Speculation: Vasili Podkolzin NHL arrival? (read OP)

when will Vasili Podkolzin be NHL ready?


  • Total voters
    165

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,505
Vancouver, BC
Not a chance. As i said above. He will have an out clause like Tryamkin did, and go back to Russia if they try to send him to Utica. Why ride the bus for $70K a year when I am sure he will get way more than that in Russia, without the problem of trying to fit in.

Starting in 2014 :

Russian #1 picks that started their pro career in the AHL :

Scherbak
Goldobin
Gurianov
Samsonov
E. Svechnikov
Rubtsov
Kostin
Kravtsov

Russian #1 picks that didn't start their pro career in the AHL :

Provorov
Sergachev
A. Svechnikov

Basically outside of three guys that went straight from the CHL to the NHL, every single Russian #1 pick for the last 5 years has done his time in the AHL. Kravtsov is the only one who went home, after half a season which was a total disaster. The scenario you're suggesting would be very unusual and speak to a very poorly handled situation from the organization or a player who simply didn't care about playing in the NHL.

Right now Podkolzin is a bottom-6 player (and looks it) in an AHL-calibre league. It is highly unlikely he's suddenly a quality middle-6 forward in the NHL next season. Not impossible, but not something people should be banking on.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,505
Vancouver, BC
Maybe his knack for scoring needs some work, but Podkolzin's grit, determination to chase pucks, his intensity, and forechecking is NHL ready. He'd fit on the Canucks 3rd line nicely right now

Watched the recent SKA-Moscow Dynamo game a couple days ago and he was struggling to make an impact on a 3rd line in an AHL-calibre league. He absolutely would not fit in on an NHL 3rd line right now.
 
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ChilliBilly

Registered User
Aug 22, 2007
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Starting in 2014 :

Russian #1 picks that started their pro career in the AHL :

Scherbak
Goldobin
Gurianov
Samsonov
E. Svechnikov
Rubtsov
Kostin
Kravtsov

Russian #1 picks that didn't start their pro career in the AHL :

Provorov
Sergachev
A. Svechnikov

Basically outside of three guys that went straight from the CHL to the NHL, every single Russian #1 pick for the last 5 years has done his time in the AHL. Kravtsov is the only one who went home, after half a season which was a total disaster. The scenario you're suggesting would be very unusual and speak to a very poorly handled situation from the organization or a player who simply didn't care about playing in the NHL.

Right now Podkolzin is a bottom-6 player (and looks it) in an AHL-calibre league. It is highly unlikely he's suddenly a quality middle-6 forward in the NHL next season. Not impossible, but not something people should be banking on.

Fair comment, but how many of those guys had 2 years of KHL experience first. Too lazy to look it up myself ... and I still stand by my comment, handle this kid with kid gloves, he could easily go back to the KHL if he is not given a legitimate chance to make the team. And we have no idea what the AHL will look like this year either.
 

Disappointed EP40

Registered User
Jan 13, 2015
3,222
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Starting in 2014 :

Russian #1 picks that started their pro career in the AHL :

Scherbak
Goldobin
Gurianov
Samsonov
E. Svechnikov
Rubtsov
Kostin
Kravtsov

Russian #1 picks that didn't start their pro career in the AHL :

Provorov
Sergachev
A. Svechnikov

Basically outside of three guys that went straight from the CHL to the NHL, every single Russian #1 pick for the last 5 years has done his time in the AHL. Kravtsov is the only one who went home, after half a season which was a total disaster. The scenario you're suggesting would be very unusual and speak to a very poorly handled situation from the organization or a player who simply didn't care about playing in the NHL.

Right now Podkolzin is a bottom-6 player (and looks it) in an AHL-calibre league. It is highly unlikely he's suddenly a quality middle-6 forward in the NHL next season. Not impossible, but not something people should be banking on.

This.

Could the kid survive a game or two in the NHL? Probably. Would that be the best for him, would he contribute, and would he develop optimally? Very unlikely.

I love the conviction some people have in their opinion, when they haven't actually watched a single game and are just going on preconceived notions based on highlight reels and reputation.

I expect him to come over and get a shot at developing an offensive game in the AHL for a season.
 

VanJack

Registered User
Jul 11, 2014
21,303
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There's not a chance in the world Podkolzin plays a game in the AHL. With the amount of money they'll have to pay to re-up Pettersson and Hughes; and the 'dead money' for declining veterans still on the books; they're going to need kids on entry level contracts who can actually contribute.

So by the 2021-22 season, Podkolzin and probably Hoglander, make the team almost by default.
 

logan5

Registered User
May 24, 2011
6,128
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Vancouver - Mt. Pleasant
He should get in some games this season in either the NHL or AHL. That will allow him to get more comfortable here, and be ready for the 21/22 season, where he will still be a rookie.

This guy is the perfect type of player you want on Pettersson's wing, so I think he will be given ample opportunity to be on the 1st line, creating space for Pettersson.

Maybe people are forgetting (because of the KHL fiasco) that Podkolzin is a highly skilled player, not just a high energy puck pursuit player, so if he is fitting in with Pettersson, he is going to rack up points and imo has a shot at at least being in the Calder conversation in the 21/22 season.
 

Svencouver

Registered User
Apr 8, 2015
5,252
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Vancouver
Benning loves bringing guys in at the tail of the regular season for a variety of reasons. Saw it with Boeser, saw it with Hughes too. I think he'll get a look right away IMO. Even if he doesnt blow the doors off the remainder of his KHL contract he'll be ready enough to get a look imo. Roster players on ELCs will be key for this team, even moreso now with the flat cap situation.
 

VanJack

Registered User
Jul 11, 2014
21,303
14,523
Maybe other posters have a better handle on this than I do. But if the Canucks sign Podkolzin as soon as his KHL contract expires on April 30th, can he play for the Canucks down the stretch and into to the playoffs?

If next season was a 'normal 82-game season', I believe the answer would be 'no'. But by late April, the NHL will basically be in the middle of its reduced schedule of games. So would KHL signings like Podkolzin and potentially Tryamkin, be able to step right into the lineup?
 

Nucker101

Foundational Poster
Apr 2, 2013
21,104
16,553
KHL is marginally better than the AHL and a hell of a lot closer to the AHL than the NHL.

Hadn't watched a KHL game in a while and ... it's not a very good product, and the pace and feel is extremely AHL-like.
This.

All you have to do is take a look at some former NHL/AHL players and compare their production/roles and realize that the KHL talent level is much more AHL-like than NHL caliber. And I've read from multiple scouts/gm's that the pace is slower as well, like you mentioned.

If Pod ends up having a down season on terms of production., I suspect a lot of Canuck fans will try to rationalize it like we have in the past with guys like Jensen, Virtanen, Juolevi, who all failed to take a clear step forward during their draft +1 and/or +2 seasons when in reality it's best to just lower expectations a bit on the p-layer's ceiling.
 
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Raistlin

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Aug 25, 2006
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He's continuing to struggle to produce in the KHL and is likely headed for Utica in 21-22. Hopefully can stick as a bottom-6 guy in Vancouver in 22-23.

????

He will never touch Utica, the guy is from Russia, why would he ride the bus?

Pod is good enough to play in the league right now, those that only stat watch simply do not see the puck retrieval skills this guy has, they will staple him on the bottom six just for possession alone. Series like the Vegas one will hinge on more players like Pod. Having Schmidt to go with Hughes Petey Motte and Pod means the shots wont ever be 40+/17 ever again.

How Bragin is treating him in SKA is shameful.
 
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Disappointed EP40

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Jan 13, 2015
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????

He will never touch Utica, the guy is from Russia, why would he ride the bus?

Pod is good enough to play in the league right now, those that only stat watch simply do not see the puck retrieval skills this guy has, they will staple him on the bottom six just for possession alone. Series like the Vegas one will hinge on more players like Pod. Having Schmidt to go with Hughes Petey Motte and Pod means the shots wont ever be 40+/17 ever again.

How Bragin is treating him in SKA is shameful.

According to what?
 

lawrence

Registered User
May 19, 2012
16,015
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Saw it with Boeser, saw it with Hughes too.

it's actually a pattern of college players getting a chance to shave one year off of their elc by signing late into the season.

one thing of the CBA I don't agree with.

This.

All you have to do is take a look at some former NHL/AHL players and compare their production/roles and realize that the KHL talent level is much more AHL-like than NHL caliber. And I've read from multiple scouts/gm's that the pace is slower as well, like you mentioned.

I don't think anyone has denied this. It's just that in the AHL, he will have more ice time, since it doesn't look like they are investing much into his ice time over in the KHL.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,505
Vancouver, BC
????

He will never touch Utica, the guy is from Russia, why would he ride the bus?

Pod is good enough to play in the league right now, those that only stat watch simply do not see the puck retrieval skills this guy has, they will staple him on the bottom six just for possession alone. Series like the Vegas one will hinge on more players like Pod. Having Schmidt to go with Hughes Petey Motte and Pod means the shots wont ever be 40+/17 ever again.

How Bragin is treating him in SKA is shameful.

He's getting 13 minutes/game in the KHL on a good team and is 0-2-2 in his last 15 games. He is absolutely not good enough to play in the NHL right now. And watching him play he looks slooooow relative to an AHL-level pace right now.

Also I posted the list of recent #1 Russian picks here earlier. Outside of a couple guys who went straight from the CHL to NHL, all of them have done time in the AHL .
 
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MS

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Mar 18, 2002
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Vancouver, BC
This.

All you have to do is take a look at some former NHL/AHL players and compare their production/roles and realize that the KHL talent level is much more AHL-like than NHL caliber. And I've read from multiple scouts/gm's that the pace is slower as well, like you mentioned.

If Pod ends up having a down season on terms of production., I suspect a lot of Canuck fans will try to rationalize it like we have in the past with guys like Jensen, Virtanen, Juolevi, who all failed to take a clear step forward during their draft +1 and/or +2 seasons when in reality it's best to just lower expectations a bit on the p-layer's ceiling.

Yup. Starting already. The two predominant opinions are 1) He's ready to play in the NHL now! and 2) Boy, is his team screwing him over! when in fact he's been plenty of minutes and opportunity to start the season and has flat-out performed poorly.

I believe he's capable of better than this but he's had a really rough start to this year and there's legitimate reason for concern right now.
 

DonnyNucker

Registered User
Mar 28, 2017
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Yup. Starting already. The two predominant opinions are 1) He's ready to play in the NHL now! and 2) Boy, is his team screwing him over! when in fact he's been plenty of minutes and opportunity to start the season and has flat-out performed poorly.

I believe he's capable of better than this but he's had a really rough start to this year and there's legitimate reason for concern right now.
Brackets parting gift. He must have known he was on the way out when he selected him
 

THE Green Man

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Dec 27, 2013
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Maybe other posters have a better handle on this than I do. But if the Canucks sign Podkolzin as soon as his KHL contract expires on April 30th, can he play for the Canucks down the stretch and into to the playoffs?

If next season was a 'normal 82-game season', I believe the answer would be 'no'. But by late April, the NHL will basically be in the middle of its reduced schedule of games. So would KHL signings like Podkolzin and potentially Tryamkin, be able to step right into the lineup?
From how I understand it, since he is not considered an RFA but an "unsigned draft pick" he could come into the lineup at any time this year as if he were a NCAA player coming in at the end of the season like Hughes did. For Tryamkin though he would have to be signed to a contract before a certain date. On a regular year, that date is December 1st (think back to Nylander). If we use roughly the same time frame and use March 1st as a deadline date, the only way that it could happen would be if his team misses the playoffs and even then it's like 3 days until that deadline.
 

Ernie

Registered User
Aug 3, 2004
12,834
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There is sure a lot of Podkolzin / KHL disinformation here. The people who have actually analyzed him give a much more positive take.

First of all, the KHL is NOT equivalent to the AHL. Points conversion wise each KHL point is equivalent to .8 NHL points, while an AHL point is equivalent to about .5 NHL points. You can play with an NHLe calculate here.

Now, it's obviously not a straight conversion; some players that have underperformed in the NHL have become stars in the KHL, and some players who don't shine in the KHL have become useful depth NHLers. It's a different game with a bigger rink. And there's a ton of disparity - the top teams in the East (like Podkolzin's team SKA) could likely compete in the NHL, but the bottom teams in the West are closer to ECHL quality.

However, by all accounts of people who have watched Podkolzin play, his game should translate well to the NHL. Some quotes from recent Athletic articles:

Dayal: A top-five talent, Vasili Podkolzin has the tools to be a home run pick for the Canucks

Podkolzin has the tools to mature into an extremely rare and coveted commodity — a bona fide two-way power forward with no holes in his game. The young Russian creates a ton of zone entries and is dynamic in how he combines soft hands, strong skating, heads-up vision and a sheer will to drive to the net.

The tenacity and commitment to playing a complete 200-foot game will ensure he can be trusted and thrive in any role handed to him.

Once established in the offensive zone, he’s very strong along the boards and is more than capable as both a distributor and finisher.

All told, Podkolzin shows the all-around tools of a top-five talent. Should the production and continued development follow, the Canucks might have hit another home run.
Tons of video in the above article, worth checking out if you have a subscription (only $1/month right now)

Dayal and Drance: NHL prospect rankings: Wheeler's top 50, post-2020 draft edition

We picked Pavel Buchnevich as his comp partly because they’re both 6-foot-1 and 192 pounds, which is as close as a physical match gets. Buchnevich was a much lower draft pick than Podkolzkin, although that was in an era when the “Russian Factor” and sign-ability concerns caused mass inefficiency in how Russian-born players were evaluated in the draft process.

The days of Vladimir Tarasenko falling to 16th overall, or Nikita Kucherov falling all the way to the end of the second round, are long gone.

It’s not a perfect comp – Podkolzin’s calling card is his two-way play, while Buchnevich’s defensive play can still be inconsistent – but the point is that they’re both physically assertive Russian-born wingers who produced at a pedestrian rate in the KHL in their draft-plus-one seasons.

Counting stats don’t tell you a lot about young players in the KHL. It’s a really tough league to earn ice time in.
In fact, Podkolzin’s scoring rate in the KHL in his draft-plus-one season – eight points in 30 games – may not seem like much, but it actually compares almost identically with Kucherov’s, is in the same realm as Tarasenko’s and compares favourable with Buchnevich’s.​

Pronman: NHL prospect rankings: Wheeler's top 50, post-2020 draft edition

I think it’s fair to say at this point that Podkolzin has been misused in the KHL. He should be playing more and should be playing with better players. But I also think it’s fair to say that Podkolzin can get carried away out there, that there are times when he needs to relax and settle down his game with and without the puck and that running around and trying to use his skill and tenacity to make things happen isn’t always his best approach. Podkolzin is a player who sees an available play, knows he has the skill to make it and tries it. There are times, though, when it feels like he’s running on instinct and when the first play or opening that he sees may not be the best play. I wonder, despite his physical maturity and obvious talent, whether he’s going to be able to bend to his eventual NHL linemates or whether they will have to bend to him.​

Now as for Podkolzin's stats.. they are perfectly fine for someone playing 4th line minutes on an NHL quality team. But the sample size is small and the basic stats don't tell the entire story. Chris Faber of Canucks Army has been watching each of Podkolzin's games and, aside from the most recent game, has been dominating possession, often upwards of 80%. Not bad for a 4th liner! (you can follow along on Faber's Twitter).
 

Raistlin

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Aug 25, 2006
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According to what?

countless people have said it, Scouch, Drance.... he is ready to play in the league. Find me scouts that said he is definitely not ready at all. ....or should I value dude in a chatboard's opinion on the matter?

this is most recent one from a european scout, although his opinion is more rosy than my own.


Benning himself said last year that he's ready to step in. ultimately, whether you like him or not, he and Green are the final arbiters on whether he dresses in the main roster or not.
 
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Pennask

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Jul 28, 2020
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Fair comment, but how many of those guys had 2 years of KHL experience first. Too lazy to look it up myself ... and I still stand by my comment, handle this kid with kid gloves, he could easily go back to the KHL if he is not given a legitimate chance to make the team. And we have no idea what the AHL will look like this year either.

His NHL contract would need to be over before he could bolt for the KHL. He would need a NHL contract to try out for the team...
 

Pennask

Registered User
Jul 28, 2020
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On a lake
People think Podz is NHL ready yet he's getting scratched in the KHL.

Let me understand the logic.... Podz will need a couple years seasoning in the NHL before he makes a big step in the KHL?
 

CpatainCanuck

Registered User
Sep 18, 2008
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People think Podz is NHL ready yet he's getting scratched in the KHL.

Let me understand the logic.... Podz will need a couple years seasoning in the NHL before he makes a big step in the KHL?

If you watch him play you can see that his hard-nosed, defensively responsible play will translate well to the nhl. I’m not so sure about his offensive production...those people predicting a sudden increase in points when he gets to the Canucks may be involved with some wishful thinking.
 
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MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
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Vancouver, BC
countless people have said it, Scouch, Drance.... he is ready to play in the league. Find me scouts that said he is definitely not ready at all. ....or should I value dude in a chatboard's opinion on the matter?

this is most recent one from a european scout, although his opinion is more rosy than my own.


Benning himself said last year that he's ready to step in. ultimately, whether you like him or not, he and Green are the final arbiters on whether he dresses in the main roster or not.


If he can't produce or stay in the lineup in a vastly inferior league, he isn't ready to step into the NHL. Period. I don't care what anyone else has said, because it simply doesn't matter.
 

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