Confirmed with Link: Washington Caps Trade Perreault to Anaheim...

RandyHolt

Keep truckin'
Nov 3, 2006
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I was just curious what his value was. I didn't say George should trade him. If someone overpaid, would YOU trade him?

To answer your question, I would say you trade him because his value may be inflated from a playoff filled with hitting, had a hot preseason, and because we have too many RWs. And because we have Nick Grabs and probably both Erat and Laich ahead of him at center.
 

BobRouse

Registered User
Mar 18, 2009
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I was just curious what his value was. I didn't say George should trade him. If someone overpaid, would YOU trade him?

To answer your question, I would say you trade him because his value may be inflated from a playoff filled with hitting, had a hot preseason, and because we have too many RWs. And because we have Nick Grabs and probably both Erat and Laich ahead of him at center.

I guess it depends on what the value is....but based on what I think we could get for him I believe he has more value with us easily.

First Oates loves him it seems and all facets of his game have improved. That started last year not this preseason.

Second we know Oates is big on the Righty/Lefty thing. However Fehr is the goto guy when we need a LW so his versatility in this system has value..especially if he can play center effectively.

Third..realistically what do you really think we could get? The guy was available for free before last season and altho he had a bounce back season it wasn't like he was on a 30g pace.

I doubt GMs would watch him in preseason games and say "hey...that is a guy WE MUST HAVE!"

There are alot of players who we have that are at a high value but you have to put it into context of the big picture and what we are trying to do. We are trying to win now and correctly so given Ovechkin's prime years are dwindling.
 

Calicaps

NFA
Aug 3, 2006
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Do you think Erat is one of the Caps' top 4-6 forwards? If so, why do you care what line he plays on? I mean if you hate the trade you hate the trade, there are plenty of totally reasonable reasons to be against it. What line Erat plays on seems one of the sillier ones.

Forsberg projects as a top-6, maybe top-3 forward. We traded him away for a guy who was supposed to fill that role now. And can't. Added to his age and cost and I think it's a genuine issue.
 

brs03

Coo coo ca cha!
Jun 2, 2008
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0
Maryland
Forsberg projects as a top-6, maybe top-3 forward. We traded him away for a guy who was supposed to fill that role now. And can't. Added to his age and cost and I think it's a genuine issue.

Why do you say he "can't" just because he isn't? More importantly, why do you think a team should play their 6 best forwards only on lines 1 and 2?

Like I said, there are plenty of reasons to be against the trade. There were other cheaper (free) options out there that are almost as good as Erat and cost less. But they got Erat and that's that. How they use him now is irrelevant, he's here.
 

Ajax1995

Registered User
Dec 9, 2002
8,809
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I feel it is silly to complain about where guys are slotted in for game 1. I want to see how things play out and where they are slotted in for game 21. There are a decent amount of new pieces in this puzzle and at this point what ones work best together is anyone's guess IMO.
 

NobodyBeatsTheWiz

Happy now?
Jun 26, 2004
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The Burbs
Even being a card carrying draftnik since the early 90s I was ok with the Forsberg trade. Feels sort of useless to try and speculate if a better trade option was out there. That trade was a obviously a short term trade in having a pro LWer for last season and this one. Considering the core players age I am fine with this.

Jokinen is a pro LWer, and he was available for a conditional 7th.
 

brs03

Coo coo ca cha!
Jun 2, 2008
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Maryland
Jokinen is a pro LWer, and he was available for a conditional 7th.

He was available for absolutely nothing (or, whatever the waiver claim fee is if there is one for normal waivers) a few days before the deadline. That's what sticks in my craw about the trade. Erat has been a very, very good player in the past and he's got a decent chance of still being one (aging could happen quickly but he's not *that* old yet) while he's here. But when someone good is literally being given away it's hard to be comfortable paying a big asset for someone else.
 

BobRouse

Registered User
Mar 18, 2009
10,144
373
Jokinen? Oh my...

The guy is a god awful puke. Didn't he get scratched in favor to Tyler Kennedy when things went south in the Isles series? He barely played in half their playoff games and was downright invisible.

The guy is just a better version of Wolski and we already had the original
 

MW6

Registered User
Oct 21, 2011
1,403
52
Halland
laich does somethings very well at a top 6 level which is why he has been very good on pp1 over the years. as an offensive player his is not well rounded enough to be a quality 2c. as a center he would be better as a 3c because he isn't a good playmaker on the rush. he is purely a dump and chase player at center. as a winger doing the chasing he is highly effective.

so...yea, its easy to see that oates might see laich as more valuable at 2LW than 3C.

Yes, i agree, rather Laich as 2LW than 3C if the replacement for 3C is almost just as good of a 3C, BUT is he that much better as 2LW than Erat to experiment with other players out of position just to keep him at 2LW.
But maybe he doesn't like Volpatti as 4LW and with only RH-shots being able to fill that position with Laich at C it's out of the question?
 

BobRouse

Registered User
Mar 18, 2009
10,144
373
You're talking about Erat, right?

Good one but no dice. Big difference between sucking to the point of being scratched versus getting injured.

Jokinen is not even close to Erat as a player.

Its fine if you guys don't like the trade but don't pretend that Jokinen would have been a perfect replacement for a good solid competitor and all around player like Erat.
 

BrooklynCapsFan

No more choking!
Oct 23, 2002
17,872
60
Brooklyn, New York
Good one but no dice. Big difference between sucking to the point of being scratched versus getting injured.

Jokinen is not even close to Erat as a player.

Its fine if you guys don't like the trade but don't pretend that Jokinen would have been a perfect replacement for a good solid competitor and all around player like Erat.

Jokinen cost nothing and produced more than Erat. He would have been an excellent replacement for Erat's acquisition last year. Then this year, when we don't need either player, we'd be right where we are now but with an extra blue chipper and $5 million in cap space.
 

BrooklynCapsFan

No more choking!
Oct 23, 2002
17,872
60
Brooklyn, New York
are you saying that you would rather have jokinen now than erat? come on.

We have no need for either player. If you make me take one, I take Jokinen and waive him right off the team while keeping $4.5 million and Forsberg.

Johansson-Backstrom-Ovechkin
Laich-Grabovski-Brouwer
Chimera-Fehr-Wilson/Forsberg
Whatever-Beagle-Ward
 

txpd

Registered User
Jan 25, 2003
69,649
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New Bern, NC
Yes, i agree, rather Laich as 2LW than 3C if the replacement for 3C is almost just as good of a 3C, BUT is he that much better as 2LW than Erat to experiment with other players out of position just to keep him at 2LW.
But maybe he doesn't like Volpatti as 4LW and with only RH-shots being able to fill that position with Laich at C it's out of the question?

I think you are reading WAY too much into WAY too little. Essentially the lineup for one game means nothing. My read is that Oates wants to give Fehr or Erat a ride at center early in the season while the training camp practice schedule is fresh and the opposition also feeling their way into the season rather than later in the season when there is almost no time for practice and instruction.

don't forget this is an Olympic season and the schedule compacted. by mid season there will be a many optional skates as actual practices as the wear and tear will build up. now is the time to try it and see if it takes. that includes carrick and latta and Wilson.

what you see tonight often bares no resemblance to the lineup for playoff game 1.
 

txpd

Registered User
Jan 25, 2003
69,649
14,131
New Bern, NC
We have no need for either player. If you make me take one, I take Jokinen and waive him right off the team while keeping $4.5 million and Forsberg.

Johansson-Backstrom-Ovechkin
Laich-Grabovski-Brouwer
Chimera-Fehr-Wilson/Forsberg
Whatever-Beagle-Ward

I disagree with that on several levels, but I wont argue with you. I could give you a note from god on this stuff and you wouldn't change your view. I think erat was a good get and will pay off when it counts. only time will tell. won't you love it when you are wrong on this?
 

brs03

Coo coo ca cha!
Jun 2, 2008
12,066
0
Maryland
are you saying that you would rather have jokinen now than erat? come on.

I *think* I'd rather have Jokinen+Forsberg+1.5 mil in cap space instead of Erat+Latta. If I trusted them to use the space appropriately. Honestly, though, that might mean Ribeiro instead of Grabovski, which I'd be against.
 

RandyHolt

Keep truckin'
Nov 3, 2006
34,793
7,120
Ha good point. If we didnt get Erat we would have Ribs and his terrible SWAG and doo. We heard early and often that the Erat trade would prevent us from signing Ribs, so since that was a big argument lets assume it was true.

Brs was always on top of his ugly duck numbers. PP aside. Lame faceoffs. Pick your poison but at least Erats aggressiveness results in penalties of aggression, not 2 min unsports.

Ribs at 2C (think 4 x ~5M or so) and Forsberg at 3-4RW/Hershey to start, or we have Erat at 2-4LW (4.5 x2) and Latta at 4C.

The win may be those later years of Ribs and fans hating that deal for a guy pulling 42% dominating on the PP but sucking at ES / PK, and showing no discipline at all.
 

Calicaps

NFA
Aug 3, 2006
21,965
14,357
Almost Canada
We have no need for either player. If you make me take one, I take Jokinen and waive him right off the team while keeping $4.5 million and Forsberg.

Johansson-Backstrom-Ovechkin
Laich-Grabovski-Brouwer
Chimera-Fehr-Wilson/Forsberg
Whatever-Beagle-Ward

Winner!

If the question is, did the trade make us better last year and therefore was the value realized, then the answer has to be no.

So Jokinen would have likely had the same impact as Erat last season and THIS season, we'd be in much better roster and cap shape.
 

Ridley Simon

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Feb 27, 2002
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Do you think Grabovski's ONLY choice was the Caps? I thought there were like 5 or 10 teams in the mix? If so do you think he had no role in making that happen?

And you are so certain that he wasn't putting out feelers around the league or had contingency plans if Grabovski didn't pan out?

GMGM has put as tough and talented a roster together this year than we've had in a long while. 09-10 team was great but very soft and mushy.

This years team is the closest we've had to the 89-90 team in terms of a mix of grit and skill. 97-98 had grit but lacked in skill up and down the lineup.

Wilson and Carrick both look like they should have went higher in the draft than they did. We are starting to hit on later picks like Holtby, Grubauer, Carrick and others waiting in the wings.

Latta looks like an NHLer. Give credit where its due instead of just trying to adhere to your initial viewpoint which I think is what you are doing.

Its laughable that you think we are only "possiby" better than Florida/Buffalo and on par with Carolina/Tampa/Columbus. There is a point where you reach when you've gone too far....that point was easily crossed with your preview of this season.

Look, I get it, and have said it. You are gulping the McPhee kool-aid. In gallons. You are thrilled that he has constructed a team to your liking. It doesn't take an genius to see how happy you are. But none of it makes the team necessarily better. It just doesn't. It might, but we haven't played a single game yet.

The team that lost in the first round (again), swapped out Ribeiro for Grabovski (a player you hated and had massive disdain for before we signed him....you have pulled a massive John Kerry on him), and lost Hendricks and Perrault. It's added 2 kids (Wilson and Latta), and *maybe* a healthy Brooks Laich.

So those changes are supposed to equal glory? Wilson is 19....let that sink in. Your expectations of him are ridiculous. Freaking 19!!

Carolina was leading the division before they lost their entire defense, and their most invaluable player (Ward). Tampa has offense in spades, and a rebuilt Defense to go along with a new goalie. C-bus was the hottest team at the end if the year, and has the reigning Vezina winner. So we should just dismiss them all, off hand, because you like our roster?? Good Lord, Bob. Give it a rest.

Seriously, please.

And as far as Where Grabovski could have landed? There were like 3 teams that had a need, and had space. Caps were one of them. You can believe George's hyperbole all you want, as that's obviously the direction you have decided to go (and is YOUR narrative, as much as George's failures are mine....you are being a hypocrite here, sorry to say). But it didn't take a rocket scientist to see that Grabovski was probably going to get a one year deal, as a means to reestablish himself as a viable offensive weapon. Carlyle took that from him, so what better place to get it back than in DC, with the reigning Hart winner? Ribs handed that to him, on a platter.
 
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MW6

Registered User
Oct 21, 2011
1,403
52
Halland
I think you are reading WAY too much into WAY too little. Essentially the lineup for one game means nothing. My read is that Oates wants to give Fehr or Erat a ride at center early in the season while the training camp practice schedule is fresh and the opposition also feeling their way into the season rather than later in the season when there is almost no time for practice and instruction.

don't forget this is an Olympic season and the schedule compacted. by mid season there will be a many optional skates as actual practices as the wear and tear will build up. now is the time to try it and see if it takes. that includes carrick and latta and Wilson.

what you see tonight often bares no resemblance to the lineup for playoff game 1.

Good points!
I hope you're right because I don't really like the "fit" on the second line, their characteristics seems a little to similar. But maybe that will make it work.. I guess like you said, time will tell..
 

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