Proposal: Trade Proposal Thread - The We're not done quite yet Edition

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Soltantgris

Registered User
May 31, 2010
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I would be very pissed if we lost Tinordi for nothing.

I can't see this happening in a thousand years. Even if habs staff are 100% sure he's a bust - he will still own some value on a trade basis (first pick, size, familly name). I suspect a lateral move if any.
 

Yoshidas Island

TY for the memories Yosh :'(
Jan 2, 2015
2,703
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I suspect MB will trade some assets before season opening, mostly waiver eligible players for younger project or picks. MB is not perfect, but dont waste asset. You guys can confirm if all these players are waiver stuff ?

Tinordi
Thomas
Ghetto
Bournival
Holloway
Dumont
Barberio

So habs have to clear waiver before to go to AHL ?

Here's the list good sir:
Tinordi, Holloway, Barberio, Pateryn, Dumont, Ellis, Thomas, Bournival
 

Soltantgris

Registered User
May 31, 2010
782
14
Thank ! Pretty happy Ghetto don't have to clear waiver. So i guess a Tinordi to Edmonton trade is pretty possible.
 

Mr. Hab

Registered User
Nov 17, 2004
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Montreal
Well I think we agree to disagree on JVR.

Also, I didn't mean to sound pessimistic, I do hope as well that all our pick ups will fulfill the expectations, but I do think that shouldn't stop us from looking for improvement.

I noticed you seem to be banking a lot on UFAs, which I admit has worked to our advantage in the past. However, you can't expect that most of them will still be available come deadline, or even by July 1st, depending on what you had in mind. And you have to consider the amount of money we'll have to give to whoever we end up choosing. Bear with me for bringing him up again, but the fact that JVR is on such a cheap contract is a blessing for a cap ceiling team like us. The UFAs you mentionned would likely cost about twice as much, probably more for Kopitar. That means less flexibility to improve down the road.

At this point we can't afford not going for the cup in any of the next three seasons, to answer your final question.

PART I!!:

I actually really want JVR in our top 6 (and I love that he's a LEFTIE)...I love his contract and potential on our team (better quality options/teammates in Mtl VS Toronto for JVR), but...(again!), but...not at any price (also: I'd rather deal with other teams...Toronto is not the only team in the NHL,etc). I don't really want to deal with Toronto and/or Boston, unless...we're clearly winning the deal or ripping them off!!

Three contracts I love for forwards...Pacioretty, Wayne Simmonds (rightie), and JVR (there are others, but those three are super). I do wish Simmonds was a LEFTIE instead of a RIGHTIE, since we have so many RIGHTIES (Gallagher, Weise, Semin, Kassian, DSP, etc, but...Semin and DSP can play on the LEFT side sometimes).

If Bergevin can get (either) Simmonds or JVR on a fair deal...I'm all for it, BUT...I'm definitely not for helping Toronto with a Juulsen+1st+more. Huge NO (if up to me). I trust Bergevin will always keep trying to improve our Habs AND also not do a crazy deal that might set us back (I really think Juulsen has VERY HIGH POTENTIAL...McDonagh/Bieksa potential...I want to keep that potential...unless we're talking about 5-6 seasons with JVR, but we're not... ; and yes we have to wait 2-3yrs+ for Juulsen, but we'll have him for 7-10yrs+ once he's a Hab... I'd rather look at our other trading chips, not Juulsen...I want a Byfuglien for now AND signed to 4-5 seasons for Juulsen+1st, nothing less, but...Byfuglien may be a UFA in 2016, so we can sign him, maybe, plus keep our Juulsen+1st...better choice!).

And...I don't know who is more important for our 2016 playoffs (if we can only choose one)...a top 3-4 playoff warrior dman OR a JVR/Wayne Simmonds' type player...? (both have great contracts, but JVR is a LEFTIE...we need more star LEFTIEs, but I wouldn't say no to Simmonds if we a fair tade can happen).

To UFA or not to UFA: I definitely know/realize that E.Staal or Kopitar or Byfuglien may not end up UFAs, but I'm crossing my fingers that most of them will (we only need one of 'em!! and a dman!!). And our Habs are way more enticing to UFAs compared to the pre-Subban/pre-Price days. So...UFA 2016 could be a really good one for us. Expensive...yes, but Mtl is top 3-5 in the NHL...21 273 fans at every game...money should not even be mentioned...we have it (Hab fans deserve some UFAs for spending so much on ludicrous Hab ticket prices/crazy expensive beer/jerseys/hats/pretzels,etc,etc!!). I love UFAs 'cause we can sign a star(s) AND keep our Juulsens, Scherbaks, McCarrons and our 1st+2nd rnd picks (best option for winning now and to continue winning later...). We just have to cross our fingers for a good 2016 UFA (July 1st) season for us...ONE star forward and ONE top3-4 playoff warrior dman. Time for us to make a BIG SPLASH in the UFA market (2016 and 2017)...we're due!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Mr. Hab

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Nov 17, 2004
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Montreal
Well I think we agree to disagree on JVR.

Also, I didn't mean to sound pessimistic, I do hope as well that all our pick ups will fulfill the expectations, but I do think that shouldn't stop us from looking for improvement.

I noticed you seem to be banking a lot on UFAs, which I admit has worked to our advantage in the past. However, you can't expect that most of them will still be available come deadline, or even by July 1st, depending on what you had in mind. And you have to consider the amount of money we'll have to give to whoever we end up choosing. Bear with me for bringing him up again, but the fact that JVR is on such a cheap contract is a blessing for a cap ceiling team like us. The UFAs you mentionned would likely cost about twice as much, probably more for Kopitar. That means less flexibility to improve down the road.

At this point we can't afford not going for the cup in any of the next three seasons, to answer your final question.

PART II!:

UFAs are expensive?: yes (maybe), but if we get a E.Staal or Kopitar or Byfuglien...you EASILY/GLADLY dump DD+Emelin (as one example). UFAs are expensive? DD+Emelin is way too expensive, imo. I'd rather spend that $$$ on a star forward or star top 3 playoff warrior dman. And, Mtl is more enticing...one or two star players may not ask for the whole bank to play for a contender (us!). We're a VERY strong contender (vs good contender) if we add a Byfuglien (foward/dman) or an E.Staal/Kopitar, and also if we add a playoff warrior top 3 dman.

And, if not for the 2016 UFA season, then...I just hope Bergevin can continue to improve our team without giving up too too much (it's possible!), especially giving up too much to teams like Toronto and Boston (actually...I don't want us giving up too much to any team! (ex: Rangers!), but seeing Juulsen do super well in a LEAF jersey would hurt too much...I don't want to trade with Toronto, period, unless...we're clearly robbing them!!).

Going for the CUP: too easy to get over-excited and want it all...NOW!! (me too, me too!!). But, better to evaluate...maybe wait (or not?) to go for it when 2-3 out of 5 of them are already Hab players (Hudon, McCarron, Scherbak, Lernout, Juulsen), or don't wait for any of them?! (go for it now/this season! waiting is too long?). HUDON may be ready for 2016 playoffs? SCHERBAK may need 1-2 AHL seasons? McCARRON may need 1-2 AHL seasons or less?? LERNOUT may need 2+ AHL seasons? JUULSEN may need 2-3+ more years...?

BIG QUESTION: when is the right time to go for it? (trade most of your trading chips??). Now/2016 season? 2017 season? 2018 season? or...the 2019 season?! If we have to wait till the 2019 or 2020 season I'm going to lose it!!

I can't stand all this waiting!! But it would be torture if Juulsen became a star dman for...Toronto!! I say go for the smart/safe trades this season (where we're not overpaying, ex: Jeff Petry... Vanek, and more smart/underrated trades a la Dale ''playoff warrior'' Weise!!, etc,etc) and also hope for the best for July 1st (UFA 2016). I'm going to predict...we're going to go for it (more) in 2017 or especially in 2018 or 2019!!!! (VS this season!)...'cause more of our prospects will be ready and we should have picked up some star UFA players. Hopefully all goes well!! But...with a healthy team (*knock on wood*) and a couple of smart/safe trades...we can go far this season (without selling our future).

Look at Boston...I really thought they were on their way to building a dynasty (Seguin...gone, Hamilton...gone)...a CUP is great (even though they cheated...Chara played while Pacioretty couldn't), but they could have had another one, imo. And look at Vancouver...made a big splash by making the CUP Finals, but lost to...Boston. I want to do this right (ex: Chicago...3 CUPS, or L.A....2 CUPS).

For this season...I'm expecting Conference Finals or Cup Finals (in a CUP Final with a healthy Price and Subban...anything can happen!!).

Cheers!!!!

Go Habs Go!!
(going for the CUP...the smart way!! playing it safe but not too safe! just a bit more patience should do it!!).




I would be very pissed if we lost Jarred Tinordi for nothing.

I would be really pissed, as well. It's a long, long season...injuries can happen and we may need Tinordi more than we think (ex: if lefties like Beaulieu, Emelin get injured). And, Tinordi (at worst) has great PK potential. I still think (long-term) he can be a good partner to Subban. Hal Gill was a good partner to Subban in the past...Tinordi can do it, too, imo. With Tinordi...a lot of it has to do with confidence...watch out when he finds his confidence...watch out.
 
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Rapala

Registered User
Mar 29, 2013
39,419
35,014
Montreal
I'm wondering why Kessel and JVR keep getting brought up in this thread?
There is/was zero chance we were/are landing either.
In what parallel universe do the Leafs trade us a piece that could possibly put us "Over the Top"?
They would never hear the end of it from their fan base...

Does anyone here think the Roy deal goes down if the Avalanche were still the Nordiques.
 

phoque taupe

Registered User
May 15, 2010
2,167
0
Montréal
well, they did trade a few first picks to a rival...

LUCKILY, boston did worst assets management

TOR-BOS isnt MTL-BOS (but TOR-MTL rivalry exist only in leafs fan heads ;)
but still, sometimes it happens, depends how feel the GMs
 

Takeru

Registered User
Oct 6, 2014
2,214
739
PART II!:

UFAs are expensive?: yes (maybe), but if we get a E.Staal or Kopitar or Byfuglien...you EASILY/GLADLY dump DD+Emelin (as one example). UFAs are expensive? DD+Emelin is way too expensive, imo. I'd rather spend that $$$ on a star forward or star top 3 playoff warrior dman. And, Mtl is more enticing...one or two star players may not ask for the whole bank to play for a contender (us!). We're a VERY strong contender (vs good contender) if we add a Byfuglien (foward/dman) or an E.Staal/Kopitar, and also if we add a playoff warrior top 3 dman.

And, if not for the 2016 UFA season, then...I just hope Bergevin can continue to improve our team without giving up too too much (it's possible!), especially giving up too much to teams like Toronto and Boston (actually...I don't want us giving up too much to any team! (ex: Rangers!), but seeing Juulsen do super well in a LEAF jersey would hurt too much...I don't want to trade with Toronto, period, unless...we're clearly robbing them!!).

Going for the CUP: too easy to get over-excited and want it all...NOW!! (me too, me too!!). But, better to evaluate...maybe wait (or not?) to go for it when 2-3 out of 5 of them are already Hab players (Hudon, McCarron, Scherbak, Lernout, Juulsen), or don't wait for any of them?! (go for it now/this season! waiting is too long?). HUDON may be ready for 2016 playoffs? SCHERBAK may need 1-2 AHL seasons? McCARRON may need 1-2 AHL seasons or less?? LERNOUT may need 2+ AHL seasons? JUULSEN may need 2-3+ more years...?

BIG QUESTION: when is the right time to go for it? (trade most of your trading chips??). Now/2016 season? 2017 season? 2018 season? or...the 2019 season?! If we have to wait till the 2019 or 2020 season I'm going to lose it!!

I can't stand all this waiting!! But it would be torture if Juulsen became a star dman for...Toronto!! I say go for the smart/safe trades this season (where we're not overpaying, ex: Jeff Petry... Vanek, and more smart/underrated trades a la Dale ''playoff warrior'' Weise!!, etc,etc) and also hope for the best for July 1st (UFA 2016). I'm going to predict...we're going to go for it (more) in 2017 or especially in 2018 or 2019!!!! (VS this season!)...'cause more of our prospects will be ready and we should have picked up some star UFA players. Hopefully all goes well!! But...with a healthy team (*knock on wood*) and a couple of smart/safe trades...we can go far this season (without selling our future).

Look at Boston...I really thought they were on their way to building a dynasty (Seguin...gone, Hamilton...gone)...a CUP is great (even though they cheated...Chara played while Pacioretty couldn't), but they could have had another one, imo. And look at Vancouver...made a big splash by making the CUP Finals, but lost to...Boston. I want to do this right (ex: Chicago...3 CUPS, or L.A....2 CUPS).

For this season...I'm expecting Conference Finals or Cup Finals (in a CUP Final with a healthy Price and Subban...anything can happen!!).

Cheers!!!!

Go Habs Go!!
(going for the CUP...the smart way!! playing it safe but not too safe! just a bit more patience should do it!!).

Just so you know I've taken the time to read both your posts but I won't quote both of them to avoid using up too much space.

I get that you don't want to see Juulsen succeed in the Leafs uniform, I would hate it as well but I'm probably less involved than you when it comes to them, only team I don't want to deal with are the Bruins.

I don't think we need to improve our defense that much before playoffs, with Petry we're looking pretty solid, considering there's not enough room for three of our NHL ready young Dmen. That's why we're looking to find a way to improve our offense, I agree with you there probably are other players than JVR, though Simmonds probably won't come for cheap either.

All in all, it's been fun debating this with you.

Cheers and enjoy the season! :cheers:
 

yianik

Registered User
Jun 30, 2009
10,681
6,133
A Juulsen+1st+B prospect for JVR would be a very fair trade for us. If you don't want to make it because you want to see where we are at offensively given the changes made, or don't want to give up Juulsen because you think he is needed in our pool of prospects that is fine, but that would not be an overpayment by us. JVR is in his prime, good for 25 or so goals and has a sweet contract as already stated, for the next few years.
 

Habs 4 Life

No Excuses
Mar 30, 2005
41,027
4,814
Montreal
Desharnais is 10 times the player Ruutu is.

And neither player is needed going forward. You make the deal so we can get rid of DD going forward and having extra cash next summer

If DD finds himself on the 3rd line like he should with no pp time, his point production will drop and he won't be 10x the player Ruutu is!
 

danyhabsfan

Registered User
Feb 12, 2007
8,224
3,036
Montreal
My point is we could send Ruutu down if things dont work and play Hudon, Scherbak, Thomas, Holloway..

We can bury up to 950 000$ on the cap. Enough to pay one of those kid.

Let Eller play center and give a kid like Hudon a chance to play.


Next year Ruutu's contract is off the book anyway.
 

Habs 4 Life

No Excuses
Mar 30, 2005
41,027
4,814
Montreal
My point is we could send Ruutu down if things dont work and play Hudon, Scherbak, Thomas, Holloway..

We can bury up to 950 000$ on the cap. Enough to pay one of those kid.

Let Eller play center and give a kid like Hudon a chance to play.


Next year Ruutu's contract is off the book anyway.

We don't even have to send him down, just like Gonchar he can sit in the press box. We have the money and the hole point like you said it's for next summer/season that we want the cash for anyways.
 

Rapala

Registered User
Mar 29, 2013
39,419
35,014
Montreal
well, they did trade a few first picks to a rival...

LUCKILY, boston did worst assets management

TOR-BOS isnt MTL-BOS (but TOR-MTL rivalry exist only in leafs fan heads ;)
but still, sometimes it happens, depends how feel the GMs

Ummm no rivalry there...
Even though they are both our rivals.
TO/OTT is a bigger rivalry IMO
 

Lebowski

El Duderino
Dec 5, 2010
17,585
5,218
We were starving for offense last season. Like him or not, trading a skilled offensive player such as Desharnais for the sake of it isn't the type of move I'd be looking for.

I still expect Desharnais to do great if he ends up on Eller's LW on the 3rd line.
 

danyhabsfan

Registered User
Feb 12, 2007
8,224
3,036
Montreal
We don't even have to send him down, just like Gonchar he can sit in the press box. We have the money and the hole point like you said it's for next summer/season that we want the cash for anyways.

Yes we could but he would still take a roster spot on our roster.
 

Milhouse40

Registered User
Aug 19, 2010
22,121
24,710
We were starving for offense last season. Like him or not, trading a skilled offensive player such as Desharnais for the sake of it isn't the type of move I'd be looking for.

I still expect Desharnais to do great if he ends up on Eller's LW on the 3rd line.

The main problem isn't Desharnais itself.....Therrien is simply dumb when it comes to DD and will switch everything up just to accomodate
him. That wouldn't happen if we trade him for a Ruutu or a Elias. And they both filled a whole on the LW
 
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