Proposal: Vancouver cap relief from Buffalo

[Diaspora]

You can't retain for only 1 year of the contract. Any amount you retain applies to all remaining years.

Thanks. Didn't know that.

 

[Diaspora]

WTF?

This is beyond greedy. You need to add assets to Eriksson to move him. On what planet is Buffalo sending you back major assets like a 26 year old top 4 d-man in Montour.

He's not playing in Buffalo again. If you tender QO and he accepts, what will you get for him? Where could Sabres get a better RW for him one-for-one?

 

[Diaspora]

Buffalo is not a cap dump site.

Montour is not a cap dump.

Virtanen and Eriksson and 21 1st for Miller and 21 4th.

I don't think Montour is a Sabre when play restarts. Cap is a wash for Virtanen. Montour returns a second, maybe.

You like the Miller version of the proposal better. Ok. Upgrade Vancouver late round 2nd to late 1st (ok). Does Vancouver take it?

 

[Diaspora]

And you're missing the fact that Buffalo will have no trouble getting to the cap floor. They have 10 players signed for just over $47 million. A full roster of 13 more players and $13.1 million needed to get to the cap floor.

That cap floor argument is bunk.

Agree cap floor is bunk. But cap doesn't equal cash out the door. Man who writes the checks says write smaller ones. What's a GM to do?

 

[Diaspora]

See below, but IF Vancouver is retaining half on Eriksson and his actual salary commitment is only $1m this year and $2m next year, and IF Buffalo is going to be short of the cap this year, then they're only taking on a small financial commitment to make this deal with no worries about cap hit.

Montour is an offensive D-man who didn't produce in Buffalo, so there's good reason why people are speculating whether he'd get a QO. I think he will, there's a bit of upside there, but he's probably worth a bit less than Virtanen.

The Sabres need a middle six power forward at RW, Virtanen suits them perfectly. A much better lineup fit than Montour. Throw in a 2nd and I think this is a good deal for Buffalo.

-----------

IF OP means only a 33% retention on Eriksson then it's still an okay deal for Buffalo, but they can get better terms. There will be more clubs looking to unload cap hits then there are teams willing to take the other side of the deal. Vancouver should pay more.



His total salary in 2021-22 is $4m, with a $6m cap hit. Correct me if I'm wrong but salary retention is a percentage that applies to both salary and caphit, so if you are retaining 50% of the salary, it's $2m, and you're also retaining a $3m cap hit (50%). Is that what you meant?

Still learning. Not 100% sure how the rules work.

My focus is trying to field a team with less cash out the door, like the boss says. Cap is only a number. $12m in cap over two years with only $3 million in salary wouldn't necessarily be a killer (if you can juggle it all). Retaining cap to reach the salary could be a necessity by the rules ($6m cap/ $3m salary).

Virtanen could be a good piece for Buffalo. Could work with Staal and Skinner. Might be nice with Eichel and Olofsson. Might be good with Cozens and Kahun. Lots of options.

 

[Diaspora]

Trimming fat is always good. It can be done while still investing fully into the actual team.

I'm still not convinced there is an internal cap. We'll just have to wait and see.

Only going by what I'm seeing in the news. Maybe KA is trying to play an expectations game. Don't know.

Virtanen is a nice piece. 20 goals from the RW is an improvement over Montour's contribution (with three additional RHD already on the roster). Right now I think Virtanen is more valuable to Sabres than Montour. Can't roll five RHD. You gotta give something of value to get something back.

 

[Langdon Alger]

So, Buffalo has Eriksson and Okposo on their roster? Yeah, sounds like a great idea.

 

[Diaspora]

That’s a homer view of things. There is nothing elite about Virtanen

Not elite. But pretty good.

 

[Diaspora]

Buffalo doesn’t have as much cap space as it appears. They have like 10 players under contract for next season right now, with a bunch of RFA’s to get signed including Reinhart and Olofsson.

They also desperately need to improve the team, which means signing some UFAs or trading for someone.

And they may have an internal cap as low as $11+ million below the actual salary cap ceiling.

I feel like every dollar is precious right now.

Btw Kevyn Adams (Sabres GM) said the mountour not being qualified thing was a bogus rumor. He’s not the type of player you just don’t qualify (IMO). I could see him being traded though.

Probably a bogus rumor. But either way, KA has to deny to protect the value of the asset. The rumor may have already thrown cold water on it.

Staal is one year and likely gone. Sabres get one year of ELC out of Dahlin, three out of Cozens, plus 2020 #8OA. Another overpaid RHD would have to go in 21.

Admittedly, 21 cap would be tight. But too tight?

 

[tsujimoto74]

Montour/Virtanen salary a wash. Staal will likely come off books for 21. Give Dahlin a two-year bridge and pay through the nose in ’23. Same with Jokiharju. Replace Ristolainen with a prospect or cheaper free agent or trade proceeds. Eriksson off books in 22, KO in 23 in time for better times and the cap to start growing again in 24.

Sabres get a 20-goal 2RW, can be 3RW if Thompson or one of the center prospects sticks there.

If Miller and a 5th get Virtanen, then do it. I don't think Canucks take it. The underpayment on the cap dump evens it out.

Nothing to say that Sabres cap can't be $81m but actual salary around $75. The owner says cut money. Salary cap isn't money. GM works with what the boss is willing to pay.

All that so we can eat Vancouver's cap dump. Well, when you put it that way, how can we say no? In fact, why don't you just take Dahlin in the deal, too, so we don't have to worry about fitting him and Eriksson in?

 

[Diaspora]

All that so we can eat Vancouver's cap dump. Well, when you put it that way, how can we say no? In fact, why don't you just take Dahlin in the deal, too, so we don't have to worry about fitting him and Eriksson in?

I like Virtanen for Buffalo. Looking to get a real conversation started. Could give a rat's ratty behind about a few million of fallow cap space. Vancouver needs cap space. Montour/Miller don't seem to be part of Buffalo's core.

Is there a more acceptable cap dump than Eriksson?

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

I don't think Montour is a Sabre when play restarts. Cap is a wash for Virtanen. Montour returns a second, maybe.

You like the Miller version of the proposal better. Ok. Upgrade Vancouver late round 2nd to late 1st (ok). Does Vancouver take it?

Uh Montour easily returns a 2nd. Colin Miller who was a cap dump brought back a 2nd+. Montour is 25 year old 30-35 point top 4 RHD. He still has decent value. They paid a 1st+very good prospect for him we aren't trading him for scraps

 

[Tob]

Not sure if LE+JV+2nd with $1M retention gets the job done let alone assets coming back the other way.

 

[Beerz]

Only going by what I'm seeing in the news. Maybe KA is trying to play an expectations game. Don't know.

Virtanen is a nice piece. 20 goals from the RW is an improvement over Montour's contribution (with three additional RHD already on the roster). Right now I think Virtanen is more valuable to Sabres than Montour. Can't roll five RHD. You gotta give something of value to get something back.

Virtanen has never scored 20 Goals from the right wing or left wing so let me know when he does and we can continue the conversation.

 

[Scintillating10]

To Buffalo:

Loui Eriksson (Van pays 20-21 bonus, $2m salary retained in 21-22)
Jake Virtanen
2021 2nd

To Vancouver:
Brandon Montour and 2021 4th, OR
Colin Miller and 2021 5th

Buffalo gets thirteenth forward and RW help.

Vancouver gets big cap relief and an NHL defenseman. Play him, trade him, sit him or send flowers.

Offer good only until QOs are due.

That would be robbery. Take a first alone to move Eriksson contract.

 

[TunaBoss44]

I like Virtanen for Buffalo. Looking to get a real conversation started. Could give a rat's ratty behind about a few million of fallow cap space. Vancouver needs cap space. Montour/Miller don't seem to be part of Buffalo's core.

Is there a more acceptable cap dump than Eriksson?

Sutter or Beagle would be much more acceptable. Someone that can play bottom 6 C would be useful

 

[JThorne]

I like Virtanen for Buffalo. Looking to get a real conversation started. Could give a rat's ratty behind about a few million of fallow cap space. Vancouver needs cap space. Montour/Miller don't seem to be part of Buffalo's core.

Is there a more acceptable cap dump than Eriksson?

Yes. NO cap dump. These extra dmen aren't dumps where we need to take back negative value. You're trying to force a square peg into a round hole. And the harder you try, the more it makes you look like you're out of touch or just a blatant homer.

 

[blankall]

Elite skillset. His mix of size and speed is in the top 5% of the league. Decent shot too. Not elite now, but a potential game breaker if he can develop a little.

Lol. Had no idea that Sam Bennett had an elite season in 2015/16. All this time I thought he was just a passable third liner.

 

[Johnsie19]

That’s a homer view of things. There is nothing elite about Virtanen

Watch him play one time, there will be no way to argue is skating isn't elite.

 

[Johnsie19]

Lol. Had no idea that Sam Bennett had an elite season in 2015/16. All this time I thought he was just a passable third liner.

take a lap

 

[Qwijibo]

Watch him play one time, there will be no way to argue is skating isn't elite.

He’s fast. Doesn’t mean a thing if he doesn’t have the iq to do something with it. He’s a bottom 6 player and he’s likely to remain so

 

[Johnsie19]

He’s fast. Doesn’t mean a thing if he doesn’t have the iq to do something with it. He’s a bottom 6 player and he’s likely to remain so

I said he had elite intangibles. Skating, size, shot. Never said he was a IQ player. Somehow, intent on an argument it seems, you missed that part. The reason I said it is to make his value known. He has a higher ceiling than most would think. But yes he has deficiencies also that he may never overcome. Even at that he's a potential 20 goals somewhat physical 3rd liner.

 

[Qwijibo]

I said he had elite intangibles. Skating, size, shot. Never said he was a IQ player. Somehow, intent on an argument it seems, you missed that part. The reason I said it is to make his value known. He has a higher ceiling than most would think. But yes he has deficiencies also that he may never overcome. Even at that he's a potential 20 goals somewhat physical 3rd liner.

I just don’t see the logic in throwing the term “elite” around when you’re discussing a bottom 6 guy with massive holes in his game.

 

[Rpenny]

To Buffalo:

Loui Eriksson (Van pays 20-21 bonus, $2m salary retained in 21-22)
Jake Virtanen
2021 2nd

To Vancouver:
Brandon Montour and 2021 4th, OR
Colin Miller and 2021 5th

Buffalo gets thirteenth forward and RW help.

Vancouver gets big cap relief and an NHL defenseman. Play him, trade him, sit him or send flowers.

Offer good only until QOs are due.

Retention does not work that way

 

[majormajor]

Sutter or Beagle would be much more acceptable. Someone that can play bottom 6 C would be useful

[neutral fan here]

Hmm..

Sutter+Virtanen+2nd

for

Montour?

I can see how that's slightly better for the Sabres, because you get a bottom six C out of it. But take note that Sutter without retention ($4.375m) is a lot more total cash than half retained Eriksson ($2.5m total), even though Eriksson is two years instead of one.

I still think there should be a deal here involving Eriksson. His salary is less than 50% of his cap hit so there should theoretically be a price the Canucks can pay to send him to Buffalo that would benefit both teams. Are you just disagreeing on what the price is?