Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals 2019-20 PART VIII

[guyzeur]

I'm not sure how I feel about getting a 2021 1st at the expense of a top 15 pick in a strong 2020 draft.

How good does the 2021 pick have to be to get us an equivalent prospect? Especially since we have ammo to move up of needed.

Also, I'd be concerned about the dynamic of the 2021 scouting availability. Who knows how much info might be unavailable if smaller leagues cannot run the same schedule, or if scouts ar le unable to travel to games.

All our eggs were in this year draft.

We're already over budget for this year draft. We will have to cut by half next year budget of the Amateur scouting dept.

 

[Sweatred]

True we don't but I would gamble on him being a more valuable player. Better ... at what? Sanderson has more size and more speed and is very good defensively .. I will take that as a starting point.

I’d trade Brann + for Sanderson... I just wouldn’t trade Brann + NYI for Sanderson.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

I can ask you the same. Do you have any proof that there were 7 years of losses?

The question that will never be answered.

 

[dumbdick]

I'm not sure how I feel about getting a 2021 1st at the expense of a top 15 pick in a strong 2020 draft.

How good does the 2021 pick have to be to get us an equivalent prospect? Especially since we have ammo to move up of needed.

Also, I'd be concerned about the dynamic of the 2021 scouting availability. Who knows how much info might be unavailable if smaller leagues cannot run the same schedule, or if scouts ar le unable to travel to games.

I think you take a shot when the lottery is involved. Imagine a 1st overall in 2020 and 2021. Its like I'm dreaming and woke up an oilers fan.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I think you take a shot when the lottery is involved. Imagine a 1st overall in 2020 and 2021. Its like I'm dreaming and woke up an oilers fan.

The Islanders pick will be 13th-15th if they miss the playoffs and do not win the lottery.

Because every team has a different list, it is conceivable we could get a player from our top 10 in that spot. With how strong the 2020 draft supposedly is, I just don't think that downside is worth the risk of hoping the Islanders win the lottery next season.

Not that we have a choice, but if I could control the outcome, I think being in that position (with the further possibility of trading up because of our wealth of 2nd round picks) is too good of an opportunity to pass up in exchange for the low probability that the 2021 Islanders' pick gets us access to a better prospect.

I hate to cheer against Pageau, but the Islanders losing and handing us a 15+46 is a really nice result from the Pageau trade. Closer to the deadline, it didn't look like we were going to get a 1st, let alone one that high.

 

[guyzeur]

I think you take a shot when the lottery is involved. Imagine a 1st overall in 2020 and 2021. Its like I'm dreaming and woke up an oilers fan.

Wake up!

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

The Islanders pick will be 13th-15th if they miss the playoffs and do not win the lottery.

Because every team has a different list, it is conceivable we could get a player from our top 10 in that spot. With how strong the 2020 draft supposedly is, I just don't think that downside is worth the risk of hoping the Islanders win the lottery next season.

Not that we have a choice, but if I could control the outcome, I think being in that position (with the further possibility of trading up because of our wealth of 2nd round picks) is too good of an opportunity to pass up in exchange for the low probability that the 2021 Islanders' pick gets us access to a better prospect.

I hate to cheer against Pageau, but the Islanders losing and handing us a 15+46 is a really nice result from the Pageau trade. Closer to the deadline, it didn't look like we were going to get a 1st, let alone one that high.

having another top 15 pick in this years draft could be enormous. Someone like Lundell or Quinn dropping or picking Amirov/Gunler

It mitigates our chances of selecting a bust and increased our chances of getting a high impact player even if we somehow swing and miss with our higher picks.

We could walk away with our first four picks being:

Raymond
Perfetti
Lundell
Mysak

Disgusting.

 

[supsens]

This is why we'll never be great because by the time we get good it's time to rebuild when our players become expensive... For me, it's the never ending rebuild so while i'm happy we are getting 2 top 6 choices, our window is super small when it should be amazingly large..

This is the first time we ditched star players because of money so hopefully that won't happen. They need the constant playoff revenue tho, but if EM can gamble away a million having a couple drinks i would imagine that has happened a lot so he might be too poor to pay anyone.
No fans from Covid would proably cause massive loses, or escrow would be so large it might be good for the sens?
I guess will see, I got a feeling if we draft first this year he does make a 5 year cup run attempt then cashes out.

 

[operasen]

The Islanders pick will be 13th-15th if they miss the playoffs and do not win the lottery.

Because every team has a different list, it is conceivable we could get a player from our top 10 in that spot. With how strong the 2020 draft supposedly is, I just don't think that downside is worth the risk of hoping the Islanders win the lottery next season.

Not that we have a choice, but if I could control the outcome, I think being in that position (with the further possibility of trading up because of our wealth of 2nd round picks) is too good of an opportunity to pass up in exchange for the low probability that the 2021 Islanders' pick gets us access to a better prospect.

I hate to cheer against Pageau, but the Islanders losing and handing us a 15+46 is a really nice result from the Pageau trade. Closer to the deadline, it didn't look like we were going to get a 1st, let alone one that high.

I agree we should keep the NYI pick. Base a trade with a live body package around Tierney plus Anisimov/White/Ryan types and a couple of mid 2nds.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I agree we should keep the NYI pick. Base a trade with a live body package around Tierney plus Anisimov/White/Ryan types and a couple of mid 2nds.

I'm fine with trading away the pick for the right player. The context of the discussion was other posters hoping that NYI wins the lottery, so we get their 2021 pick unprotected instead of a top 15 pick in 2020.

I'd rather take a top 15 pick in 2020 than an unknown pick in a weaker draft with possibly compromised scouting if COVID-19 limits junior play/scouts traveling.

 

[aragorn]

I wouldn't mind seeing Dorion going after one of the NJ picks or Minny's #10 OA with a package of prospects/players. There are three players I would like to see him target over & above the picks he has in Sanderson LD, Quinn RW and/or Askarov G.

 

[Sweatred]

I’m cautious about over spending to move up. I think we are going to get a great selection at OTT, SJ, NYI and 33.

If anything I’d burn a third rounder if it moved 33 into the 22-29 range. I think that extra selection could secure a 4th significant piece be it F or D.

 

[Micklebot]

I’m cautious about over spending to move up. I think we are going to get a great selection at OTT, SJ, NYI and 33.

If anything I’d burn a third rounder if it moved 33 into the 22-29 range. I think that extra selection could secure a 4th significant piece be it F or D.

Probably cost more than a third if you want to move up further than 28 or 29.

Depending on who is still on the board though it could be worth it.

 

[Sweatred]

Probably cost more than a third if you want to move up further than 28 or 29.

Depending on who is still on the board though it could be worth it.

Totally fine with that (as stated). It also leaves picks 5 and 6 to take a high risk reward shot if the Sens want.

 

[guyzeur]

Totally fine with that (as stated). It also leaves picks 5 and 6 to take a high risk reward shot if the Sens want.

we're not drafting 5 and 6

 

[TheNewEra]

we're not drafting 5 and 6

i think he meant picks 5 and 6 of the first two rounds

could be wrong though

 

[BigRig4]

I'm fine with trading away the pick for the right player. The context of the discussion was other posters hoping that NYI wins the lottery, so we get their 2021 pick unprotected instead of a top 15 pick in 2020.

I'd rather take a top 15 pick in 2020 than an unknown pick in a weaker draft with possibly compromised scouting if COVID-19 limits junior play/scouts traveling.

I didn't even know this was a thing... One more thing to be nervous about tonight lol

 

[TheNewEra]

I'm fine with trading away the pick for the right player. The context of the discussion was other posters hoping that NYI wins the lottery, so we get their 2021 pick unprotected instead of a top 15 pick in 2020.

I'd rather take a top 15 pick in 2020 than an unknown pick in a weaker draft with possibly compromised scouting if COVID-19 limits junior play/scouts traveling.

after thinking about it overnight, wouldnt compromised scouting put everyone at the same level as ottawa's budgets for scouts and thus allowing us to kill it next year in the draft since our scouts are pretty good

 

[Cosmix]

I’d trade Brann + for Sanderson... I just wouldn’t trade Brann + NYI for Sanderson.

Would anyone trade a second round pick to NYI before today’s lottery to take the top 3 lottery protection off the NYI pick in this year’s draft?

 

[GCK]

Would anyone trade a second round pick to NYI before today’s lottery to take the top 3 lottery protection off the NYI pick in this year’s draft?

No.

 

[Cosmix]

after thinking about it overnight, wouldnt compromised scouting put everyone at the same level as ottawa's budgets for scouts and thus allowing us to kill it next year in the draft since our scouts are pretty good

No, I do not think the effect would be a leveling of all scouting staffs to the same level.

 

[Sweatred]

we're not drafting 5 and 6

Yes - I meant our 5th and 6th picks from round 2.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

after thinking about it overnight, wouldnt compromised scouting put everyone at the same level as ottawa's budgets for scouts and thus allowing us to kill it next year in the draft since our scouts are pretty good

Not really.

Our scouting has been good. So if we can't scout players, we are at a disadvantage.

Also, there's a communal level knowledge on players each draft. Every team has a different list, but at least in the first round, there is a large amount of crossover. Even know teams vary on how high they are on each player, there is a general idea of mostly (not all) of who should go in the top 10/20/etc. It gets murkier later on in the draft of course when there is less consensus.

So if there isn't consistent scouting, teams are going to be going in with much less overall knowledge than usual. I'd rather take a 15th overall pick in this draft, which has already been established as very deep near the top end of the first round. While scouts are going into 2020 with less knowledge than usual due to some key playoffs/tournaments being cancelled, players have been scouted for most of the year. I'm skeptical about what scouting will look like next season.

To me, the Islanders are a bubble team. So a best case scenario would be a similar pick in that 11-15 type wheelhouse, in a weaker draft, with less scouting, and a very small percent chance at moving up into the top 3.

I think people like the excitement of following a potential lottery pick that is not their own, which I get. But I think it is unlikely that we benefit if the Islanders pick is pushed to 2021.

 

[Ouroboros]

NHL/NHLPA talks on CBA include escrow cap, salary deferral for players - Sportsnet.ca

Important quote from the article...

As part of the agreement, the salary cap will be kept close to the current $81.5 million for the next three seasons. There is potential for it to go up $1 million in 2022-23.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

NHL/NHLPA talks on CBA include escrow cap, salary deferral for players - Sportsnet.ca

Important quote from the article...

A big factor that has to be kept in mind is that Seattle is going to come in during the 2021 off season and bring with them 81.5M of cap relief for other teams. Seattle has to get to the floor, so there will be incentive for them to take negative value contracts that come with assets or expansion draft considerations.

The big opportunity for the Senators with the salary cap is two-fold.

They have a limited opportunity this off season to get players for pennies on the dollar, because teams will have to move good pieces to get under the cap, but won't be able to make cap in/cap out deals. They will have to move those players to teams with space to eat the entire contracts. Of which, there aren't many.

The same thing goes for negative value contracts that come with assets. Do the Senators really need more prospects/picks? Not directly. But indirectly, the Senators can use picks and prospects to acquire actual NHL players.

The other opportunity is simply that the Senators have an unprecedented amount of cap flexibility. There should be no road blocks to building their team, because other than Ryan's contract which is up in 2022, there's no bad money on the books. If White fails to perform, he can be bought out for a very minimal cap penalty in the six figure range. The Senators are one of the few teams who have an opportunity to build up toward the cap, rather than being forced to build down to it.