Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals 2019-20 PART VIII

[bert]

I will be happy when Dorion is gone.

He has won one trade and it was by accident i hope he keeps all the picks he can actually draft stick to what you're good at.

 

[Cosmix]

5, 21, and 46 for 7 and 10 if things stay the same. I have a feeling the NYI pick will end up closer to 15/16.

I hope you are right in projecting the NYI pick ending up at #15/16, so we can trade it with #5 and a second round pick to get #1.

 

[JaredCowen4Norris]

I will be happy when Dorion is gone.

I think it really could be worse. His scouting is top notch and it really shows. The amount of players we actually develop through our system is much better then most teams. He rightfully caught a lot of flak for trading star players but I'm much happier with where we are now vs is we re-signed our stars. Before Dorion was working with parts that were partial inherited from Murray. The trading of the old guard really signified that Dorion is going to build his team now. I think we should judge him on the next few years because they're going to be pivotal.

He definitely has his faults but a lot of that comes from having to be Melnyks yes-man. At the end of the day there are only 31 GM positions in the league. If the person who keeps me employed says shed salary, you better believe I'm shedding salary. Is it the right thing to do? No, but it's unfortunately the way it works. At the end of the day ownership calls the shots.

Never thought I'd be defending Dorion but considering the other GMs around the league we could be muuuuuch worse off.

 

[Tuna99]

He has won one trade and it was by accident i hope he keeps all the picks he can actually draft stick to what you're good at.

I loved Erik Karlsson hockey in Ottawa and he is by far the best player Ottawa has ever had and may have for a long time to come - but in truth, the franchise was to small for EK and really any GM would have had to trade him. Is there anything more sad then an $11 million player on a horrid team?

i always questioned why Shane Doan would never leave Arizona to win. Doan isn’t half the player EK was, but you wonder if he ever wanted to win in hockey or he was more concerned about being happy and his community: and that’s healthy in a normal life; but as a fan you have to question a hockey player who stays in a losing environment with no real chance of success over the coming 3-5 years. As a fan I don’t want to tolerate players who like to lose or don’t give 100% just because they like their neighbours.

EK and Dorion both did the right thing in the situation, Dorion just came out way worse because he works for a donkey and is bad with the media; EK had the fans on his side because we wanted his wizardry on the ice and he’s a slick media guy who played the Sens like the clown show they were.

but it’s worked out for Ottawa; and it worked out for EK with the big contract. Win win if you look at it clearly. EK seems happy in Cali, he seems
Like a Cali guy. Ottawa gets their pieces to rebuild and Dorion comes out of it looking pretty smart, and he’s learned his lesson with the media and is way more comfortable being the GM

 

[JaredCowen4Norris]

I loved Erik Karlsson hockey in Ottawa and he is by far the best player Ottawa has ever had and may have for a long time to come - but in truth, the franchise was to small for EK and really any GM would have had to trade him. Is there anything more sad then an $11 million player on a horrid team?

i always questioned why Shane Doan would never leave Arizona to win. Doan isn’t half the player EK was, but you wonder if he ever wanted to win in hockey or he was more concerned about being happy and his community: and that’s healthy in a normal life; but as a fan you have to question a hockey player who stays in a losing environment with no real chance of success over the coming 3-5 years. As a fan I don’t want to tolerate players who like to lose or don’t give 100% just because they like their neighbours.

EK and Dorion both did the right thing in the situation, Dorion just came out way worse because he works for a donkey and is bad with the media; EK had the fans on his side because we wanted his wizardry on the ice and he’s a slick media guy who played the Sens like the clown show they were.

but it’s worked out for Ottawa; and it worked out for EK with the big contract. Win win if you look at it clearly. EK seems happy in Cali, he seems
Like a Cali guy. Ottawa gets their pieces to rebuild and Dorion comes out of it looking pretty smart, and he’s learned his lesson with the media and is way more comfortable being the GM

It was in both parties best interest to move on. Karlsson rightfully wanted to get paid after having some of his best seasons on a very team friendly deal. Dorion knew he wasn't going to be able to re-sign him and got the most for him he could. Trading him now with an $11 mil contract would be impossible.

It's tough for GMs because casual fans will hate you for trading star players no matter what. The Stone trade was unnecessary but all the others have been not terrible considering Dorion wasn't exactly trading from a position of power.

 

[SensHulk]

I really doubt Logan Brown moves the needle for the Kings. If I'm LA, I don't see the value in trading down for a big centre and the #5 to grab another centre/winger when they already have that choice in front of them with Byfield and Stutzle.

I think they would be looking for a bigger add.

You might be right. For my scenario to work, LA has to be set on getting drysdale or Sanderson

 

[SensHulk]

Since we’re talking about. IMO the duchene/turris trade really shook the foundation of the team. Turris was well respected, consistent playoff hero and beloved in the city. It’s not shocking to me that we suddenly started sucking balls right after he got traded (which seemingly also opened the floodgates of players feuding with the owner again), and then the rest of the exodus started. If I could go back, tell Dorion not to do that trade at all. Didn’t even get a full season with duchene but got a priceless Uber video though

 

[Tuna99]

Since we’re talking about. IMO the duchene/turris trade really shook the foundation of the team. Turris was well respected, consistent playoff hero and beloved in the city. It’s not shocking to me that we suddenly started sucking balls right after he got traded (which seemingly also opened the floodgates of players feuding with the owner again), and then the rest of the exodus started. If I could go back, tell Dorion not to do that trade at all. Didn’t even get a full season with duchene but got a priceless Uber video though

could even take it back a few months to asking Phaneuf to wave his no trade for the expansion draft and the bad blood started there with Phaneuf and Methots comments to the media about it.

but the Turris trade seemed to blow everything up . EK kinda checked out, The best part about Duchesne in town was when he sang in an Ottawa country bar and the media went wild seeing it as a sign he was so comfortable here he’d probably sign long term. Then he signed in the country music heartland - Nashville, and the same media guys were like ‘wow; we didn’t know he liked country music that much’

 

[JD1]

Of course, I could be wrong, my wife thinks I'm wrong about everything completely unrelated to hockey. lol

Any chance we're married to the same woman?

 

[JD1]

Since we’re talking about. IMO the duchene/turris trade really shook the foundation of the team. Turris was well respected, consistent playoff hero and beloved in the city. It’s not shocking to me that we suddenly started sucking balls right after he got traded (which seemingly also opened the floodgates of players feuding with the owner again), and then the rest of the exodus started. If I could go back, tell Dorion not to do that trade at all. Didn’t even get a full season with duchene but got a priceless Uber video though

Definitely that trade caused internal issues. We went completely in the shitter immediately. What would have happened had we waited and traded him at the deadline? Is the internal strife any different? That was a pretty weird two year stretch.

 

[Samsquanch]

Since we’re talking about. IMO the duchene/turris trade really shook the foundation of the team. Turris was well respected, consistent playoff hero and beloved in the city. It’s not shocking to me that we suddenly started sucking balls right after he got traded (which seemingly also opened the floodgates of players feuding with the owner again), and then the rest of the exodus started. If I could go back, tell Dorion not to do that trade at all. Didn’t even get a full season with duchene but got a priceless Uber video though

Was he really a consistent playoff hero though? Obviously he scored that huge OT goal for us that we all remember so well (and what his entire playoff reputation seems to be based upon) , but if we are being honest I seem to remember Turris struggling in the playoffs more often than not due to the increased physical play that we get in the post season.... 24pts in 42gp is not a playoff hero in my books if its your #1C's stat line. His numbers in Nashville seem to confirm that if anything his game gets dialed back a bit in the playoffs, and is a career PO numbers (14g/32pts in 65gp) seem to back that up fully.

Pager was a playoff hero relative to the minutes and the role he was given here. Turris, not so much. Turris if anything is the reason this team why was held back in many ways (not like we had any better options any how - but he was a less than ideal #1C for too many years here imo).

 

[NyQuil]

Was he really a consistent playoff hero though? Obviously he scored that huge OT goal for us that we all remember so well (and what his entire playoff reputation seems to be based upon) , but if we are being honest I seem to remember Turris struggling in the playoffs more often than not due to the increased physical play that we get in the post season.... 24pts in 42gp is not a playoff hero in my books if its your #1C's stat line. His numbers in Nashville seem to confirm that if anything his game gets dialed back a bit in the playoffs.

Pager was a playoff hero relative to the minutes and the role he was given here. Turris, not so much. Turris if anything is the reason this team why was held back in many ways (not like we had any better options any how - but he was a less than ideal #1C for too many years here imo).

He also scored the OT playoff goal on Budaj.

 

[slamigo]

Maybe this has already been posted but:
Moving on from Ottawa makes sense for Mark Borowiecki

Boro scrubbed all references to the Ottawa Senators from his social media presence.

 

[Samsquanch]

He also scored the OT playoff goal on Budaj.

Fair enough. Im just not ready to call a top 6 center (#1 on this team) with a career stat line of 14g-32pts in 65gp a consistent playoff hero, even with those 2 huge goals on his resume. Thats just not fair to the real heroes, imo...

 

[NyQuil]

Fair enough. Im just not ready to call a top 6 center (#1 on this team) with a career stat line of 14g-32pts in 65gp a consistent playoff hero, even with those 2 huge goals on his resume. Thats just not fair to the real heroes, imo...

Well, if you look at his tenure with the Senators from 2011-2012 to 2017-2018, he is the Senators leading playoff goal scorer, tied with JGP.

Kyle Turris - 12
JG Pageau - 12
Bobby Ryan - 8
Mike Hoffman - 7
Daniel Alfredsson - 6
Clarke MacArthur - 5
Erik Karlsson - 5
Mark Stone - 5
Milan Michalek - 5

If you look at game-winning goals:

Kyle Turris - 3
Bobby Ryan - 3
Erik Karlsson - 2
Mark Methot - 2
Mike Hoffman - 2
JG Pageau - 2

I think he has earned a bit of a reputation as a playoff producer with the Senators.

I'm glad we moved on from Turris because the term for his contract was way too long considering an expected decline in his abilities, but that doesn't dismiss what he did do with this team.

 

[armani]

Maybe this has already been posted but:
Moving on from Ottawa makes sense for Mark Borowiecki

Boro scrubbed all references to the Ottawa Senators from his social media presence.

As the senior most Sens in the roster, I think he's the perfect #6 for the rebuilding Ottawa Senators. Borocop's hockey also improved in the last couple of years. If he moves on I will definitely miss him. He was the last of the pesky Sens and will contribute to the complete roster change since Melnyk and Dorion announced the rebuild (and ironically Boro himself, likely unknowingly, acting as Melnyk's pawn in the most famous interview in Sens hockey history).

 

[Samsquanch]

Well, if you look at his tenure with the Senators from 2011-2012 to 2017-2018, he is the Senators leading playoff goal scorer, tied with JGP.

Kyle Turris - 12g/12a in 42 gp

Doesnt look as good like that. Just because he was the best scorer on the Sens, thats not saying much, and Im still no where near ready to call him a playoff hero. He was a decent player for sure, very good at times. But man o man has the bar been set low for us if we want to call our #1C a hero with an ugly stat line like that. You cannot depend on a player like this for front line offense, and we tried for far too long with Turris while wasting away EKs prime.

 

[NyQuil]

Doesnt look as good like that. Just because he was the best scorer on the Sens, thats not saying much, and Im still no where near ready to call him a playoff hero. He was a decent player for sure, very good at times. But man o man has the bar been set low for us if we want to call our #1C a hero with an ugly stat line like that. You cannot depend on a player like this for front line offense, and we tried for far too long with Turris while wasting away EKs prime.

Blaming Turris for losing in the playoffs is pretty stupid IMO.

Keep in mind that we had Jason Spezza on the team when we brought Turris over. Turris was never intended to be the team's #1C.

It's no wonder he can't live up to your expectations if you were counting on getting a franchise centre back in return for David Rundblad.

 

[Samsquanch]

Blaming Turris for losing in the playoffs is pretty stupid IMO.

Keep in mind that we had Jason Spezza on the team when we brought Turris over. Turris was never intended to be the team's #1C.

It's no wonder he can't live up to your expectations if you were counting on getting a franchise centre back in return for David Rundblad.

Im not blaming Turris for anything, but whatever...He was what he was, a #2C being forced to play up in a role that he wasnt good enough for. Simple as that.

But I am taking exception to you and anyone else calling him a consistent playoff hero. LMFAO. Seriously man. I know you like Turris and that nostalgia is a real thing, but give your head a shake. No amount of mental gymnastics or straw-man arguments should help you arrive at that conclusion.

 

[NyQuil]

But I am taking exception to you and anyone else calling him a consistently playoff hero. LMFAO. Seriously man. I know you like Turris and that nostalgia is a real thing, but give your head a shake. No amount of mental gymnastics or straw-man arguments should help you arrive at that conclusion.

It's almost as if people score fewer goals in the playoffs than they do in the regular season.

I don't even like Turris that much.

You were just wrong in your characterization that all he is known for is scoring one OT goal.

 

[otown]

Maybe this has already been posted but:
Moving on from Ottawa makes sense for Mark Borowiecki

Boro scrubbed all references to the Ottawa Senators from his social media presence.

Boro has to explore his options and in his position, term is going to matter. The writing appears to be on the wall in Ottawa and with the number of up and coming d-men waiting for a shot, Boro is on the outside looking in.
He has been a real soldier but the Sens are moving in a different direction IMO.

 

[Samsquanch]

It's almost as if people score fewer goals in the playoffs than they do in the regular season.

Its almost as if someone is desperately trying to avoid admitting that calling Turris a consistent playoff hero was an overstatement...

If you want to give yourself a good laugh, go and ask the rest of the NHL fans if they believe that Turris is a consistent playoff hero (even narrow it down to just Ottawa if it makes you feel any better), and prepare for a rude awakening.

 

[aragorn]

He has won one trade and it was by accident i hope he keeps all the picks he can actually draft stick to what you're good at.

He's had a few good deals, EK, Pageau & Dingle were all good trades & a number of his trades seem to be to get rid of players, unfortunately in some of those he had to take back some crappy players too, but he also picked up a number of picks. We have 3 picks in the first rd & 4 in the 2nd rd of this coming draft because of those trades. I think the team has been done for a few yrs although they got really lucky in Boucher's last full yr & the rebuild should have started sooner than it did. Of course, that's hard to do after they go to the Conference Championship one yr & crap the bed in the next, but it seems to be a habit with this team in the last number of yrs.

Pierre Dorion Trades - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[NyQuil]

If you want to give yourself a good laugh, go and ask the rest of the NHL fans if they believe that Turris is a consistent playoff hero (even narrow it down to just Ottawa if it makes you feel any better), and prepare for a rude awakening.

How many OT goals did Turris score in the playoffs?

Just admit you were wrong about that and we'll move on. Thank you.

 

[Samsquanch]

How many OT goals did Turris score?

Just admit you were wrong about that and we'll move on. Thank you.

Lmfao your too much man.

I already acknowledged that yes he scored 2 OT goals for us earlier - WOWzers you sure got me.... and totally missed the point in the process.

Those 2 OT goals still dosnt make him a consistent playoff warrior, holy faking christ man. It doesnt change the entire context of my point, not at all.

I dont care about Turris either. I just think anyone calling him a consistent playoff warrior is a bit, shall we say, lost, and chugging back that nostalgia flavored cool-aid.