Proposal: TOR-MTL (Weber)

[kihei]

We want one of your best players. You can have absolutely anything from us that we don't need.

 

[bluedevil58]

As an outsider. Isn't Weber still consider an elite defensemen or did something happen to him?

 

[AcerComputer]

replace brown/kapanen with nylander/marner and you have the value but still dont see habs doing it, because whats the point of being loaded up front with D that totally sucks? you end up getting swept first round by Boston, although maybe with Price its possible to advance a little farther.

Laughable. It would have taken at least Sergachev to get one of those two, and you already traded him away for a lesser forward.

 

[brock0791]

lol wut

weber is still a pretty solid dman...he's not beign moved for a bunch of nothing

Weber is at best breakeven value with that contract. Unless Karlsson and Doughty are fetching over 10m giving up much in way of assets for Weber is crazy. What kind of vacuum do you live in?

 

[brock0791]

The discrepancy regarding Kapanen's value when it's as a trade asset vs. what they think of him in GDT threads is comical

 

[HuGo Sham]

As an outsider. Isn't Weber still consider an elite defensemen or did something happen to him?

nothing happened to him. fans of other teams negotiating his value down

 

[HuGo Sham]

Weber is at best breakeven value with that contract. Unless Karlsson and Doughty are fetching over 10m giving up much in way of assets for Weber is crazy. What kind of vacuum do you live in?

apparently the same vacuum you live in, but you know, as a non-hab fan

 

[bluedevil58]

Ok as an outsider. I of the opinion getting a true #1 dman doesn't come cheap. Jones for Johansen as an example. Pretty ridiculous what I am seeing purposed.

 

[rent free]

Nylander and 2nd for Webber.

hanafin and a 2nd for weber

 

[brock0791]

apparently the same vacuum you live in, but you know, as a non-hab fan

So Weber 33-40 year old seasons at a 7.8m cap hit plus a 1st and more assets is better value than Doughty's 30-38 year old seasons at a 10m cap hit?

 

[LPHabsFan]

The only thing that's clear in this thread is that people really don't understand the Weber contract one bit.

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

And he could also be bad in another year or so and then you can't get out of the contract at which point "only" 6 years to go.

1st is good
Bracco/Nielsen/Leivo -I mean depending on what you want to gamble on. Bracco for example has been around PT/Game for sometime in the AHL, recent 2nd rounder
Kapanen/Brown - Young middle 6 wingers that will likely give you around 20 goals if they got top 9 ice time
Zaitsev- 2nd/3rd pairing RD
Martin - yes, cap dump - his term is lesser then Shaw though - only produced 8 less points then Shaw as well in the same GP and zero PP time

What else are you expecting? Weber's contract *could* look bad anytime now (again, I am willing to risk it, but it is considered a risk for a reason), Shaw (1m retained) and Deslaurier are not exactly assets that you have the entire league out to acquire.

How about De la Rose + Benn + Rychel for Matthews. With the way Matthews is playing in the playoffs, leafs won't win anything with him. Might as well trade him, and try to get Jack Hughes next year.

Why will he be an anchor in 2 years?

He won't be, but OP said he will.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Ok as an outsider. I of the opinion getting a true #1 dman doesn't come cheap. Jones for Johansen as an example. Pretty ridiculous what I am seeing purposed.

How many 33 year old #1 centres are under contract for 8 million for another 8 years?

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

We need some solid blue liners, but Weber is not the answer for us with his contract. Wonder if there will be another purge of bad contracts like there was with previous CBA.

There is really much to done this summer. Good Dman are just so expensive to obtain and the Leafs really don't the cap to obtain big long term contracts this year, without sending money back. Summer of 2019 might be he best time for the Leafs to look at the UFA situation when they will be "lots" of UFA available (unless they are resigned early).
I know the Leafs defence has looked bad in the past two games, but most teams wish their bottom end Dman were better. If Reilly, Zaitsev, Gardiner, Hainsey Dermot just play to their capabilites, Leafs defence should be OK next year. And I like Borgman for the Leafs next year.

 

[sharks9]

None of this really addresses any needs for the Habs and there aren't any great future pieces for us to rebuild with.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

None of this really addresses any needs for the Habs and there aren't any great future pieces for us to rebuild with.

I guess you could argue that Weber who has nine years left on his contact is part of the future of the Habs.

 

[Liferleafer]

We could lose the next 2 games in the exact same fashion, and i still wouldn't offer top value for Weber.

 

[Kraken Jokes]

As an outsider. Isn't Weber still consider an elite defensemen or did something happen to him?

Yes. Everywhere except here on HF Trades and Andrew Berkshire's Twitter account.

 

[Spazkat]

Ok as an outsider. I of the opinion getting a true #1 dman doesn't come cheap. Jones for Johansen as an example. Pretty ridiculous what I am seeing purposed.

You are failing to take contracts into account in your valuations.

Shea Weber signed for another 2 years or so would have value. He is nowhere near what he used to be and the changing landscape of the NHL has made his lack of mobility a bigger liability than years past, but he still has his shot and is solid in netfront defense. Soon to be 33 year old Shea Weber signed for another 8 years with an 8 million dollar cap hit has considerably less value (if any). The things in his game that are problematic now are the type of thing that will only be exacerbated by aging, and playing only 20 something games this year now raise additional injury concerns.

Nobody is taking on that albatross of a contract plus Shaw as a cap dump (so adding 12M in cap) and giving up a ton of value... especially if all you're willing to take back are ELC players

 

[bluedevil58]

You are failing to take contracts into account in your valuations.

Shea Weber signed for another 2 years or so would have value. He is nowhere near what he used to be and the changing landscape of the NHL has made his lack of mobility a bigger liability than years past, but he still has his shot and is solid in netfront defense. Soon to be 33 year old Shea Weber signed for another 8 years with an 8 million dollar cap hit has considerably less value (if any). The things in his game that are problematic now are the type of thing that will only be exacerbated by aging, and playing only 20 something games this year now raise additional injury concerns.

Nobody is taking on that albatross of a contract plus Shaw as a cap dump (so adding 12M in cap) and giving up a ton of value... especially if all you're willing to take back are ELC players

I understand that. The contract isn't ideal. 7.8m until 2026. I also think it's worth noting Chris Chelios was a very effective NHL dman well into his 40s. So there is that too. No easy answer unless the Habs eat some of that contract in a trade.

 

[Spirit of 67]

No, no, no, a million times, no.

 

[Spazkat]

I understand that. The contract isn't ideal. 7.1m until 2026. I also think it's worth noting Chris Chelios was an effective NHL dman well into his 40s. So there is that too.

Yes some defensemen play into their 40's (Chara). The vast majority of them do not. Especially when they are showing obvious signs of decline in their early 30's. Worth noting that teams are most certainly not lining up to pay players of that age #1D money either.

Also, his contract is for 7.8 not 7.1

 

[Magic Man]

Ok as an outsider. I of the opinion getting a true #1 dman doesn't come cheap. Jones for Johansen as an example. Pretty ridiculous what I am seeing purposed.

If we had a 33 year old #1C on max term at 8M, you may be right. Feel free to scour the league looking for one. I thought Montreal was planning to rebuild personally.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

Ridiculously long contracts aren't as big of a deal as everybody thinks. It's as easy as saying, "I'm allergic to my gear."

 

[ole ole]

Not looking to go nuclear here by trading a bunch of core pieces but think that the Leafs might want to look at what is available to tweak the roster this summer. Wanting to throw this out there and see what needs to be done, if anything to alter it.

Leafs 1st (2018)
Brown/Kapanen - Habs choice
Martin (cap)
Bracco/Nielsen - Habs choice
Zaitsev (replacement RHD - equals out term)


for

Weber (no retention)
Shaw (1M retention)
Deslauriers

Rationale for the retention was Martin's contract ends sooner but it has been out there previously that Montreal was looking to maybe move on from his contract. I'm probably more into acquiring Weber then most Leaf fans so they might not necessarily be into the move but they can start their own thread

All that being said, yay/nay/tweak ?

If you want Weber be prepared something of value not the crap your offering.