Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo: Part V

[Oscar Lindberg]

He was clearly injured, like others have said I don’t think you can look much into his play this series, outside of the fact that he makes boneheaded plays and his defense stinks

But we already knew both of those things, so this is nothing new

Anyone using this series as a baseline for whether or not he should be traded is foolish

 

[DanielBrassard]

He was clearly injured, like others have said I don’t think you can look much into his play this series, outside of the fact that he makes boneheaded plays and his defense stinks

But we already knew both of those things, so this is nothing new

Anyone using this series as a baseline for whether or not he should be traded is foolish

Agreed, and as depressing as the series was that should apply to the rest of the team as well.

 

[CaptTennille]

Larry saying Tony was nursing a hamstring injury.

 

[ThreeOfAPerfectPair]

What kind of contract do you think he'll command? Also, possible that he's available for trade?

 

[eco's bones]

What kind of contract do you think he'll command? Also, possible that he's available for trade?

The Rangers will probably qualify him in the 3's and he and his agent will come back in the 6's and take it to arbitration. At that point the two parties will either work out a deal with some term length that might end up in the 5's or if it actually is arbitrated I think Tony gets his 6 or 6+ but since Tony took the Rangers to arbitration it will be the Rangers deciding if it's for one or two years. And yeah there is some chance that the Rangers will trade him.

 

[Kupo]

The Rangers will probably qualify him in the 3's and he and his agent will come back in the 6's and take it to arbitration. At that point the two parties will either work out a deal with some term length that might end up in the 5's or if it actually is arbitrated I think Tony gets his 6 or 6+ but since Tony took the Rangers to arbitration it will be the Rangers deciding if it's for one or two years. And yeah there is some chance that the Rangers will trade him.

Sticky this.

Sadly, as much as I love ADA, I feel he’ll price himself out of NY. That’s why having guys like Fox, and hopefully Lundkvist is imperative in the cap world.

You’re not being bent-over during negotiations and ultimately forced into re-upping a player at terms you’re uncomfortable with.

You take Fox out of the picture, and ADA becomes a longterm investment with NMC’s. You’re also locking in a young player lacking a long resume at a 36M contract.

If I was making a guaranteed 300K a year at 24-25, lol.. Let’s just say I wouldn’t have worked as hard as possible during a lot of those years.

I feel keeping that carrot In front of those younger players makes them work that much harder for their inevitable pay-day.

 

[eco's bones]

Sticky this.

Sadly, as much as I love ADA, I feel he’ll price himself out of NY. That’s why having guys like Fox, and hopefully Lundkvist is imperative in the cap world.

You’re not being bent-over during negotiations and ultimately forced into re-upping a player at terms you’re uncomfortable with.

You take Fox out of the picture, and ADA becomes a longterm investment with NMC’s. You’re also locking in a young player lacking a long resume at a 36M contract.

If I was making a guaranteed 300K a year at 24-25, lol.. Let’s just say I wouldn’t have worked as hard as possible during a lot of those years.

I feel keeping that carrot In front of those younger players makes them work that much harder for their inevitable pay-day.

It's a flat cap world for at least three years too--which also means looking at the contracts you have now and looking at the contracts you will be dealing with in the next 2/3 years because if you don't have the room for next year after you get done signing this year's free agents you've kind of painted yourself into a corner. Now after next year Shattenkirk more than less is off the books along with Staal, Smith and Henrik will be gone either this year or next--so there's going to be money coming off the books but we also have a Zibanejad deal to look at fairly soon and Fox, Shesterkin and Kakko--some of these guys Rangers management might want to lock up in their second contracts but will be forced to qualify.

In Tony's case there is Nils Lundkvist to think about as well. He was a force in the SHL last year as a 19 year old. Some people don't like Trouba but Jacob is a hard guy to play against and he takes more than his share of the situational stuff--defensive assignments against other teams better players, penalty killing etc. The Rangers absolutely need someone like him on RD. His size/strength component is important--DeAngelo, Fox, Lundkvist all under 6' puck movers with shared similarities and IMO our problem isn't so much scoring goals--it's getting better defensively. When we figure that part out we're going to start moving up in the standings.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

6m/y would be too much. I hope the ADA camp is realistic with this. Needs a bridge deal, his next contract after that one should be his "pay-day".

Hoping for a bridge deal 4-5m/y.

 

[eco's bones]

6m/y would be too much. I hope the ADA camp is realistic with this. Needs a bridge deal, his next contract after that one should be his "pay-day".

Hoping for a bridge deal 4-5m/y.

Keeping in mind that the Rangers lowballed Tony (and Lemieux) at $925K last year I could easily see his agent pushing to get as much as possible. Technically 53 points in 68 games isn't 60 points but it easily pro rates that way and I expect they'll be looking at the salaries of comparable defensemen. There's a bit of gamesmanship that goes into all this arbitrating thing that can easily turn into hurt feelings on the player's side and a while back the Rangers walked away from Zherdev after they didn't like the arbitrator's ruling. I don't think that happens here but there is the potential for the Rangers to move him.

 

[True Blue]

6m/y would be too much. I hope the ADA camp is realistic with this. Needs a bridge deal, his next contract after that one should be his "pay-day".

Hoping for a bridge deal 4-5m/y.

I think that is the price at which a long term deal can get done. Let's face it, not that many 24 year old defensemen that were going to 60 points. I would absolutely lock him up for 6 x $6. Ultimately, I think a deal gets done. But the length and frankly the possibility of him being traded will come with what his demand is.

 

[True Blue]

What kind of contract do you think he'll command? Also, possible that he's available for trade?

There is a market clearing rate for everything. But be prepared to give. In moving DeAngelo, the fans of the franchise to which is being traded to will need to say "ouch" to the price.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

His hockey IQ is actually really good offensively. Defensively he can be dumb sometimes but it’s mainly consistency issues. I guess I don’t see what you saw. He looked pretty good to me, despite looking a little slower. A couple bad decisions here and there, but very intelligent player like Fox also made bad decisions and had a worse game.

"A very intelligent player" is not a description I'd use for Anthony. I agree with 31, he relies on his skating to buy time and open things up, at least more so than a guy like Adam Fox who I think is more poised under pressure, has better peripheral vision and is just overall smarter with and without the pill.

 

[Chytilmania]

Tony has been consistently improving, who's to say he can't continue to get better? He's only 24 maybe he steps up his defense a bit.

 

[duhmetreE]

I think that is the price at which a long term deal can get done. Let's face it, not that many 24 year old defensemen that were going to 60 points. I would absolutely lock him up for 6 x $6. Ultimately, I think a deal gets done. But the length and frankly the possibility of him being traded will come with what his demand is.

I'd be all over 6x6 but I doubt he signs that. He will most likely be advised to sign a 2-3 year deal... Then hit UFA when things 'normalize' and the cap takes off.

 

[East Coast Bias]

If he wants 6x6 that's great. But I suspect he's going to go the Trouba route. just my opinion.

I'm sure the Rangers have a good read on it. If it's clear a player wants to bridge and get a big UFA contract, you might as well decide now what your plan is.

 

[True Blue]

If he wants 6x6 that's great. But I suspect he's going to go the Trouba route. just my opinion.

I'm sure the Rangers have a good read on it. If it's clear a player wants to bridge and get a big UFA contract, you might as well decide now what your plan is.

He is certainly not getting that type of contract next year. And he would really have it out of the park next year to even begin that conversation. There is also the decision that he will make if he wants to bet on himself again or sign a contract that gets him more money than he has dreamed of and STILL gets him to be a UFA again by the age of 30.

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

I personally don't think ADA will be a Ranger for a very long time. It all comes down to cap management, Fox and Trouba on the right side are the guys penciled in to the lineup and going nowhere. So paying your #3 RHD significant money doesn't make a lot of sense. He's a good fit on this team to put up points so losing him obviously hurts, but it helps the team more if they can improve the left side.

That said i think the Rangers would be dodging a bullet.. ADA gives me the same vibes as many dmen who ended up being career 3rd pairing + PP specialist types on good teams. You love em when they have their best years, then get reminded what the issues were.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

He's 24 years old, he probably is what he is at this point.

Great at offense, stinks at defense

 

[Raspewtin]

He's 24 years old, he probably is what he is at this point.

Great at offense, stinks at defense

Wouldn't say he stinks at defense, but it's not his strong suit. He's acceptable.

That's improvement, I guess?

 

[True Blue]

That said i think the Rangers would be dodging a bullet.. ADA gives me the same vibes as many dmen who ended up being career 3rd pairing + PP specialist types on good teams. You love em when they have their best years, then get reminded what the issues were.

What was the last 3rd pair defenseman that got you 60 points?

 

[True Blue]

He's 24 years old, he probably is what he is at this point.

Great at offense, stinks at defense

Agreed, but it does not mean that 1) he can still improve (to a realistic level) and 2) that it cannot be mitigated.

 

[Edge]

I'm not saying ADA is untouchable.

But the number of defenseman in the NHL capable of posting 60 points, and potentially doing it for the next 6-8 years, is pretty short.

If you can make a great deal, that's awesome.

But you don't move him for anything less than a return that has a serious, positive impact on your roster.

 

[Leetch3]

I'm not saying ADA is untouchable.

But the number of defenseman in the NHL capable of posting 60 points, and potentially doing it for the next 6-8 years, is pretty short.

If you can make a great deal, that's awesome.

But you don't move him for anything less than a return that has a serious, positive impact on your roster.

you definitely aren't going to replace him or improve from an offensive standpoint...and a huge question is how much he drove the offense vs benefit from playing with panarin/zibanajed. I think the common logic would be that he benefit from those guys, but against carolina ADA was hurt and couldn't skate and those guys were invisible offensively...coincidence? correlation?

but it should be understood and accepted that moving him will make us worse offensively from the RD, there is no doubt about that...but the question is does weakening an area of strength to strengthen an area of weakness make us better overall. with trouba's history and the potential of fox and lundkvist, the downgrade offensively is hopefully minimized but the question is how much you can upgrade those other areas...not to mention the debate of the value of a dman that scores less but is better defensively vs more points.

i personally love ADA and would be thrilled for him to be here long term...but looking at his point production is oversimplifying the situation imo

 

[Edge]

you definitely aren't going to replace him or improve from an offensive standpoint...and a huge question is how much he drove the offense vs benefit from playing with panarin/zibanajed. I think the common logic would be that he benefit from those guys, but against carolina ADA was hurt and couldn't skate and those guys were invisible offensively...coincidence? correlation?

but it should be understood and accepted that moving him will make us worse offensively from the RD, there is no doubt about that...but the question is does weakening an area of strength to strengthen an area of weakness make us better overall. with trouba's history and the potential of fox and lundkvist, the downgrade offensively is hopefully minimized but the question is how much you can upgrade those other areas...not to mention the debate of the value of a dman that scores less but is better defensively vs more points.

i personally love ADA and would be thrilled for him to be here long term...but looking at his point production is oversimplifying the situation imo

I think I'd be more concerned if he wasn't already trending this way before Panarin came here. Essentially he really started down this path the last quarter of the 2019 season.

While I think only looking at points is indeed overly-simple, I also think it's the age, the long-term value, the ability to do so from the right side, the edge he plays and the mindset he brings as well.

I do think ADA has demonstrated he can change the course of a game and drive a play. While I don't expect getting a point for point return with him, the return does have to provide an impact in other areas and balance out the roster.

 

[aufheben]

I'm not saying ADA is untouchable.

But the number of defenseman in the NHL capable of posting 60 points, and potentially doing it for the next 6-8 years, is pretty short.

If you can make a great deal, that's awesome.

But you don't move him for anything less than a return that has a serious, positive impact on your roster.

It’s such a danger to trade a player like DeAngelo. Remember this team traded Sergei Zubov when he was 24-years-old, and the dude went on to have a Hall of Fame career.