Confirmed with Link: Unified Suspension Theory (Thornton Gets 15, Engo Gets 5)

[madinsomniac]

To be fair to Thornton, he probably can't read.

I mean he skated past a bunch of pens, including skating around dupuis to get to orpik, who was surrounded by three officials... like the writ says, it was not even close to a dangerous scrum. it was jawing about neals hit... and it was interesting that they said thornton was directed there by the bench.. I still mandate he was given hit orders and I think the NHL knows that too.. I don't dislike thornton and don't see how or why he would be so blatantly cold in an assault on an admitted friend without some sort of driving force behind it... I will always suspect a sweep the knee type order from CJ....

 

[DegenX]

I kinda chuckled reading through Bettman's decision at Thornton's defense. That he was just going for the biggest man in the scrum and didn't know it was Orpik. lol

Apparently, that's what he told Shanny then changed his story during the appeal:

While I am prepared to accept Mr. Thornton’s testimony that at the time the whistle blew he had no specific intention of targeting Mr. Orpik (and may not have even realized he was on the ice), I believe it is very apparent from the video that given the scrum and his recognition of Mr. Orpik’s presence on the ice, Mr. Thornton recognized an opportunity to exact the retribution that was denied him when Mr. Orpik earlier had declined his invitation to fight. He casually skated up behind Mr. Orpik and took him down under circumstances in which the latter “never had a chance†to defend himself. Interestingly (and disturbingly), Mr. Thornton testified at the hearing that he knew exactly what he was doing and that he was in complete control of his emotions. (Tr. 41) In these circumstances, I find that Section 18.2(d) also favors a lengthy suspension.

Finally, I note that Section 18.2(e) also directs me to take into account “uch other factors as may be appropriate in the circumstances.†Here, I find that Mr. Thornton’s unwillingness to acknowledge an obvious motivation (if not the only obvious motivation) for his conduct is an aggravating circumstance. At the hearing conducted by Mr. Shanahan, Mr. Thornton denied that he attempted to target Mr. Orpik, suggesting instead that he merely was looking for the “biggest†player in the scrum. (See Mr. Shanahan’s Testimony Tr. 84) That is not a credible explanation. Moreover, it is inconsistent with the testimony that Mr. Thornton provided at the December 20 hearing, where he acknowledged that he identified Mr. Orpik before he crossed the Pittsburgh blue line. (Tr. 38-39) Clearly by the time he had identified him, Mr. Thornton was targeting Mr. Orpik and the aggressiveness of his actions (during an otherwise uneventful scrum) has to be viewed in the light of events that had occurred earlier in the same period, namely the check that Mr. Orpik delivered to Mr. Eriksson and Mr. Orpik’s subsequent refusal to fight Mr. Thornton.

Link to PDF of Bettman's decision

Wonder what his story will be for the independent arbitrator?

 

[ColePens]

The fact that he said he didn't TARGET Orpik pisses me off. Be a ****ing man. Seriously. That's laughable at best. What a freaking *****.

 

[wej20]

Given that he got Orpik from behind it's pretty clear he knew he was getting. I think the independent arbitrator is going to shred his 'defence'

 

[Pens1566]

After seeing that, I'm shocked that Uncle Gary didn't bump the suspension up to 20+.

 

[Shockmaster]

So when Thornton decides to take it to an independent arbitrator, does the NHLPA have to assist him even if they think he'll lose the appeal, or can they tell him "you're on your own" if they want no part of it? If the NHLPA willingly tries to help Thornton they could be embarrassed badly. Bettman is basically giving an arbitrator a reason to increase the suspension, not decrease it.

 

[AjaxTelamon]

All the guy is doing is making a bigger and bigger fool of himself and his team, especially since he can't seem to keep his story straight from one hearing to the next. Just takes your lumps and move on. Even if you win you're not going to a zero game suspension, this isn't a criminal trial. This is a lot of whining to try to get your suspension reduced by 2 games.

 

[NMK11]

And if you want a real laugh, go read the Bruins board on the ruling. Some people there still think Brooks was faking the concussion or that it must have been from the refs forearm or another players skate and not the punches being thrown by Thornton. And I still can't understand how some people think this is ok because Brooks didn't fight over a legal hit.

 

[Finesse]

And if you want a real laugh, go read the Bruins board on the ruling. Some people there still think Brooks was faking the concussion or that it must have been from the refs forearm or another players skate and not the punches being thrown by Thornton. And I still can't understand how some people think this is ok because Brooks didn't fight over a legal hit.

Homer is as homer does.

 

[domaug*]

And if you want a real laugh, go read the Bruins board on the ruling. Some people there still think Brooks was faking the concussion or that it must have been from the refs forearm or another players skate and not the punches being thrown by Thornton. And I still can't understand how some people think this is ok because Brooks didn't fight over a legal hit.

because they are hell-bent on making sure that, no matter what, the Bruins players come out looking like the heroes and the Pens players come out looking like scum.

i wonder if any of these people have kids who aren't Bruins fans and if they got bullied by a Bruins fan, the parent would argue "well, the bully has a point..." somehow.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I'm glad they acknowledge it should be more, but not making it more just because of his good standing over his tenure isn't sending the right message. At some point someone has to be the poster boy for this kind of stuff. They already blew the Bertuzzi/Moore fiasco by reinstating Bertuzzi, that should have been a lifetime ban. What Thornton did should not have anything used in his defense, prior conduct, nothing. What he did isn't part of a NHL hockey play. Were not talking about him maulling him within the whistles here, 15 games for that would be sufficient then.

It's just pure lack of common sense how this league determines it's policies for foulplay.

In the real world he gets like 2/3 years prison and out in 1 for good behaver.

The fact he knew right away he messed up means he knew what he did was wrong before it too, let the simpathy pour out just because he said he was sorry really fast.

What can you expect from a league that has no right policing their own. It's going to actually take a death for these guys understand this is over their heads, and they didn't take the right measures to insure it never happens again.

Some friend, Orpik.

 

[Burgs]

So when Thornton decides to take it to an independent arbitrator, does the NHLPA have to assist him even if they think he'll lose the appeal, or can they tell him "you're on your own" if they want no part of it? If the NHLPA willingly tries to help Thornton they could be embarrassed badly. Bettman is basically giving an arbitrator a reason to increase the suspension, not decrease it.

The fact that the NHLPA would support this issue, of all things, through the appeal and arbitration process boggles my mind. They're basically defending a small minority (cheap thugs) over all the rest of their members, any of whom could be the next victim if the league isn't allowed to hand out a real suspension to Thornton. Get a brain, (Ian) Morans!

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

The fact that the NHLPA would support this issue, of all things, through the appeal and arbitration process boggles my mind. They're basically defending a small minority (cheap thugs) over all the rest of their members, any of whom could be the next victim if the league isn't allowed to hand out a real suspension to Thornton. Get a brain, (Ian) Morans!

It's a strange situation, if you think about it. On the one hand, I know they're defending an NHLPA member (Thornton). But on the other hand, shouldn't the NHLPA be more interested in protecting the health and safety of their members (Orpik) from this sort of attack? Them supporting Thornton is indirectly saying they're not all that concerned about the victim in this instance.

It's a weird situation in that it's like having the same lawyer represent both the victim and defendant in an assault trial.

 

[Rico Fatastic]

I'm not certain, but I suspect the PA is legally obligated to assist Thornton in his defense regardless of their feelings on the matter.

 

[CrozJawz*]

Wait a minute, Thornton is now claiming that he didn't know it was Orpik that he took down???

After skating halfway down the ice, wading into the scrum and then taking two shots while looking right at him, he didn't know who he was???

What a joke. And an even bigger joke is the Bruins fans who still defend him and put the onus on Orpik for not fighting after a clean hit...

I agree that I think Thornton's actions came down from the top. EVERYONE in Boston was screaming that the Bruins didn't do anything to Patches in the game just before the one against the Pens. They were going crazy about the Habs taking liberties on their players and them doing nothing about it (something Pens fans are used to...LOL) and by God they wanted something done.

So along comes the game against the Pens, Orpik steps up on Eriksson to set the tone, and the Bruins feel that they needed to do SOMETHING to show that they meant business. So they claim that they were fed up with their players getting hit and injured, they tried to get Orpik to "man up" and "answer the bell" and he didn't. Then Neal hit Marchand in the head with his knee and they claim that was the last straw. Thornton just went crazy because he was tired of his players getting cheapshotted, so he just grabbed the first Penguin he saw and decided to dish out some Beantown justice...

On a side note though, I am getting tired of the Pens refusing to stick up for shots on their star players. I am not at all suggesting anything like what Thornton did, but if you have noticed, just in the last week alone, 3 Pens were hit low with hip checks and low bridges. Kobasew, Neal, and Crosby. Neal had to take matters into his own hands to stick up for himself... Where are the guys like Bortuzzo in situations like that? Why are all of his fights some staged garbage against the other team's heavyweight? Are they being told to not engage anybody because of their current injury situation? While I have seen many hipchecks and lowbridges over the years, it is kind of a rarity now but now I have just seen 3 thrown on the Pens in the last week...

 

[Darth Vitale]

Bettman has upheld the original suspension so the Thornton thing is done and we got the result we hoped for.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=697425

All this crap about Boston supporting Thornton and "exhausting all options" is nothing but a lot of arm waving at this point. The decision is final and he'll serve the term. Let's move on.

I see no reason to continue this beyond the 1000 post mark (if there's another big suspension to talk about late in the season we can start a new thread), so get your parting shots in now.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Bettman has upheld the original suspension so the Thornton thing is done and we got the result we hoped for.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=697425

All this crap about Boston supporting Thornton and "exhausting all options" is nothing but a lot of arm waving at this point. The decision is final and he'll serve the term. Let's move on.

I see no reason to continue this beyond the 1000 post mark so get your parting shots in now.

ya but isn't he appealing to an arbitrator?

 

[Darth Vitale]

ya but isn't he appealing to an arbitrator?

I seriously doubt some arbitrator is going to overrule the Dept. of Player safety's decision and the Commissioner's review and subsequent upholding of the decision. This is Boston just making noise / trying to drum up player sympathy for their cause.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I seriously doubt some arbitrator is going to overrule the Dept. of Player safety's decision and the Commissioner's review and subsequent upholding of the decision. This is Boston just making noise / trying to drum up player sympathy for their cause.

why would arbitration be an option if it was just going to go with the ruling of the league? Isn't the whole point of it that its independent of the league similar to RFA arbitration?

 

[madinsomniac]

I am more or less done with this... not that I matter. Its possible that the arbiter changes things significantly, but Im not sure he will. If he does then maybe that is worthy of a new thread since it would be a first for the league, but im pretty sure all the thornton/orpik facts are now out there. Orpik looks to be back, perhaps today.

what is left in this matter is rehashing old stuff, boston fans denial, which isn't our business, and perhaps a discussion on the merits of long suspensions, which will be more relevant during the next incident going forwards...

 

[Over the volcano]

Eriksson just took the ice for the first time since that hit.

Here's hoping everyone's healthy when the two teams get to meet again in the playoffs.

 

[madinsomniac]

Eriksson just took the ice for the first time since that hit.

Here's hoping everyone's healthy when the two teams get to meet again in the playoffs.

Obviously he was faking until Orpik came back to make it look better

 

[Astro99]

Eriksson just took the ice for the first time since that hit.

Here's hoping everyone's healthy when the two teams get to meet again in the playoffs.

With these two teams, what are the odds! Glad Louie is back - hoping they gave him enough recovery time!

 

[madinsomniac]

http://espn.go.com/boston/nhl/story...nton-boston-bruins-dropping-appeal-suspension

Its over... he isn't appealing any further... not sounding like he is very remorseful either... Also its nice to see that all the Goons stick together in trying times like this... never saw so much weeping and gnashing of teeth defending a clearly bad event like this...

 

[Shady Machine]

Very happy Louie is back.