Confirmed Signing with Link: [VAN] Antoine Roussel signs with the Canucks (4 years, $3M AAV)

[Vorkosh]

Which numbers are you referring to? Here are some numbers that you can reference:

It’s Official; Canucks Sign Jay Beagle to a Four-Year Contract

Beagle will be 37 years old when this horrendous contract is up. Was Sundin a fourth line player? Again, and I'll bold it for you as you seem to have a very hard time understanding this, I am speaking of a not so hypothetical scenario where one team vastly overpays easily replaceable depth players and how that would potentially affect it's young and upcoming RFA's. I am not talking about all teams or all RFA's. Print out the thread if it helps you follow it better.

You've literally contributed nothing to this thread except, "well it doesn't really matter in the long run". That's the guiding principle and strategy you'd like the team run on? That's how low the bar is at this point? You can keep your ribbon champ, it will fit nicely beside the Special Olympics trophy in your bedroom.

Can you learn some comprehension skills?

We've already established it doesn't affect it's young and upcoming RFAs because they still get paid. So that's that.

Okay so they overpaid.. how does that affect you exactly? They have cap. They're nowhere close to it even with these signings. SO again, how does that affect you?

Are you paying their salaries out of your own pocket? No? Then again, WHY DOES IT MATTER? If it doesn't affect RFAs why does it matter they overpaid? It doesn't. Did you pass first grade English? Seriously.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Amazing how anyone can keep defending Benning.

As you draw up your lineups for two or three years from now and plot which contracts will be gone, here's a bit of a missing piece: who does Benning sign next year if he's still around? What about the year after that? Every damn July 1 he goes out and signs vets (usually overpaying). Every year his booster club tells us about how great the prospects are going to be at some vague point in the future (not now, though. Never now. Now's always just the WORST time) and every year Benning refuses to be willing to roll with those great prospects. He literally does this every time.

Next season up front the Canucks have:

Sutter
Roussel
Beagle
Eriksson
Gagner
Schaller

...all around for two more years or more. Then add Granlund and Baertschi who are both 25 right now. That leaves Boeser, Horvat, and room for two more players out of Virtanen, Leipsic, Gaunce, Goldobin, Gaudette, and that's without even getting into the guys who haven't seen NHL ice yet like Pettersson, Lind, Gadjovic, Palmu and the rest of the Godlike prospect pool that's forever waiting in the wings.

And the team has 100 points to make up for the loss of the Sedins just to hit last season's scoring levels.

Oh, and the team does run with a cap penalty next year because it couldn't fit all of Boeser's bonuses under the cap last season.

Yeah. Sub-optimal situation.

 

[bossram]

I've already explained why the cap hit isn't an issue. If you don't want to read, that's your issue, not mine. I've actually explained it twice.

It actually doesn't, because in your hypothetical scenario you've totally made up/assumed all the numbers.

Your scenario is "everyone takes a bridge deal, "don't factor in these other bad contracts, and who needs to plan to have extra cap space in the future".

That's a bad plan.

The alternative is: just don't sign bad contracts in the first place.

Then you don't have to worry, and you have lots of flexibility when opportunities arise.

 

[Elimanator]

Yeah and I dont know if you know anything about our team.

**** off back to the Tavares thread.

Wow you're triggered. I'm just saying its probably not the best idea to sign these guys for 4 years when your team is gonna be a young powerhouse soon. Same picture with Gudbranson, Sutter, etc.

I think your team will be real good in a few years. I just don't know if it's the best idea to sign beagle and Roussell for 4 years.

 

[kp61c]

the deal makes no sense. canucks have been a tire fire for a long time and i love it. lol

 

[Mathew Barzal]

Its unbelievable that Benning goes out every FA and gets grit grit grit grit and some more grit. Idk if he knows his team is rebuilding.

Role players to help insulate and mentor young talent while they develop. It's not like we're going to be competing for another five years. I'd rather go down this road than pull an Edmonton.

 

[Vorkosh]

Amazing how anyone can keep defending Benning.

As you draw up your lineups for two or three years from now and plot which contracts will be gone, here's a bit of a missing piece: who does Benning sign next year if he's still around? What about the year after that? Every damn July 1 he goes out and signs vets (usually overpaying). Every year his booster club tells us about how great the prospects are going to be at some vague point in the future (not now, though. Never now. Now's always just the WORST time) and every year Benning refuses to be willing to roll with those great prospects. He literally does this every time.

Next season up front the Canucks have:

Sutter
Roussel
Beagle
Eriksson
Gagner
Schaller

...all around for two more years or more. Then add Granlund and Baertschi who are both 25 right now. That leaves Boeser, Horvat, and room for two more players out of Leipsic, Gaunce, Goldobin, Gaudette, and that's without even getting into the guys who haven't seen NHL ice yet like Pettersson, Lind, Gadjovic, Palmu and the rest of the Godlike prospect pool that's forever waiting in the wings.

And the team has 100 points to make up for the loss of the Sedins just to hit last season's scoring levels.

Oh, and the team does run with a cap penalty next year because it couldn't fit all of Boeser's bonuses under the cap last season.

Yeah. Sub-optimal situation.

Are you under the delusion that injuries don't happen or did you forget the the Canucks lost the most man-games out of any NHL team for like the last 2 seasons?
Are you under the delusion that we are a good team right now and can compete?

You do realize Benning inherited a mess right? Yes he has made mistakes, but he's also stocked the cupboard pretty full of pretty good prospects.
This isn't a Benning problem as much as it is an Insert_Random_GM_After_Gillis_Here problem

He's had misses for sure, name one GM who hasn't. You're expecting him to work miracles with what he's given. I'm assuming you were on the Fire Burke Fire Nonis Fire Gillis train too right? So.. why even hire a GM they're all terrible apparently

When the Canucks needed to employ Michael Chaput to be their 3rd line centre for extended periods of time over the last 2 years.. it says that the depth is not good. So yes, he's going to sign players that can plug holes. Again. They are still under the cap. No marquee free agent is coming to Vancouver. If he's signing plugs, it means the kids aren't ready.

 

[Diamonddog01]

Can you learn some comprehension skills?

We've already established it doesn't affect it's young and upcoming RFAs because they still get paid. So that's that.

Okay so they overpaid.. how does that affect you exactly? They have cap. They're nowhere close to it even with these signings. SO again, how does that affect you?

Are you paying their salaries out of your own pocket? No? Then again, WHY DOES IT MATTER? If it doesn't affect RFAs why does it matter they overpaid? It doesn't. Did you pass first grade English? Seriously.

No, we haven't established that. It could potentially cause their prices to go up. Not sure why you having so much difficulty understanding that. I've tried to explain it multiple times despite your nonsensical "counter-examples".

I don't need to be personally financially affected to recognize brutal contracts when I see them. What kind of idiotic point is that? It does matter as I don't like to watch my team make stupid decisions, or sign horrendous contracts that they may have to waste buy-out spots on in the future. It matters as it could affect RFA's, despite your assertions to contrary, and it matters as it blocks younger players from playing time and roster spots, as watching said youngsters was one of the few highlights fans had last year.

While your little one man crusade against common sense is admirable in a Don Quixote fashion, you're simply out of your depth here.

 

[Jannik Hansen]

Okay so in a place called the real world, there's a thing called multiple teams want the same player. Then there's also a thing called a bidding war. So what happens is.. when you want something.. and someone else wants something.. That something has options and therefore has negotiation power.

Again, in 2-3 years if the kids are ready, you send Beagle to the minors. It's just money. They're not taking roster spots away from kids. They're making sure the Canucks can actually field a team. Like I don't understand what your issue is. There are open roster spots. The Canucks (who actually see these guys play every day in development camp) made a call and determined they were not ready. Therefore, they went out and found people who ACTUALLY WANT TO PLAY IN VANCOUVER.

Beagle/Rousell/Whoever/Taveres they are all looking for what's best for THEM not the team. You see how that works? Benning did not START at 4 years, that's what he was bid up to.

When the Canucks best option due to injuries has been Michael Chaput for the last 2 years. I'm pretty sure a Beagle or a Roussel is not going to make them worse or take spots away from Kole/Jonah/Whoever when their time has come. It's just a standard deal, not one with no movement. So again, if Kole Lind decides he wants to show up and out work Beagle then Beagle goes to the minors. and at that point, WHY DO YOU CARE? it's not YOUR money you're paying Beagle with, It's Aqualini's. Let him worry about it

Also, in a place called the real world, you don’t have tunnel vision on acquiring a specific thing at any cost. If there’s a bidding war on a 4th line player, you have to be able to determine when their demands are too excessive and let another team make that mistake. I don’t know why people think cap hits and term don’t matter. Every dollar you overpay is one less dollar you have to spend on quality players. Most owners are pretty loathsome to bury millions in the minors. I can’t remenber the last time we sent an overpaid player to the minors.

 

[Vorkosh]

Also, in a place called the real world, you don’t have tunnel vision on acquiring a specific thing at any cost. If there’s a bidding war on a 4th line player, you have to be able to determine when their demands are too excessive and let another team make that mistake. I don’t know why people think cap hits and term don’t matter. Every dollar you overpay is one less dollar you have to spend on quality players. Most owners are pretty loathsome to bury millions in the minors. I can’t remenber the last time we sent an overpaid player to the minors.

Matthieu Schneider comes to mind. Not really overpaid I guess. Most obvious example would be Wade Redden, but that didn't hamper the Rangers either. Okay, so let's say he doesn't sign Rousell and Beagle. Has the extra 7 million from that now. Who do you sign? you have over 25 million in cap space. Who would you get that would also want to come to Vancouver to fill up roster spots?

Who are the quality players that want to come to Vancouver? The RFAs from Vancouver I have already fit under the cap at generous overpayments, so which quality UFA's can you entice to come to a losing team, with a high income tax and a high cost of living city?

 

[iFan]

Wow you're triggered. I'm just saying its probably not the best idea to sign these guys for 4 years when your team is gonna be a young powerhouse soon. Same picture with Gudbranson, Sutter, etc.

I think your team will be real good in a few years. I just don't know if it's the best idea to sign beagle and Roussell for 4 years.

This deal isn’t a real issue, he’s a player we need after Dorsett unexpected career ending injury. Same with Beagle, would be much better and fair if it was 2 years... but these aren’t the contracts I have issues with... Ericksson and Gagner are the real issue contracts for me as their players we simply don’t need here.

 

[Wallet Inspector]

4 years too long for both him amd Beagle. If Vancouver's young guys develop well the next few years they will have troubling adding additional pieces thanks to these anchor contracts.

 

[Diamonddog01]

Why are you so dense.

an RFA's contract price CAN NOT GO UP. Seriously man. Do you know how Arbitration works? You do understand that there are also qualifying offers right? The Canucks did not qualify Pouliot at 875k chosing to resign him to a 1 year 1.1 million dollar deal. Why? he could have signed anywhere for more money right? according to you Pouliot should have been super pissed the Canucks didn't offer him more money. Seriously, just stop. Before you were only embarrassing yourself, now you're embarrassing me by having to respond to this idiocy

RFA's contract prices cannot go up? What the hell are you even talking about? Do you know how arbitration and qualifying offers work? You don't seem to have any idea what you're talking about.

Learn to read. I said it could affect RFA's, it may potentially affect our young star RFA's. Once again, and for the final time, I am talking about young, star RFA's on our team who can compare themselves to overpaid plugs. Not waiver wire RFA's such as Pouliot or star UFA's such as Sundin.

I can't make this any simpler for you or dumb it down further (believe me I've tried). Seriously...wake the f*** up and read what people write before you post this trash. Your posts remind me of Benning's free agent signings.

 

[Vorkosh]

4 years too long for both him amd Beagle. If Vancouver's young guys develop well the next few years they will have troubling adding additional pieces thanks to these anchor contracts.

6 million on 2 players against a 80+ million cap is an anchor? The young kids of Vancouver won't cost the Canucks anything in the next few years. It's the next 5-6 years they need to worry about that and by that time all the horrible contracts fall off the books

 

[Duffman955]

Interesting signings by the Nucks

 

[Vorkosh]

RFA's contract prices cannot go up? What the hell are you even talking about? Do you know how arbitration and qualifying offers work? You don't seem to have any idea what you're talking about.

Learn to read. I said it could affect RFA's, it may potentially affect our young star RFA's. Once again, and for the final time, I am talking about young, star RFA's on our team who can compare themselves to overpaid plugs. Not waiver wire RFA's such as Pouliot or star UFA's such as Sundin.

I can't make this any simpler for you or dumb it down further (believe me I've tried). Seriously...wake the **** up and read what people write before you post this trash. Your posts remind me of Benning's free agent signings.

Who are the young star RFAs this year. Please tell me. Since you're talking about them. Who is an young star RFA RIGHT NOW today that's looking at Beagle and Roussel and saying damn.. i want that money.

Remember you said RFA, right? so no one currently on ELC, just RFA. So.. Virtanen Baertschi and Stetcher. But you also said Star RFA right? ours only. so... no one?

Thanks for coming out.

 

[Jannik Hansen]

Matthieu Schneider comes to mind. Not really overpaid I guess. Most obvious example would be Wade Redden, but that didn't hamper the Rangers either. Okay, so let's say he doesn't sign Rousell and Beagle. Has the extra 7 million from that now. Who do you sign? you have over 25 million in cap space. Who would you get that would also want to come to Vancouver to fill up roster spots?

Between those and the Gudbranson contract, I would try to sign a legit stud top 4 D or top 6 forward. That’s 11 million dollars spent on fringe players that don’t provide positive value. I don’t care about the cap hit today, I care about it in 2 years when our younger guys are up for deals. Add in Erikkson’s deal too. We could add add in lineup replacements of equivalent quality to all those guys and add in a top notch free agent, or acquire picks for taking on bad deals instead of just signing them ourselves.

Why were we not in on the Mason deal? Armia is just as good (better imo, as well as younger and cheaper) as Roussel. Mason is better than Nilsson (we could have afforded to buy out either). Montreal also got draft picks. This would have cost us 6 million in cap space, and we would have improved our bottom six and backup position while also gaining draft picks.

 

[Vorkosh]

This deal isn’t a real issue, he’s a player we need after Dorsett unexpected career ending injury. Same with Beagle, would be much better and fair if it was 2 years... but these aren’t the contracts I have issues with... Ericksson and Gagner are the real issue contracts for me as their players we simply don’t need here.

Agreed. to an extent Gagner as well, but they all fall off in 5 years when the kids of today need their bridge deals, so it works out just in time.

 

[me2]

Ugly

 

[Diamonddog01]

Who are the young star RFAs this year. Please tell me. Since you're talking about them. Who is an young star RFA RIGHT NOW today that's looking at Beagle and Roussel and saying damn.. i want that money.

Remember you said RFA, right? so no one currently on ELC, just RFA. So.. Virtanen Baertschi and Stetcher. But you also said Star RFA right? ours only. so... no one?

Thanks for coming out.

Dude...try to keep up. Did I say this year? Seriously, read the posts over a few times to understand them, write down the previous points and rebuttals, and then hit reply.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Are you under the delusion that injuries don't happen or did you forget the the Canucks lost the most man-games out of any NHL team for like the last 2 seasons?
Are you under the delusion that we are a good team right now and can compete?

You do realize Benning inherited a mess right? Yes he has made mistakes, but he's also stocked the cupboard pretty full of pretty good prospects.
This isn't a Benning problem as much as it is an Insert_Random_GM_After_Gillis_Here problem

He's had misses for sure, name one GM who hasn't. You're expecting him to work miracles with what he's given. I'm assuming you were on the Fire Burke Fire Nonis Fire Gillis train too right? So.. why even hire a GM they're all terrible apparently

When the Canucks needed to employ Michael Chaput to be their 3rd line centre for extended periods of time over the last 2 years.. it says that the depth is not good. So yes, he's going to sign players that can plug holes. Again. They are still under the cap. No marquee free agent is coming to Vancouver. If he's signing plugs, it means the kids aren't ready.

Oh ffs. Yeah, I know we'll have injuries. I also know that when the vets are healthy they'll play. You don't sign vets to sit in the press box, and Benning never does. His vets always play regardless of where the prospects are at.

Benning inherited a team that hit 100 points in his first season as gm, and he was handed a Selke winning centre as his first trading chip. Then the team went straight into the tank as the corpse of 2011 got pared down to nothing. Oh, he's restocked the prospect cupboard? Kinda funny how there's never room for any of them. He's had four bloody years of signing plugs and waiting for these prospects who are just never ready for prime time and now we've got a team full of overpaid vets and no space for anything else.

You know what? Never mind. I'm sick of having the same argument in ten different threads. The only bonus out of all this is the Benning fluffers like you will be vanishing by November once they get a good look at the team on the ice.

Oh yeah, Benning's a great gm. He's just not as good as 30 other NHL gms currently are.

 

[Vorkosh]

Between those and the Gudbranson contract, I would try to sign a legit stud top 4 D or top 6 forward. That’s 11 million dollars spent on fringe players that don’t provide positive value. I don’t care about the cap hit today, I care about it in 2 years when our younger guys are up for deals. Add in Erikkson’s deal too. We could add add in lineup replacements of equivalent quality to all those guys and add in a top notch free agent, or acquire picks for taking on bad deals instead of just signing them ourselves.

Why were we not in on the Mason deal? Armia is just as good (better imo, as well as younger and cheaper) as Roussel. Mason is better than Nilsson (we could have afforded to buy out either). Montreal also got draft picks. This would have cost us 6 million in cap space, and we would have improved our bottom six and backup position while also gaining draft picks.

It's great that you want to try to sign stud players. But there's two sides to that equation. A stud player needs to WANT to sign here. Canucks could have offered Taveres the exact same deal as Toronto. Tarveres didn't even field a call from the Canucks. You really wanted Mason and Armia? Mason got waived. he is not better than Nilsson.

It's also great that you think just because Team x got abc for this player, we should have done that deal too! I'm sure Edmonton didn't give their GM flak when we traded Schneider to Jesery considering Edmonton was offering more. Sometimes there are other factors involving in deals.

It's not black and white, there are factors that we, as a general public don't know that affects deals. Erikkson was a top 6 forward when he signed.. Gudbranson was a Top 4 D when he was traded to us... so.. it's not like he's not trying to acquire what you just said.. those players just haven't worked out for whatever reason

 

[Vorkosh]

Oh ffs. Yeah, I know we'll have injuries. I also know that when the vets are healthy they'll play. You don't sign vets to sit in the press box, and Benning never does. His vets always play regardless of where the prospects are at.

Benning inherited a team that hit 100 points in his first season as gm, and he was handed a Selke winning centre as his first trading chip. Then the team went straight into the tank as the corpse of 2011 got pared down to nothing. Oh, he's restocked the prospect cupboard? Kinda funny how there's never room for any of them. He's had four bloody years of signing plugs and waiting for these prospects who are just never ready for prime time and now we've got a team full of overpaid vets and no space for anything else.

You know what? Never mind. I'm sick of having the same argument in ten different threads. The only bonus out of all this is the Benning fluffers like you will be vanishing by November once they get a good look at the team on the ice.

Oh yeah, Benning's a great gm. He's just not as good as 30 other NHL gms currently are.

Vets sitting in the press box isn't a GM thing.. it's a coach thing.. are you just pinning all the issues on whoever's the current GM? Willie was a horrible coach. Green is better. a Selke winner as his trading chip that only wanted to go to one team and that one team knew it.. so... no value?

Again, it's great that your narrative suits the situation, but let's discuss the WHOLE situation yeah?

Kesler hamstrung the canucks by only wanting to go to one team

I never said Benning was a good GM, I'm saying that today's signing aren't the worst thing in the world. But apparently no matter what Benning does it's always his fault. I mean you just blamed him for vets sitting in the press box when he has no control over that... so..

 

[Shak19]

Terrible signing... top 3 worst contracts today.

1. Roussel
2. Komarov
3. Beagle

 

[Jannik Hansen]

It's great that you want to try to sign stud players. But there's two sides to that equation. A stud player needs to WANT to sign here. Canucks could have offered Taveres the exact same deal as Toronto. Tarveres didn't even field a call from the Canucks. You really wanted Mason and Armia? Mason got waived. he is not better than Nilsson.

It's also great that you think just because Team x got abc for this player, we should have done that deal too! I'm sure Edmonton didn't give their GM flak when we traded Schneider to Jesery considering Edmonton was offering more. Sometimes there are other factors involving in deals.

It's not black and white, there are factors that we, as a general public don't know that affects deals. Erikkson was a top 6 forward when he signed.. Gudbranson was a Top 4 D when he was traded to us... so.. it's not like he's not trying to acquire what you just said.. those players just haven't worked out for whatever reason

Steve Mason had 3 straight years of a 917 save percentage or higher as a starter. Nilsson has never put together a stretch like that ever. Mason has a better career save percentage, winning percentage, and goals against average. How on earth is Nilsson better?

Mason was waived/bought out because the Jets have to pay their starting goalie, a great top 4 D, and wanted to make a play for Stastny while being tight against the cap. Montreal has to the highest paid starter in the league and two backup options already so he wasn’t needed. He was overpaid which as you have said is no issue for us, which I agree with only on deals that aren’t any longer than 2 years.

Yes I wanted Armia. He’s one of the best forechecking/backchecking players in the league, has some offensive skills, and is younger and cheaper. He plays very similarity to Hansen and would have been one of our best bottom six players. He scored 30 points in 12~ minutes of ice time. Sutter takes 18 minutes to get to that mark. I also want draft picks too.

Gudbranson was never a good top 4 player. Pro scouting failure. They haven’t worked out because Benning failed to assess how their skills would work in conjunction with the makeup of our team.