Confirmed with Link: Veleno signs... 1 year $825K

Gniwder

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I'm not sure there will be a spot for him after this year.
As long as his contract can be buried it's not a big deal. At basically league min, I'd take that for 5 years, he could always be traded.

Fact of the matter is, it's only 1 and he gets a chance to prove himself. I said in the previous Joey thread that Stevie wasn't gonna make the same mistake as he did with Zadina, but even I didn't think he'd lowball Joey below QO.
 

Pavels Dog

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The good thing is we have a lot of depth so even if he's stuck at 4th line center he'll have some decent wingers.
The bad thing is that he's probably not going to have much of a runway to prove himself with guys like Kasper, Mazur and Söderblom trying to get into the lineup.
 

Henkka

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Good caphit to be traded at the deadline and open a spot for Kasper, who is gonna be one of our centers with Larkin, Copp and Compher.

I could see this is Veleno's last season as a Red Wing and will be part on some next trade Yzerman completes at some point.
 

Gniwder

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Good caphit to be traded at the deadline and open a spot for Kasper, who is gonna be one of our centers with Larkin, Copp and Compher.

I could see this is Veleno's last season as a Red Wing and will be part on some next trade Yzerman completes at some point.

I'm guessing that is the angle Stevie took to talk him into a salary lower than his QO. Stevie couldn't trade Zadina because of that ridiculous contract with $2.7M in his third year, so maybe Stevie promised to trade Joey if he doesn't get regular ice time. I don't see any other reason for Joey to stomp his own foot and take a pay cut unless he's looking to get traded.

My personal take on this is that Joey is an ideal player to have as an extra forward. League min contract, defensively responsible, throws a few hits, and plays center. Prospects like Kasper, Danielson, Mazur and Elmer don't need to sit in a pressbox. Plus roster space will be created through expiring contracts like Fabbri, Fisher, and Sprong.

If Joey doesn't return something worthwhile in a trade, Stevie might as well re-sign him for one more year then let him walk. We know Draper is just gonna waste the pick anyways.
 

ShelbyZ

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You noticed the same thing I noticed, he signed for less than QO and is arbitration eligible next year....

I don't understand why he didn't take the QO. I think he'd get claimed on waivers as long hi contract is buriable. Freakin Stevie played some serious Jedi mind trick on the kid and his agent, lol. Granted it's only for $50k, but still has me laughing.

To be fair, I would think most players in Veleno's shoes would reject the QO in hopes of getting more. I'm guessing maybe his camp gambled that if they sat for a bit there would eventually be some favorable comparable that would insulate whatever their asking price was. I think Kupari was the closest and he recently signed a 2 year deal giving him $900k this season and $1.1M next.

I'm guessing that is the angle Stevie took to talk him into a salary lower than his QO. Stevie couldn't trade Zadina because of that ridiculous contract with $2.7M in his third year, so maybe Stevie promised to trade Joey if he doesn't get regular ice time. I don't see any other reason for Joey to stomp his own foot and take a pay cut unless he's looking to get traded.

My personal take on this is that Joey is an ideal player to have as an extra forward. League min contract, defensively responsible, throws a few hits, and plays center. Prospects like Kasper, Danielson, Mazur and Elmer don't need to sit in a pressbox. Plus roster space will be created through expiring contracts like Fabbri, Fisher, and Sprong.

If Joey doesn't return something worthwhile in a trade, Stevie might as well re-sign him for one more year then let him walk. We know Draper is just gonna waste the pick anyways.

IIRC, QO's "expire" maybe a week or two after free agency starts. I would bet Veleno and his agent let it expire. In that case, Yzerman didn't have to activate his midichlorians to trick Joey in to taking less money.

I would also bet that Yzerman probably had one of his backloaded 2 or 3 year deals available at an AAV around $1M, structured similar to the deals he gives RFA's going all the way back to Tampa (IE Rasmussen, Zadina, Lindstrom, Gudas, Vasilevskiy, etc. etc.).

Veleno's camp is probably betting that with him being a center and the Wings looking like they'll be a better team this season (thus padding Veleno's numbers a bit), they can get more next summer when Veleno has arbitration rights. So they asked for a one year instead. Since they have no leverage and the QO expired, this is what they got.

The Jedi Master that Yzerman was once a Padawan Learner under used a similar force persuasion 6 summers ago on a young fast Pod Racer named Andreas. Offering him a safe 2 year deal for just under $4M total or $1.2M for a year to likely net him more than the $2.7M left on the table when his Toydarian Junk Dealer Darren Ferris would be able to threaten arbitration. They eventually settled on 1 year $1.375M. Less than a year later and after an arguably worse season for Andreas, he signed for 2 years and $6M total. Probably also because Jedi mind tricks don't work on Toydarians.
 
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ShelbyZ

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The reason he didn't accept his qualifying offer could be because it was two way.

Good point there. Just looked it up and Veleno was 9 NHL games shy of requiring a 1-way QO, so I'll bet that also factored in.
 
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RRhoads

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Good point there. Just looked it up and Veleno was 9 NHL games shy of requiring a 1-way QO, so I'll bet that also factored in.
Yeah, I can see why he wanted that deal. Good for the player and good for the team. Hope he takes advantage of the deal and take his game to another level.
 
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ShelbyZ

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On a scale where 0 is Cory Emmerton and 10 is Luke Glendening, where does Veleno rank as a #4C?
 

Run the Jewels

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I think this is a lot due to role he is told to play.
He's a 23 year old former first round draft pick on a team with little skill and no depth at center. If he couldn't make a case for getting middle 6 minutes up to this point, when will he now that we have Compher and will have Kasper and Danielson shortly?

I get that you think there is something there and that's fine, I just don't see a path for him going forward. People always said Blashill wasn't using Zadina correctly, but he still couldn't hack it under Lalonde.
 
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Gniwder

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IIRC, QO's "expire" maybe a week or two after free agency starts. I would bet Veleno and his agent let it expire. In that case, Yzerman didn't have to activate his midichlorians to trick Joey in to taking less money.
OK, I had to look it up, but it appears you are correct:

A Qualifying Offer cannot actually be accepted before July 1. If a Qualifying Offer is not accepted, it expires by July 15 unless extended in writing by the team.​


That explains it, I did not realize QO's had an expiration date.

The reason he didn't accept his qualifying offer could be because it was two way.
It probably was 2 way because he doesn't meet the requirements for a one way contract, but I don't see how that would be a huge concern considering the high likelihood of getting claimed if waived. He's better than a bunch of players on cellar teams, and makes a suitable spare part for any team considering he's below $1M/season.
 

RRhoads

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He's a 23 year old former first round draft pick on a team with little skill and no depth at center. If he couldn't make a case for getting middle 6 minutes up to this point, when will he now that we have Compher and will have Kasper and Danielson shortly?

I get that you think there is something there and that's fine, I just don't see a path for him going forward. People always said Blashill wasn't using Zadina correctly, but he still couldn't hack it under Lalonde.
Wouldn't say that I think there is something there. Not gonna say there isn't anything there either. But at the price, and with the current lineup, it is worth it to find out.
 

jaster

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To be fair, I would think most players in Veleno's shoes would reject the QO in hopes of getting more. I'm guessing maybe his camp gambled that if they sat for a bit there would eventually be some favorable comparable that would insulate whatever their asking price was. I think Kupari was the closest and he recently signed a 2 year deal giving him $900k this season and $1.1M next.



IIRC, QO's "expire" maybe a week or two after free agency starts. I would bet Veleno and his agent let it expire. In that case, Yzerman didn't have to activate his midichlorians to trick Joey in to taking less money.

I would also bet that Yzerman probably had one of his backloaded 2 or 3 year deals available at an AAV around $1M, structured similar to the deals he gives RFA's going all the way back to Tampa (IE Rasmussen, Zadina, Lindstrom, Gudas, Vasilevskiy, etc. etc.).

Veleno's camp is probably betting that with him being a center and the Wings looking like they'll be a better team this season (thus padding Veleno's numbers a bit), they can get more next summer when Veleno has arbitration rights. So they asked for a one year instead. Since they have no leverage and the QO expired, this is what they got.

The Jedi Master that Yzerman was once a Padawan Learner under used a similar force persuasion 6 summers ago on a young fast Pod Racer named Andreas. Offering him a safe 2 year deal for just under $4M total or $1.2M for a year to likely net him more than the $2.7M left on the table when his Toydarian Junk Dealer Darren Ferris would be able to threaten arbitration. They eventually settled on 1 year $1.375M. Less than a year later and after an arguably worse season for Andreas, he signed for 2 years and $6M total. Probably also because Jedi mind tricks don't work on Toydarians.
I'm here for this post.
 
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Gniwder

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He's a 23 year old former first round draft pick on a team with little skill and no depth at center. If he couldn't make a case for getting middle 6 minutes up to this point, when will he now that we have Compher and will have Kasper and Danielson shortly?

I get that you think there is something there and that's fine, I just don't see a path for him going forward. People always said Blashill wasn't using Zadina correctly, but he still couldn't hack it under Lalonde.
4C. For that to work though, he absolutely has to get better at faceoffs, and he needs to PK more.

Quite frankly I don't think any of the centers you listed should be playing 4C, same for Raz, Copp, Fabbri, and obviously Larkin. The extra centers can always play wing on a higher line. That makes more sense than 10 - 12 minutes per game playing 4C. Raz, Copp, Compher, and Fabbri all have played wing.

Sprong, Fischer, and Perron are on expiring contracts, and Fabbri the season after. If Joey can't beat out Fischer for a roster spot, then he's certainly gone. I'd like to see him stick around until Stevie finds a better 4C that can win faceoffs and PK. Ironically, the UFA that best fits that bill this offseason would have been Nosek (59% FO win% last season).
 

jaster

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On a scale where 0 is Cory Emmerton and 10 is Luke Glendening, where does Veleno rank as a #4C?
I've never really liked Veleno's game. It's very vanilla, and there's no carrying tool. I'm also convinced there is something missing between the ears. I've been able to tolerate him because he has a decent enough floor, no huge weaknesses, but it's also like, what does this kid provide that makes him better than replacement-level? I don't see anything now, and I don't see anything in the future. He's not really a kid anymore either, he's going to be 24 in a few months.

Not that this forum rates him especially high, but I've been lower on him than probably most people here, so in that sense he's always been overrated to me.

Anyway, to answer the question, ehhhh.... a 3?
 
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jaster

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He's a 23 year old former first round draft pick on a team with little skill and no depth at center. If he couldn't make a case for getting middle 6 minutes up to this point, when will he now that we have Compher and will have Kasper and Danielson shortly?

I get that you think there is something there and that's fine, I just don't see a path for him going forward. People always said Blashill wasn't using Zadina correctly, but he still couldn't hack it under Lalonde.
Yep. "He's being used incorrectly" is the most tired, exhausting argument that exists when discussing players, for my money. Maybe second most, after "the coaches ruined him." People seem to imagine certain players as being a certain thing in their head, and if that thing doesn't materialize, it's someone else's fault. Rather than, you know, players often just aren't as good as hoped.

I'm not saying anyone is necessarily making that argument here, but it is a point that does get made around here over and over.
 

Bench

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Yep. "He's being used incorrectly" is the most tired, exhausting argument that exists when discussing players, for my money. Maybe second most, after "the coaches ruined him." People seem to imagine certain players as being a certain thing in their head, and if that thing doesn't materialize, it's someone else's fault. Rather than, you know, players often just aren't as good as hoped.

I'm not saying anyone is necessarily making that argument here, but it is a point that does get made around here over and over.

Brendan. Smith.
 
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jaster

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That's another way of saying he's a well rounded player.

That's another way of saying this is his 23 year old season.
Welcome to the no-spin zone ;)

The minors and Euro leagues are littered with “well-rounded players.” Label it all how you’d like. But he’s reaching the end stages of his development curve and is still only a hair above being a quad-A player.
 
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