Trades and Free Agent Talk -- Insert witty title here

[kb]

We watched him play.

Then I have to question......what you see.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Then I have to question......what you see.

Likewise.

 

[mydnyte]

Barrie just isnt a good fit on the team...
I'd be all over the Isles and trying to get Pulock. or Mayfield + for Barrie
Isles have no incentive, unless they feel Barrie could bounce back to form. and give them an offence boost.
they also have a couple of NHL ready young goalies that could be an upgrade

 

[ToneDog]

So then we fire Babcock or hope he improves.

The chances the Leafs make a deal more significant than acquiring a better backup before firing Babcock are the same chances an amazing deal just falls into our laps.

With Mitch out, Babs needs to win to keep his job. If he refuses to lean on his stars and they start to slide, they should fire him before the season is a write off.

As far as backup goes, DeSmith is the lowest target. Anything lower like a Picard is rolling the dice and a waste of assets.

 

[ToneDog]

I don't understand the Ceci hate either. He does have some lapses in judgement resulting in goals, but so do most defenders.

Ceci has been the least of our issues on the back-end, IMO.

Edit: We need to trade Barrie + for a defensively responsible top 4 RHD who can PK...

Rielly-RHD
Muzzin-Ceci
Dermott-Holl

That would be solid, IMO.

Who needs an expiring PP QB that is willing to give up assets you can turn into a top 4 RHD because you are not getting a top 4 RHD from that team IMO.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

With Mitch out, Babs needs to win to keep his job. If he refuses to lean on his stars and they start to slide, they should fire him before the season is a write off.

As far as backup goes, DeSmith is the lowest target. Anything lower like a Picard is rolling the dice and a waste of assets.

The only problem with DeSmith is the cap and the fact he is sucking this year in the AHL, suggesting his one good season was a flash in the pan. So knows how good he would actually be. Maybe a total unknown or rookie would be significantly better?

 

[Kiwi]

barrie isn't putting up stats (i know, i own him in fantasy) but his advance stats are really strong . maybe a good time to resign him rather than dump him

He takes a ton of low percentage point shots which makes me question his hockey IQ and he's God awful defensively

He's the last guy I'd resign

 

[BlueForever75]

He takes a ton of low percentage point shots which makes me question his hockey IQ and he's God awful defensively

He's the last guy I'd resign

You mean the same low percentage point shots that were going in for him his whole career in Colorado??? Those shots you speak of.

Maybe Babcock needs to put more emphasis on his forwards crashing the net like Colorado did and those low percentage point shots are more dangerous. That is Barrie's game getting the puck to the net, always has been. Not his fault the Leafs employ a bunch of players that like to hang by the circles instead of working for chances!!!!

Give me a break. Now this is all Barrie's fault right!!!!

 

[rumman]

He takes a ton of low percentage point shots which makes me question his hockey IQ and he's God awful defensively

He's the last guy I'd resign

yup, I'd even resign Ceci before touching Barrie, at least if you dropped Ceci down the line up he'd look okay even though $4.5 mil is a gross over payment for what he brings.

About the only perk is the Leafs are only paying him just over $2 mil.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

He takes a ton of low percentage point shots which makes me question his hockey IQ and he's God awful defensively

He's the last guy I'd resign

Avs fan here. Barrie’s “low percentage shots” are part of what turned him into such a stud. He has a ridiculous ability to get shots on net. He picked it up playing with Burns at the WC a few years ago.

Sucks that things haven’t worked out so far but it seems like the things that make him so effective aren’t being utilized very well in Toronto.

 

[Fogelhund]

You mean the same low percentage point shots that were going in for him his whole career in Colorado??? Those shots you speak of.

Maybe Babcock needs to put more emphasis on his forwards crashing the net like Colorado did and those low percentage point shots are more dangerous. That is Barrie's game getting the puck to the net, always has been. Not his fault the Leafs employ a bunch of players that like to hang by the circles instead of working for chances!!!!

Give me a break. Now this is all Barrie's fault right!!!!

I'm not saying it's all Barrie's fault. As I've posted elsewhere, it's about trying to use Round Pegs, to fill Square holes.

It doesn't matter if it's offensive D man Zaitsev, being asked to be a defensive D man, or now Barrie. Our coaching staff has one system, and you either fit into it, or not... there is no adjustments to fit the players that we have, we just try and make guys work in spots, no matter what their skill sets are.

Barrie hasn't been very good, and some of that is on him, no question... but, there is probably more of that on the coaching staff, asking him to be something he isn't.

Either we need a coach who can adapt... or we need a GM who simply gives the coach the square pegs, to fit in the square holes.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Is there any harm in trying out Kaskisuo at this point?

We talked a lot about building through the draft and having a cupboard full of prospects at the ready to plug holes and fill voids as they arose. Kind of surprising after spending years languishing at the bottom of the standings that we don't have a capable, young backup goalie that could step up.

 

[Menzinger]

We talked a lot about building through the draft and having a cupboard full of prospects at the ready to plug holes and fill voids as they arose. Kind of surprising after spending years languishing at the bottom of the standings that we don't have a capable, young backup goalie that could step up.

Well the Leafs DO have two fairly promising goalie prospects, though both still reuqire more "cooking" from a development pov

 

[Menzinger]

I'm not saying it's all Barrie's fault. As I've posted elsewhere, it's about trying to use Round Pegs, to fill Square holes.

It doesn't matter if it's offensive D man Zaitsev, being asked to be a defensive D man, or now Barrie. Our coaching staff has one system, and you either fit into it, or not... there is no adjustments to fit the players that we have, we just try and make guys work in spots, no matter what their skill sets are.

Barrie hasn't been very good, and some of that is on him, no question... but, there is probably more of that on the coaching staff, asking him to be something he isn't.

Either we need a coach who can adapt... or we need a GM who simply gives the coach the square pegs, to fit in the square holes.

I still think babs and Dubas are capable of working together, but one cant help but speculate that he wouldnt exactly be Dubas' main choice for coach if he was picking a coach today for.the job.

There DO seems to be some systems related gaps between the two guys (at least from an outsiders POV)

 

[WTFMAN99]

We talked a lot about building through the draft and having a cupboard full of prospects at the ready to plug holes and fill voids as they arose. Kind of surprising after spending years languishing at the bottom of the standings that we don't have a capable, young backup goalie that could step up.

2-3 years hopefully the fruits of Woll/Scott flourish.

 

[Fogelhund]

I still think babs and Dubas are capable of working together, but one cant help but speculate that he wouldnt exactly be Dubas' main choice for coach if he was picking a coach today for.the job.

There DO seems to be some systems related gaps between the two guys (at least from an outsiders POV)

That has to be our assumption... though, we don't know what trades were available to us anyway... maybe there simply wasn't a quality RHD available, that would fit with what Babcock wants to utilize anyway... maybe Barrie isn't a perfect fit... but at least it was a guy with a decent track record... we just speculate... but given what he's got, the coach does have to adapt some.

 

[4thline]

yup, I'd even resign Ceci before touching Barrie, at least if you dropped Ceci down the line up he'd look okay even though $4.5 mil is a gross over payment for what he brings.

Completely out of touch. In a league where top defenders are drawing 9,10,11 million 4.5 is fine for a 4D can handle top pairing usage

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Well the Leafs DO have two fairly promising goalie prospects, though both still reuqire more "cooking" from a development pov

Yes, that's good. But, we need one to step up now versus in a year or two.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

2-3 years hopefully the fruits of Woll/Scott flourish.

Yes, I agree & that's good. But, we need one to step up now versus in 2 years. Oh well.

 

[4thline]

Yes, I agree & that's good. But, we need one to step up now versus in 2 years. Oh well.

It's too bad this management group couldn't go back in time and draft better goalies on behalf of the last one. Oh well.

 

[Menzinger]

That has to be our assumption... though, we don't know what trades were available to us anyway... maybe there simply wasn't a quality RHD available, that would fit with what Babcock wants to utilize anyway... maybe Barrie isn't a perfect fit... but at least it was a guy with a decent track record... we just speculate... but given what he's got, the coach does have to adapt some.

I think the realities of the market have played a big role.

Like we know Dubas first had a deal in place with thr Flames for Brodie+ for Kadri, but that Kadri vetoed the deal with his partial ntc.

Barrie likely not what Babcock wanted - but was likely one lf the few top level rhd D men available

 

[Fogelhund]

I think the realities of the market have played a big role.

Like we know Dubas first had a deal in place with thr Flames for Brodie+ for Kadri, but that Kadri vetoed the deal with his partial ntc.

Barrie likely not what Babcock wanted - but was likely one lf the few top level rhd D men available

Fair enough, if that's the assumption that we go with... it's certainly a possibility... but then play the players we've got, to their strengths... adapt some. Don't ask them to be what they aren't.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

It's too bad this management group couldn't go back in time and draft better goalies on behalf of the last one. Oh well.

Sure, if you want to look at it that way.

I see the different management regimes as part of a continuum. We've been rebuilding for years now under different management regimes and we've been lousy and had high overall picks for years now.

Whether it was an older regime, or the current Shanny/Dubas version, it really doesn't matter. The challenges have largely remained the same and the different regimes have been doing a lot of the same things. It doesn't provide any comfort making a distinction between a current failure or one that's a few years older.

 

[baton elevated]

I think the realities of the market jave ayed a big role.

Like we know Dubas first had a deal in place with thr Flames for Brodie+ for Kadri, but that Kadri vetoed the deal with his partial ntc.

Barrie likely not what Babcock wanted - but was likely one lf the few top level rhd D men available

Brodie wouldn't have been better and i would claim even worse than Barrie. You can have him for free at the end of the year. All these offensive Dmen in this niche are not what the team needs and not what Babcock requires to fit his game plan.
Babs and the Leafs are simply not a fit for each other, period!

 

[pspot]

5th in the conference and 9th overall in league.
fire the coach and gm, trade half the d , lol