive, defensive, and physical category in hockey, and leading his team to the playoffs?

the only excuses around here are made by the haters, trying to "excuse" the fact that he's a league leader amongst defensemen across the board.

Or simply that not everybody views him as a great player. Its pretty arbitrary if you ask me. He isn't exactly a shoe-in for allstars or national teams or norris voting or anything really. Its not like arguing the greatness of legitimate great players who have proven over and over again to be truly "elite"....a word that is really thrown around too lightly. Anybody who thinks he sucks is being over the top ridiculous...but no more than those who believe he is one of the best D-men in the league who deserves to be paid as much.

I wonder how many of you "Phaneuf is worth 7.5M" guys thought so when he was a Flame. I'm willing to bet not many at all. And he was actually a better player then. The formula is quite simple really...if you are a Leaf fan and a good player gets to don the blue and white....that good player all of a sudden gets elevated to "elite".

 

[zeke]

leafs players get more unfairly shat upon than any other players in hockey. Phaneuf got norris votes in every single year he played in calgary.

 

[hockeyfanz*]

leafs players get more unfairly shat upon than any other players in hockey. Phaneuf got norris votes in every single year he played in calgary.

I think this is untrue and the "woe is me" attitude. Of course opposing fan bases who hate the Leafs will crap on Leaf players (ie Kessel contract today)...but hockey fans of the actual sport will know and admit that the Kessel contract was a fair one. But if I hate the Leafs I will say it was an overpayment for a soft player. I don't care how much you hate Crosby but if you tell me he is over-rated...I would definitely call you out. I am not a Pens fan but recognizing greatness doesn't require you to be a fan of the player or the team and the reverse is true. Just because the player captains your favorite team, it doesn't immediately warrant a greatness label.

I don't get why the opinion that Dion is not a 7M dollar Dman is immediately taken as an insult and makes you ignorant or worse a troll. I believe its a fair opinion. To state that he is trash and should not be offered a contract would be in that category.

Me, personally think he is a good player but should not be Captain. I also believe that if Dion is your best defenceman and one of your highest paid players., you aren't winning the Stanley Cup. So far it appears to be true. Damn, I hope he proves me wrong. As a Leaf

 

[StringsAttached]

I honestly think he's a top 2 D blessed with great physical gifts. If only his hockey IQ were higher...because he makes a few silly mistakes his overall play is totally disregarded.

 

[mikebel111*]

I honestly think he's a top 2 D blessed with great physical gifts. If only his hockey IQ were higher...because he makes a few silly mistakes his overall play is totally disregarded.

Those happen after playing 28+ minutes a game. if he sticks to 25. those mistakes will probably not happen. You can say that about any top d man.

 

[StringsAttached]

Those happen after playing 28+ minutes a game. if he sticks to 25. those mistakes will probably not happen. You can say that about any top d man.

That's precisely it.

 

[Confucius]

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1467&mode=print&nocache=1362268029

Phaneuf is one of the best puck-rushing d-men in the league. Note: there is a difference between puck rusher and PMD.

Phaneuf never looks like he's rushing. More like one hand on his stick and move slow.

 

[studebaker17]

Or simply that not everybody views him as a great player. Its pretty arbitrary if you ask me. He isn't exactly a shoe-in for allstars or national teams or norris voting or anything really. Its not like arguing the greatness of legitimate great players who have proven over and over again to be truly "elite"....a word that is really thrown around too lightly. Anybody who thinks he sucks is being over the top ridiculous...but no more than those who believe he is one of the best D-men in the league who deserves to be paid as much.

I wonder how many of you "Phaneuf is worth 7.5M" guys thought so when he was a Flame. I'm willing to bet not many at all. And he was actually a better player then. The formula is quite simple really...if you are a Leaf fan and a good player gets to don the blue and white....that good player all of a sudden gets elevated to "elite".

if he was a shoe in for being a norris, or allstar candidate we would be talking at much more than a 7 million salary. weber's not a shoe in and he's making 14 million this year, suter's same case. the only shoe in in the last decade has been lidstrom.

 

[Tyler Biggs*]

Leaf fans have to get off Dion's case. His ONLY sin is that he logs too much ice time. He is playing very well other than being out there with rubbery legs in critical situations. Watch the games and see if it's not obvious to you as well. Hopefully Carlyle can cut back some Dion minutes based on another d-man stepping up. That would be wonderful 'cause Dion can't carry the load by himself. But in the meantime leave Phaneuf alone. He is doing everything asked of him and more.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

and by "struggles" you mean is amongst the league leaders in every important offensive, defensive, and physical category, leading his team to a top-10 finish in the league.

Yet plays with a $3 million dollar partner. I really wonder if those who criticize him want Chris Pronger or something. Even he had limitations especially with regards to speed.

Point being, Phaneuf is relied upon heavily, under a developing system, and yet he produces at a top ten level. We should be seeing a lot more praise than less. Simply put, if we want to contend now, he is a more important piece than any defenceman. I'd start moving others if we're going to be entering cap hell.

 

[pooleboy]

its like people in leaf land expect our teams to never get scored on or never make a bad play or expect any players on any other team to make good plays. Phaneuf is a #1 Dman in my books and the grass isn't always greener, just saying Shea Weber playing in Toronto u think his mistakes would be more magnified and would prolly be the whipping boy aka phaneuf now? or he just doesn't make mistakes?

 

[The_Chosen_One]

Leaf fans have to get off Dion's case. His ONLY sin is that he logs too much ice time. He is playing very well other than being out there with rubbery legs in critical situations. Watch the games and see if it's not obvious to you as well. Hopefully Carlyle can cut back some Dion minutes based on another d-man stepping up. That would be wonderful 'cause Dion can't carry the load by himself. But in the meantime leave Phaneuf alone. He is doing everything asked of him and more.

The issue is not his minutes, but his partner. If he had a top pairing partner, he would obviously play a lot more effectively. You can't be expecting him to carry AHLers or a marginal mid-pairing guy in Gunnarsson, and expect limited errors.

Furthermore, most of our defensive faults come from our forwards. Our core do not support our defenceman well nor are they able to drive possession effectively. I think we need to let Bolland centre Kessel. We really need a more defensively stronger top line. Every contending team has one.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

I think this is untrue and the "woe is me" attitude. Of course opposing fan bases who hate the Leafs will crap on Leaf players (ie Kessel contract today)...but hockey fans of the actual sport will know and admit that the Kessel contract was a fair one. But if I hate the Leafs I will say it was an overpayment for a soft player. I don't care how much you hate Crosby but if you tell me he is over-rated...I would definitely call you out. I am not a Pens fan but recognizing greatness doesn't require you to be a fan of the player or the team and the reverse is true. Just because the player captains your favorite team, it doesn't immediately warrant a greatness label.

I don't get why the opinion that Dion is not a 7M dollar Dman is immediately taken as an insult and makes you ignorant or worse a troll. I believe its a fair opinion. To state that he is trash and should not be offered a contract would be in that category.

Me, personally think he is a good player but should not be Captain. I also believe that if Dion is your best defenceman and one of your highest paid players., you aren't winning the Stanley Cup. So far it appears to be true. Damn, I hope he proves me wrong. As a Leaf

If we look at the salary of his comparable defencemen, $7 million is more than fair. He's a #1D and produces at high levels at both ends of the ice. Seeing that Weber and the rest will be receiving a much higher salary due to their front-loaded contracts, I don't see anything wrong with a slight cap upgrade to his current $6.5 million deal. It's not like his performance differs that greatly to other highly paid defenceman.

 

[zeke]

Gunnar-Phaneuf was excellent last year, and have been excellent again this year.

Phaneuf has been utterly dominant.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

its like people in leaf land expect our teams to never get scored on or never make a bad play. Phaneuf is a #1 Dman in my books and the grass isn't always greener, just saying Shea Weber playing in Toronto u think his mistakes would be more magnified and would prolly be the whipping boy aka phaneuf now? or he just doesn't make mistakes?

Most here haven't even seen Nashville play. It amazes me, because we utilise a very different system. Ironically, Nashville were leaders when it came to GA despite using a hard trap system.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Gunnar-Phaneuf was excellent last year, and have been excellent again this year.

Phaneuf has been utterly dominant.

He's been as good as he has ever been in Toronto the first 4 games this season .. Adding some offense, while playing tough minutes quietly .. I've hardly heard his name mentioned in the defensive zone

Would be happy if we could get him locked up for under $7 mill per season

 

[Eb]

its like people in leaf land expect our teams to never get scored on or never make a bad play or expect any players on any other team to make good plays. Phaneuf is a #1 Dman in my books and the grass isn't always greener, just saying Shea Weber playing in Toronto u think his mistakes would be more magnified and would prolly be the whipping boy aka phaneuf now? or he just doesn't make mistakes?

So why do you want to pay him 5.5 million per season if he's a #1 dman?