Rumor: Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread | Hey Ken, If You're Not Getting a Goalie, How About Physicality?

[belair]

They're not in a playoff spot as of today.

There isn't some significant cavalry coming for next year either. Broberg is raw and is probably going to make a ton of mistakes just as Bouchard is, these players need to be sheltered.

Holloway has 5 points in 9 AHL games and only 1 goal ... that's not mind blowing.

Likely if they don't retain Kane, the forward group takes a step backwards next year.

It's so difficult to see your point because your argument is always so negative when it comes to the team you seem to believe instantly becomes a contender the moment they trade for the goalie you're parading that day.

The Oilers are neck and neck with LA and Anaheim currently because they just went through a six and seven game losing skid prior to Tippett's firing. They're better than both of them. Anaheim is probably better off selling anyways.

The Oilers don't need their prospects to be gamechangers out of the gate. They need to be upgrades on the bottom six garbage the team has regularly iced in the McDavid era.

Adding a handful of guys that contribute 20 or so points without getting flattened at even strength will be an upgrade on the bottom six that regularly has its ass handed to it.

 

[Broberg Speed]

I'm curious to see how much of that is due to Tippett's system. It's a system that depends heavily on consistent goaltending and/or good shot blocking (which was lost with Larsson gone and Russell out most of the year) because of all the zone entries and uncontested point shots it allows so I want to see if Woodcroft can implement a system that allows more puck possession for the Oilers and O zone time.

I think it's partially a personnel issue but it just seemed like the personnel didn't fit the type of coach Tippett is. Funny enough, Tippett would have been a better fit in Calgary I think.

What makes you think Tippett would be a good fit in Calgary? They already have a great coach.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Someone help me understand if Marchand will be able to play while appealing his suspension?
This is for fantasy purposes...I will take him out for the week if he isn't going to play. I just can't find good information on this.
Sorry, I know this is probably not the right thread for this. Wasn't sure where to put this

No. Calm down.

 

[Faelko]

Don't say that. This team could use another forward.

Certainly but the Oilers only have so many assets to “sell” to plug holes. It can’t be on another forward when the Def and Goaltending is in the state it’s in.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Certainly but the Oilers only have so many assets to “sell” to plug holes. It can’t be on another forward when the Def and Goaltending is in the state it’s in.

I'd like to watch a few games under coach Woodcroft and associate Manson. People fail to understand we haven't been playing a system at all this last month or so. It was 110% garbage hockey. It was pickup game after pickup game. Watch for the goaltending to rebound. Note the improvement from the defence while they actually play a system of defence. The team was being tanked. It was brutal.

 

[Faelko]

I'd like to watch a few games under coach Woodcroft and associate Manson. People fail to understand we haven't been playing a system at all this last month or so. It was 110% garbage hockey. It was pickup game after pickup game. Watch for the goaltending to rebound. Note the improvement from the defence while they actually play a system of defence. The team was being tanked. It was brutal.

It’s possible I suppose but the same logic could be applied to the forwards as well. Maybe Foegele finds his groove, or Yamamoto.

I doubt Holland does anything until he sees what this group looks like under a new coach.

 

[Nostradumbass]

Don't say that. This team could use another forward.

With what cap?

 

[Broberg Speed]

It’s possible I suppose but the same logic could be applied to the forwards as well. Maybe Foegele finds his groove, or Yamamoto.

I doubt Holland does anything until he sees what this group looks like under a new coach.

These players are young players who need to be guided. They play like chickens with their heads cut off. Real hockey clubs were licking their chops.

 

[Broberg Speed]

With what cap?

Obviously we will have to pay assets to gain cap relief. I don't have a problem with that if the right players are brought in. If Holland is going to try and snow us again with picks for garbage his legacy will be down the crapper. He's on his last straw.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Someone help me understand if Marchand will be able to play while appealing his suspension?
This is for fantasy purposes...I will take him out for the week if he isn't going to play. I just can't find good information on this.
Sorry, I know this is probably not the right thread for this. Wasn't sure where to put this

No. Players have gotten reduced suspensions in the past where they ended up missing more games than the appealed result

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

What's the Edmonton equivalent to that Calgary deal - 1st, Tullio, late pick, Turris?

Could you guys have done that?

Fixed.

And obviously no because the NHL instituted a salary cap like 15 years ago

 

[belair]

Certainly but the Oilers only have so many assets to “sell” to plug holes. It can’t be on another forward when the Def and Goaltending is in the state it’s in.

If they're looking at a player who isn't a rental, odds are they're probably looking at a forward.

That isn't to say the defense or the goaltending isn't something Holland considers. The market at those positions just isn't as deep, making quality far more difficult to come by.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

If they're looking at a player who isn't a rental, odds are they're probably looking at a forward.

That isn't to say the defense or the goaltending isn't something Holland considers. The market at those positions just isn't as deep, making quality far more difficult to come by.

They aren't going into the playoffs with rookies swapping in and out of the bottom pairing.

Would be shocked if depth dmen aren't on the top.of the list just under goalie.

 

[FlameChampion]

Seems kinda pointless for the flames to me. I dont see them getting past the Knights regardless. Least they get Toffolli for a couple years. Should of spent their assets on a center imo.

 

[North]

Seems kinda pointless for the flames to me. I dont see them getting past the Knights regardless. Least they get Toffolli for a couple years. Should of spent their assets on a center imo.

Well…if the lose Johnny for nothing in the off season they are going to need another winger. Granted Toffoli isn’t on Johnny’s level but they aren’t going to be able to afford anyone on that level especially if they have to pay Tkachuk and Mangiapane.

 

[Soundwave]

It's so difficult to see your point because your argument is always so negative when it comes to the team you seem to believe instantly becomes a contender the moment they trade for the goalie you're parading that day.

The Oilers are neck and neck with LA and Anaheim currently because they just went through a six and seven game losing skid prior to Tippett's firing. They're better than both of them. Anaheim is probably better off selling anyways.

The Oilers don't need their prospects to be gamechangers out of the gate. They need to be upgrades on the bottom six garbage the team has regularly iced in the McDavid era.

Adding a handful of guys that contribute 20 or so points without getting flattened at even strength will be an upgrade on the bottom six that regularly has its ass handed to it.

I'm not negative, the fact is the real world is a lot harsher than I am. I'm a teddy bear by comparison when you look at what actually happens (Tippett some how having the longest losing streak in team history, disaster December, Mike Smith injured in the third game of the season, behind LA at the half way point of the season ... this is more negative than the stuff I was saying at the start of the year ... I thought the Oilers would get at least 10-15 games out of Smith before injury lol, etc. etc.).

I'm more realistic and blunt. NHL is a harsher and more bitter reality.

They are not guaranteed to be better than Anaheim and LA unless their goaltending turns significantly as both of those teams have better goaltending and that renders most of the Oilers advantages over them void.

They should be better but because that is such an important position it evens the playing field between Edmonton, LA, and even Anaheim significantly. Never mind both of those teams probably also have better d corps.

Going from Kane to Holloway next year is likely a downgrade and I don't see a bunch of super talented AHLers coming in and contributing next year. Benson was a PPG in the AHL and he's doing what for the Oilers? *crickets*.

 

[belair]

They aren't going into the playoffs with rookies swapping in and out of the bottom pairing.

Would be shocked if depth dmen aren't on the top.of the list just under goalie.

I'm not suggesting that it'll be overlooked. But I'd expect something closer to a Kulikov (low-cost UFA rental) add than a permanent upgrade on D.

I actually agree a physical shutdown D should be high on the needs list. I just believe that you're not going to have a lot of 'quality' options that are going to require the majority of the team's assets to acquire. The same goes for goalie.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

I'm not suggesting that it'll be overlooked. But I'd expect something closer to a Kulikov (low-cost UFA rental) add than a permanent upgrade on D.

I actually agree a physical shutdown D should be high on the needs list. I just believe that you're not going to have a lot of 'quality' options that are going to require the majority of the team's assets to acquire. The same goes for goalie.

I still wonder about the cost for Giordano. I also question if they'd even trade him after giving him the C.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Fixed.

And obviously no because the NHL instituted a salary cap like 15 years ago

Purely from a value perspective, obviously. And we'd have the cap space if Kenny didn't go on a fire and urine bender this summer.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Purely from a value perspective, obviously. And we'd have the cap space if Kenny didn't go on a fire and urine bender this summer.

I just don't see the point in comparing a transaction that another team makes. It devalues capspace and the supply+demand principle. If more teams in the league could trade for Toffoli his price would have been higher.

Would we have traded a 6th for Fleury in the off-season? Would we have signed Panarin in free agency? What are doing here.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I just don't see the point in comparing a transaction that another team makes. It devalues capspace and the supply+demand principle. If more teams in the league could trade for Toffoli his price would have been higher.

Would we have traded a 6th for Fleury in the off-season? Would we have signed Panarin in free agency? What are doing here.

Trying to approximate a package from our end is valuable in the sense that it gives real-world perspective as to how our assets could be valued. It also gives perspective on how our spending this summer adversely affects our current position.

as for the bolded, considering a team *did* trade less than a 6th for Fleury by using the cap space we gifted them, it's worth asking if we would have been better off providing a landing spot for Fleury than taking Keith off their hands for full price.

The real question is - who is a Toffoli level defenseman or goalie on a bad team with term that we can target, and how do we make the money work? Varlamov? Graves?

 

[belair]

I'm not negative, the fact is the real world is a lot harsher than I am. I'm a teddy bear by comparison when you look at what actually happens (Tippett some how having the longest losing streak in team history, disaster December, Mike Smith injured in the third game of the season, behind LA at the half way point of the season ... this is more negative than the stuff I was saying at the start of the year ... I thought the Oilers would get at least 10-15 games out of Smith before injury lol, etc. etc.).

I'm more realistic and blunt. NHL is a harsher and more bitter reality.

They are not guaranteed to be better than Anaheim and LA unless their goaltending turns significantly as both of those teams have better goaltending and that renders most of the Oilers advantages over them void.

They should be better but because that is such an important position it evens the playing field between Edmonton, LA, and even Anaheim significantly. Never mind both of those teams probably also have better d corps.

Going from Kane to Holloway next year is likely a downgrade and I don't see a bunch of super talented AHLers coming in and contributing next year. Benson was a PPG in the AHL and he's doing what for the Oilers? *crickets*.

You're the guy who suggested it's a great idea to pony up a 1st round pick to take on Carey Price's contract citing his career stats in the playoffs. That isn't realism. That's pure fantasy.

The 2021/22 Edmonton Oilers are a very incomplete hockey team. We don't know what they are because there was a two month stretch where they significantly underperformed due to a number of factors. They're not in a position where it's a great idea to pay a premium price for a rental, regardless of the player. That's as cut and dry as it can be put.

When it comes to the team moving forward, Evander Kane is a nice bonus. He's a skilled compliment to the top six, but the team doesn't take a significant step back without him. Our top six has never been the problem other than the fact that they play a very irresponsible two-way game.

The problem of this team is the Derek Ryan, Devin Shore, Brendan Perlini, Kyle Turris, Gaetan Haas, Joakim Nygard, endless list of non-impact skaters that populate a bottom six that gets outscored like clockwork. It's not a stretch that Jay Woodcroft has a handful of players that he's had a hand in developing who are capable of outperforming the garbage depth options the team has routinely iced.

Competitive hockey teams don't rely solely on their scorers to win large stretches of games. Look at the team's that go deep every year and you'll see a dozen or so players capable of scoring 20-30 points over a full season. That's what depth is.

I don't expect any of those prospects to step in and be immediate high-end scorers. I've never suggested it. But I expect a handful of them to be better players than a Brendan Perlini or a Kyle Turris. I also expect that our current coach has a good idea of what those players are capable of.

 

[McDNicks17]

Looking forward to seeing Jacob Middleton tonight.

I don't know if San Jose would move him, but he'd be the perfect left D add.

 

[LTIR]

Seems kinda pointless for the flames to me. I dont see them getting past the Knights regardless. Least they get Toffolli for a couple years. Should of spent their assets on a center imo.

Flames are up there with Vegas in West. the same would apply to us. They are 1 pt back of Knights with 3 games in hand, 7pts up on us and on a 6 game win streak. Burning the 1st is far from pointless especially when the player is not even a rental.

 

[Soundwave]

You're the guy who suggested it's a great idea to pony up a 1st round pick to take on Carey Price's contract citing his career stats in the playoffs. That isn't realism. That's pure fantasy.

The 2021/22 Edmonton Oilers are a very incomplete hockey team. We don't know what they are because there was a two month stretch where they significantly underperformed due to a number of factors. They're not in a position where it's a great idea to pay a premium price for a rental, regardless of the player. That's as cut and dry as it can be put.

When it comes to the team moving forward, Evander Kane is a nice bonus. He's a skilled compliment to the top six, but the team doesn't take a significant step back without him. Our top six has never been the problem other than the fact that they play a very irresponsible two-way game.

The problem of this team is the Derek Ryan, Devin Shore, Brendan Perlini, Kyle Turris, Gaetan Haas, Joakim Nygard, endless list of non-impact skaters that populate a bottom six that gets outscored like clockwork. It's not a stretch that Jay Woodcroft has a handful of players that he's had a hand in developing who are capable of outperforming the garbage depth options the team has routinely iced.

Competitive hockey teams don't rely solely on their scorers to win large stretches of games. Look at the team's that go deep every year and you'll see a dozen or so players capable of scoring 20-30 points over a full season. That's what depth is.

I don't expect any of those prospects to step in and be immediate high-end scorers. I've never suggested it. But I expect a handful of them to be better players than a Brendan Perlini or a Kyle Turris. I also expect that our current coach has a good idea of what those players are capable of.

They're hard to get a read on because the GM sucks and didn't do his job in the summer leaving a glaring need in net which destroyed the team's confidence. Even he admits the blame should be on him.

I would also pump my breaks on the Oilers having multiple Oilers coming from Bakerfield being better than even Perlini.

Everything suggests Benson would be but he's really not and this is a player with years of development.

The D is shaky with several inexperienced D and the goaltending is unreliable and mentally the team checks out when they don't get big saves. Those are bigger issues than Derek Ryan. They even as is score enough goals, they just give them right back and then some.