Post-Game Talk: Trade Deadline Day 2017

tigervixxxen

Optimism=Delusional
Jul 7, 2013
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I don't think that's true. I think there will be a few more teams willing to part with top 4 D, that weren't this year because they didn't want to hurt their playoff run. Next year they'll have prospects and UFA's to replace whatever D they give away.

As Friedman notes as well, GM's will get more desperate after they lose this year. Teams that thought they had enough scoring to do something, and then find out they don't, might decide to pursue Duchene stronger.

The offseason is the time for building your team much more so than the trade deadline.

This is all what they say but I don't buy it. I get the not wanting to move out a roster player on a payoff team but that's not going to be easy as they act like it is over the summer either. It's not like top 4 D is replaceable to them then. The Avs sniffed around for a deal last summer too, there should have been these desperate teams lining up then but didn't.
 

Freudian

Clearly deranged
Jul 3, 2003
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My guess is other teams expected Sakic to cave and when it didn't happen it was too late. If it was a chicken race, it ended in a draw.

There is a reason we saw all these leaks to media in the last weeks. Interest was there but they wanted to fleece Avs.

Not the worst outcome for Avs. Now the other teams know Sakic doesn't flinch and have to act accordingly.
 

EdAVSfan

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This is all what they say but I don't buy it. I get the not wanting to move out a roster player on a payoff team but that's not going to be easy as they act like it is over the summer either. It's not like top 4 D is replaceable to them then. The Avs sniffed around for a deal last summer too, there should have been these desperate teams lining up then but didn't.

Most teams probably also have 7 forwards they want to protect and don't have the extra slots.

Considering the avs we're looking for the dman as the biggest piece, it might've been harder to also move a roster forward because those players might've had too much value.

What we do know is that the movement at the deadline was very lacklustre. It's been said that the ED played a role. As did the stagnant cap.
 

AslanRH

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Shouldn't that second not get taken out of is it now instead? I really don't get it, how else was the trade supposed to have worked out? And the whole the market is going to be so much better is crap too, nobody wants to give up top 4 D either now or then.

I don't totally agree here.

Between expansion, limited cap space in-season, and as mentioned above, wider prospect and FA options, as well as more teams in the running as playoff teams are more likely to shuffle the cards a bit, I would expect the market to be at least as good if not better in the offseason.

My concern is that what could hurt value is that Duchene will be in that awkward window where he is close to UFA but too far away to talk and sign an extension. I think that will still hurt with teams like the Canes who probably can't make the big move without some sense it is for more than 2 years.
 

Tweaky

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So as soon as teams get eliminated, they can start trading, right?

So when Montreal gets swept in the first round, scoring a total of 3 goals....they will be ready to offer up Serg+++?
 

Sakics Snowblower

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Aug 16, 2011
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We could see a team that acquires one of the big UFA d-mem (Alzer/Shattenkirk/Kulikov/whoever else ends up getting overpaid this summer suddenly) feel like they can part with a top 4 d roster/prospect after injecting a shiny new UFA. We know the Rangers are where Shattenkirk is going to go, and I don't see them as afit for Duchene.

The problem with this scenario is that the teams with the most interest in Duchene (NYI, Montreal, Ottawa) probably arent going to be chasing UFA defencemen like Alzner and Kulikov. Oh well.
 

falconski

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Jan 21, 2008
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So as soon as teams get eliminated, they can start trading, right?

So when Montreal gets swept in the first round, scoring a total of 3 goals....they will be ready to offer up Serg+++?

teams can trade now, just whoever they acquire can't play in the playoffs
 

tigervixxxen

Optimism=Delusional
Jul 7, 2013
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Most teams probably also have 7 forwards they want to protect and don't have the extra slots.

Considering the avs we're looking for the dman as the biggest piece, it might've been harder to also move a roster forward because those players might've had too much value.

What we do know is that the movement at the deadline was very lacklustre. It's been said that the ED played a role. As did the stagnant cap.

I don't think these things have zero factor but it's been trumped up way too much from the media as an excuse. A million things are always supposed to happen at the next checkpoint and then they don't. It's as much of a ploy to keep them relevant as anything.

If anything, as I said the other day, it's that adding vets doesn't move the needle like it used to and teams value their futures more. Everyone said this draft sucks, picks are going to go like candy and what two firsts moved and by the two teams with the best record in the league, which project to be pick #30 and #31?

A few moves were obviously expansion related but as a reason for not bringing in pending UFAs? That's completely irrelevant to expansion. I could see teams holding on to a few marginal guys with term to satisfy the requirements so that should have made the market thinner on those who were available.

But specifically to Duchene, a team is not going to bring him in because they have to keep their 7th best forward? Or not like they couldn't put a marginal forward in the deal? If it's that critical I can see them wait until after the XD but I don't think it's what's holding up a deal.

We could see a team that acquires one of the big UFA d-mem (Alzer/Shattenkirk/Kulikov/whoever else ends up getting overpaid this summer suddenly) feel like they can part with a top 4 d roster/prospect after injecting a shiny new UFA. We know the Rangers are where Shattenkirk is going to go, and I don't see them as afit for Duchene.

The problem with this scenario is that the teams with the most interest in Duchene (NYI, Montreal, Ottawa) probably arent going to be chasing UFA defencemen like Alzner and Kulikov. Oh well.

Problem with that is that's after the draft. Not that it would be a giant problem to get all 2018 picks but the excuse for nothing happening after July 1 is that all the money is dried up and it's the flat cap blah blah.

And right, if teams could find a replacement top 4 D lying around then the Avs could too and then they wouldn't have to make this sort of deal. There's a slim few that have a surplus but they have other issues to work through.
 

Nalens Oga

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One of the nice things about Duchene not being traded yet is that him and Landeskog (and Barrie?) can be moved for 2018 1st round picks if they make the moves a bit later. The 1st round of the 2018 draft is supposedly going to be significantly better so it would be pretty amazing to go into that draft with four 1st rounders. If two of the four end up being hits then that would go a long way in addition to whatever other prospects come in those deals.

Also, apparently the Wild can't protect both Dumba and Brodin. I fully expect to see the Duchene for Brodin+ proposals soon :laugh::naughty:
 

henchman21

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I don't think these things have zero factor but it's been trumped up way too much from the media as an excuse. A million things are always supposed to happen at the next checkpoint and then they don't. It's as much of a ploy to keep them relevant as anything.

If anything, as I said the other day, it's that adding vets doesn't move the needle like it used to and teams value their futures more. Everyone said this draft sucks, picks are going to go like candy and what two firsts moved and by the two teams with the best record in the league, which project to be pick #30 and #31?

A few moves were obviously expansion related but as a reason for not bringing in pending UFAs? That's completely irrelevant to expansion. I could see teams holding on to a few marginal guys with term to satisfy the requirements so that should have made the market thinner on those who were available.

But specifically to Duchene, a team is not going to bring him in because they have to keep their 7th best forward? Or not like they couldn't put a marginal forward in the deal? If it's that critical I can see them wait until after the XD but I don't think it's what's holding up a deal.



Problem with that is that's after the draft. Not that it would be a giant problem to get all 2018 picks but the excuse for nothing happening after July 1 is that all the money is dried up and it's the flat cap blah blah.

And right, if teams could find a replacement top 4 D lying around then the Avs could too and then they wouldn't have to make this sort of deal. There's a slim few that have a surplus but they have other issues to work through.

There are potentially 4 firsts traded (2 for sure, 2 conditional), 11+ 2nd rounders that will transfer, and more than that for 3rd rounders. About 30% of the first 3 rounds has been moved already, and we haven't reached draft day. Not sure what you expect, but 30% is a lot this far before the draft.
 

InjuredChoker

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Dec 25, 2011
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There are potentially 4 firsts traded (2 for sure, 2 conditional), 11+ 2nd rounders that will transfer, and more than that for 3rd rounders. About 30% of the first 3 rounds has been moved already, and we haven't reached draft day. Not sure what you expect, but 30% is a lot this far before the draft.

at the deadline, it sure seemed teams were more picky about losing picks than in recent years, save for 2014.

i'd assume those numbers include trades made way back, not just at TDL.
 

hockeyfish

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Feb 23, 2007
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Like most things, it was probably a combination of all the above.

But looking ahead, I expect the league to have a very very busy summer. I'm especially eyeing the few days between the buyout period start (June 15th) and roster set for expansion (june 17th) as being quite chaotic.

Speaking of, rosters for expansion have to be set on the 17th, but Vegas doesn't submit their picks until I think the 20th. I'd assume the league will have to set some sort of trade freeze during that time.
 

Ivan13

Not posting anymore
May 3, 2011
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So as soon as teams get eliminated, they can start trading, right?

So when Montreal gets swept in the first round, scoring a total of 3 goals....they will be ready to offer up Serg+++?

Everyone can trade right now, it's just that the players traded can't appear in playoff games. Every year a minor trade appears and everyone loses their mind on the main boards asking how is that legal.
 

Bubba Thudd

is getting banned
Jul 19, 2005
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Everyone can trade right now, it's just that the players traded can't appear in playoff games. Every year a minor thread appears and everyone loses their mind on the main boards asking how is that legal.

I thought that players traded after the TDL cannot play at all the rest of the season.
 

Cousin Eddie

You Serious Clark?
Nov 3, 2006
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I thought that players traded after the TDL cannot play at all the rest of the season.

Nope. Just the playoffs I'm pretty sure. If Sakic wants to trade Duchene for Hanifin right now both players can play out the season with their new team.
 

Bubba Thudd

is getting banned
Jul 19, 2005
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Nope. Just the playoffs I'm pretty sure. If Sakic wants to trade Duchene for Hanifin right now both players can play out the season with their new team.

I learned something new today.
I call that a successful day.
Gonna pack it up and head home now, while I'm ahead.
 

McMetal

Writer of Wrongs
Sep 29, 2015
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I think the ED played a big factor is nobody being willing to move 2017 1st rounders. Quick replacements for the players lost are going to be a really valuable commodity, and even if this draft isn't brimming with top tier talent, most of the first round is pretty "safe" talent. High ceilings are nice, but GMs placed a premium on safe bets to adequately replace what they lose in a year or two. And even fewer want to miss out on the 2018 bounty. Only Washington, who could care less about the future right now, was in a position to send away that insurance piece. Minnesota I don't think is as strong a team as they think they are, but I can see why they felt it was time to go all in for a run after years of playoff failure and a great regular season.
 

McMetal

Writer of Wrongs
Sep 29, 2015
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That's just how you build a team in the modern NHL. None of those picks are going to fill holes immediately if someone gets taken in the XD.

No, but faster is better. A 2018 late 1st will have a similar timetable. 2017 gets them the fastest start on developing.
 

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