TNSE Efforts to Acquire an NHL Team Part IX

[Mungman]

A bit of a backgrounder on Chipman, a couple of tidbits further on with insight on the current standings of the deal.. continued at the link

http://sports.nationalpost.com/2011/05/27/anti-balsillie-winning-friends-in-winnipeg/


"Bob Silver had obviously heard the name. Most everyone in the province had. But 15 years ago, when he first met Mark Chipman in an effort to save the Winnipeg Jets, he did not know a whole lot about the person.

...

Ask prominent Manitoba businessmen to describe the potential NHL team owner and you get words like “modest,” “unassuming,” “low-key” and “shies away from the limelight.” Chipman is evidently not Jim Balsillie. Nor is he Eugene Melnyk, Charles Wang or Ted Leonsis, big personalities who seem to go out of their way to have their names and pictures in the newspaper.

...

Things such as trying to bring an NHL team back to his hometown. Chipman’s company, True North, is in negotiations to purchase and relocate the Atlanta Thrashers to Winnipeg. A deal is expected any day, although one report suggests it will not come before Tuesday.

For Chipman, that likely means a few extra days to attend his daughter’s hockey games.... "

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

Do you not go to ESPN or NFL boards? This happens all the time.

I doubt it's anywhere near the same level, though...

 

[tarheelhockey]

There is a chance that no effort was put into this year because the ownership group had determined the direction it was going in. My market something you don't intend to have around in the immediate future?

You're probably right about that. And it wouldn't be so offensive if they had taken responsibility for that decision.

But what did they do? They called out the fans for not filling the arena. They lied about their efforts to find a local owner. They claimed to be interested in a minority stake, which now appears to be patently false. They kept collecting checks from STHs with no hint that they were actively selling the team out of town. They maintained an illusion that they wanted things to work out in Atlanta, when in reality they were already committed to moving the team as soon as possible.

On top of their incompetence, there is also a large dose of cowardice in ASG.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Do you not go to ESPN or NFL boards? This happens all the time.

I don't know about the NFL boards, but the ESPN boards is nothing but trolls. All trolls all the time. I wouldn't take any opinion expressed there as an indicator of the person's real-life beliefs.

 

[Alex The Loyal]

Winnipeg will not command a lot of money in a local tv deal, and they will have virtually no national presence on HNIC other than perhaps their first game. They will be the Ottawa Senators of the West by the time they finish their first season.

I disagree. They might not get a lot of coverage with CBC, but TSN has been hyping the return of the Jets since Day 1. I would be shocked if TSN were to just completely ignore them.

Also, getting shown nationally every now and then on CBC and TSN, while also getting shown on Sportsnet West, is still far better than wht the Thrashers ever had

 

[Gump Hasek]

They lied about their efforts to find a local owner. They claimed to be interested in a minority stake, which now appears to be patently false.

They've long been for sale via an investment bank that has openly solicited offers. Both of your statements lack a basis in reality.

From NYPOST

Today the National Basketball Association has a 2009-10 champion, but for the Atlanta Hawks the real battle has just begun. The Atlanta Spirit, the group that controls the team, has put it on the block and, in recent days has started to solicit buyers for the franchise in a package with the Philips Arena where the team plays, according to sources with direct knowledge of the process.

The Spirit is also selling its Atlanta Thrashers franchise of the National Hockey League. The Hawks posted an operating loss of roughly $20 million last year before servicing debt. The Philips Arena made $10 million.

That means the package together is losing money, and if one bought the Hawks and tried to move them out of Atlanta it would trip a clause in the financing deal that would accelerate the remaining debt payments owed on the 11-year-old arena. So a buyer would likely need to keep them in town, sources said.

As for the Thrashers they are being sold separately and lost about $30 million in the last 12 month, according to figures compiled by the Spirit, the source said. The owners have hired the Raine Group, a New York investment bank, to sell the teams, which both just completed winning seasons.

This dilemma is part of a deeper problem the NBA faces in that its teams posted an overall loss of $400 million, according to Commissioner David Stern. At the same time, many of the team owners who were very rich have lost money in the recession and cannot afford to keep funding money-losing teams.

Owners too have a quickly depleting number of wealthy financiers to whom they can sell their teams.

For example, the money-losing New Jersey Nets searched 18 months for a buyer until they got lucky and found billionaire Russian Mikhail Prokhorov, the source said.
Another source in the sports business said, "There will be more foreclosures. In five years you'll have a lot fewer teams and buildings will go dark."

In other industries you would see mergers and cost cuts, but in sports salaries are fixed, the other source added. The Atlanta Spirit could not be reached for comment. In 2004, the group paid $250 million to buy the basketball and hockey teams, along with Phillips Arena, from Time Warner.

[email protected]

AJC story highlighting request for local partners...
http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-thrashers/owner-sense-of-urgency-840692.html

“The reality is we need fans showing up and we need investors, or a primary investor.”

 

[Koss]

Actually CBC showed less Leafs this year than they have in a long time. While still wildly popular across the country, there is a general feeling that Canadians are getting tired of watching perennial loser. Winnipeg may be coming into the market at just the right time for HNiC exposure. They will be popular across the country in their first season(s).

I live in Ontario and I will be trying to get tickets for a Winnipeg game as soon as they are available this season. I've never been to Manitoba and can't think of a better reason to visit the province this year.

 

[King Woodballs]

Actually CBC showed less Leafs this year than they have in a long time. While still wildly popular across the country, there is a general feeling that Canadians are getting tired of watching perennial loser. Winnipeg may be coming into the market at just the right time for HNiC exposure. They will be popular across the country in their first season(s).

I live in Ontario and I will be trying to get tickets for a Winnipeg game as soon as they are available this season. I've never been to Manitoba and can't think of a better reason to visit the province this year.

come join the party bro
always room for one more!

 

[tarheelhockey]

Both of your statements lack a basis in reality.

See below.

February, 2009

In countless meetings with ownership, never once have we expressed any interest in selling the Thrashers or moving the Thrashers.

June 18, 2010

As has been shared publicly for more than a year, we are interested in finding minority investors and have engaged a firm to assist us in that effort. We have no plans to move either team, and remain committed to the Hawks, the Thrashers, Philips Arena and the city of Atlanta

January 4, 2011

As we look to the second halves of the 2010-2011 NBA and NHL seasons, our goals remain the same as when we bought these teams: to bring Stanley Cups and NBA Championships to the fans in Atlanta.

And then the fans get hit with this...

Plaintiffs expected that once the new labor agreement was finalized [in 2005] there would be substantial interest from potential buyers and that they would be able to sell the franchise.

Plaintiffs inability to buy out Belkin’s interest in a timely manner and the resulting cloud on their title created by the Maryland litigation interfered with operation of the franchises and specifically prevented Plaintiffs from selling the Atlanta Thrashers [in 2005].

They had been actively trying to "sell or otherwise dispose of" the Thrashers for at least 6 years. Minority investors were not the goal. Nor were they seriously trying to locate local buyers, given the lease arrangement combined with their imposition of an exclusive negotiating period for the Hawks until after the deal with TNSE was announced. The local "search" was a sham, plain and simple. A formality to meet NHL guidelines for relocation.

I understand that these are emotionless business decisions that make sense to their bottom line. But, again, that doesn't excuse them from the cowardice they showed in the process.

 

[Grudy0]

To reiterate the NYPost inaccuracy, here is the link to that story with the refution statement from Gearon and Levenson:

Update: AJC wise guy Jeff Schultz weighed in on the latest report about the Atlanta Spirit Group’s supposed desire to sell the Hawks. The New York Post says ASG is looking to sell Philips Arena and the Hawks as a package deal and wants to unload the Thrashers separately.

Judging by the sports radio chatter this morning and blog comments in the past, Hawks fans would love it if ASG sold the team. But each time these stories flare up, ASG owners (when they’ve addressed the rumors) have consistently denied an interest in selling the team and insist they only want to take on investors. Micheal Gearon Jr. and Bruce Levenson released a statement today:

“As has been shared publicly for more than a year, we are interested in finding minority investors and have engaged a firm to assist us in that effort. We have no plans to move either team, and remain committed to the Hawks, the Thrashers, Philips Arena and the city of Atlanta.”

That statement was less than one year ago. (18 June 2010)

Pretty funny that "Hawks fans would love it if ASG sold the team".

 

[Gump Hasek]

So, basically, they've publicly admitted many times to wanting to either sell the team (to anyone, including local) or involve local investors in their group.

That backs exactly what I've stated. You guys are confusing the lack of a cohesive message from a disparate group of arguing investors with the underlying theme that they've been trying to involve others in the group or sell the team. They hired an investment bank to do so. That offer included partnerships in lieu of a sale. Their pr skills may suck, but that either the team or partnerships were for sale via Raine (to anyone, including local) remains.

 

[davemac1313]

Winnipeg will not command a lot of money in a local tv deal, and they will have virtually no national presence on HNIC other than perhaps their first game. They will be the Ottawa Senators of the West by the time they finish their first season.

MTS offers MTS TV, a cable service, I would suspect that they may see big money in a local TV deal and would be quite likely to bid on the deal. If as some predict, the ST sellout, that deal becomes far more lucrative. Shaw would be in the bidding against them. Again, Winnipeg, Winter, Cold...stay in and watch the tube, I think you underestimate the value of local TV to a market like Winnipeg, radio rights will be a large bidding war as well. Neither of which is a big deal in markets where Hockey isn't the #1 sport. They may be getting only 1 offer to broadcast.

 

[Grudy0]

What you're confusing is that until very recently, that the offer only included minority investment. No one in their right mind would buy into the property with ASG maintaining control. Once the details of the malpractice lawsuit were divulged, then it became patently obvious that ASG was out to destroy the NHL in Atlanta.

Less than a year ago they were only looking for minority investors for the entire kit. That's a far cry from selling the team outright.

 

[Gump Hasek]

What you're confusing is that until very recently, that the offer only included minority investment. No one in their right mind would buy into the property with ASG maintaining control. Once the details of the malpractice lawsuit were divulged, then it became patently obvious that ASG was out to destroy the NHL in Atlanta.

Less than a year ago they were only looking for minority investors for the entire kit. That's a far cry from selling the team outright.

Yet numerous local and other groups looked at both offerings aside from the partnerships (hockey individually or the whole entity) and took a pass. The only thing to draw interest aside from tire kicking was Moore's group seeking the bball team & arena.

 

[Mungman]

MTS offers MTS TV, a cable service, I would suspect that they may see big money in a local TV deal and would be quite likely to bid on the deal. If as some predict, the ST sellout, that deal becomes far more lucrative. Shaw would be in the bidding against them. Again, Winnipeg, Winter, Cold...stay in and watch the tube, I think you underestimate the value of local TV to a market like Winnipeg, radio rights will be a large bidding war as well. Neither of which is a big deal in markets where Hockey isn't the #1 sport. They may be getting only 1 offer to broadcast.

Shaw and MTS won't be bidding on broadcast rights, they are the pipe only not the content. Global (owned by Shaw) and CityTV would be the only over the air companies conceivably bidding (I don't see CTV going after it now that they are corporate owned rather than Moffat), but it'll be Sportsnet regional that gets the rights in my view.

As for radio, it will be interesting to see if CFRW or CJOB emerges from that fight to the death with the rights. My guess is CFRW will sell the farm to get the first contract with the team.

 

[GordonGraham]

With the cup final starting wednesday is it fair to assume the league would want this announced by tuesday at the lastest ?

The ideal scenario for the league would be a sunday announcement with a holiday in the US on monday the news will get a lot less play in the media no?

 

[Grudy0]

Yet numerous local and other groups looked at both offerings aside from the partnerships (hockey individually or the whole entity) and took a pass. The only thing to draw interest aside from tire kicking was Moore's group seeking the bball team & arena.

Yet it appears that Anson Carter's group was willing to purchase the whole kit for $350 million (unknown about the assumption of debt), and when push came to shove, ASG isn't interested in unloading the Hawks and the arena rights.

I find it quite interesting that for a group that owns the three pieces they signed an exclusive negotiating deal for only two of them. By signing the exclusive deal with Moores, it left the Thrashers on a deserted island; no one could negotiate for all three entities at a time when there may have been interest in all three.

By unloading the Thrashers and removing them from Atlanta, it is more than possible that the monies earned from the sale negates the need for a local investor for the Hawks and the arena. According to the lawsuit, that almost appears to be the endgame.

 

[Koss]

Yet it appears that Anson Carter's group was willing to purchase the whole kit for $350 million (unknown about the assumption of debt), and when push came to shove, ASG isn't interested in unloading the Hawks and the arena rights.

I find it quite interesting that for a group that owns the three pieces they signed an exclusive negotiating deal for only two of them. By signing the exclusive deal with Moores, it left the Thrashers on a deserted island.

By unloading the Thrashers and removing them from Atlanta, it is more than possible that the monies earned from the sale negates the need for a local investor for the Hawks and the arena. According to the lawsuit, that almost appears to be the endgame.

I don't have a lot of confidence in Anson Carter's group having the ability to come up with $350M anyhow. He can say whatever he wants after the fact.

 

[mikeysvette]

May be a bad comparison but funny stats none the less...

Green Bay Wisconsin Pop. 103,000
Lambeau Field - Capacity 73,000

Winnipeg Pop. 684,000
Mts Centre Capacity 15,000

 

[Grudy0]

I don't have a lot of confidence in Anson Carter's group having the ability to come up with $350M anyhow. He can say whatever he wants after the fact.

Sure.

And ASG can say whatever they want, during the fact. They have no interest in selling all three entities together. Which puts the Thrashers in a lurch, as no one wants to own just the Thrashers without having arena rights ownership, which ASG simply will not allow.

 

[cbcwpg]

With the cup final starting wednesday is it fair to assume the league would want this announced by tuesday at the lastest ?

The ideal scenario for the league would be a sunday announcement with a holiday in the US on monday the news will get a lot less play in the media no?

Other than the first 15 minutes, do you honestly think anyone in the US even cares about this sale? It will be reported and done with, and then on to the finals.

This story is only news in Canada.

 

[Huffer]

And the Bombers lost money and do not sell out their games.

Maybe not all sellouts, but did you actually research before you posted?

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Football/CFL/Winnipeg/2011/04/05/17885471.html

 

[Melrose Munch]

Maybe not all sellouts, but did you actually research before you posted?

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Football/CFL/Winnipeg/2011/04/05/17885471.html

The Bombers lost money 2 years ago. It was on the last page.

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/teams/story/?id=317001&hubname=cfl-blue_bombers

 

[peter sullivan]

MTS offers MTS TV, a cable service, I would suspect that they may see big money in a local TV deal and would be quite likely to bid on the deal. If as some predict, the ST sellout, that deal becomes far more lucrative. Shaw would be in the bidding against them. Again, Winnipeg, Winter, Cold...stay in and watch the tube, I think you underestimate the value of local TV to a market like Winnipeg, radio rights will be a large bidding war as well. Neither of which is a big deal in markets where Hockey isn't the #1 sport. They may be getting only 1 offer to broadcast.

sportsnet....that deal is already done.

 

[borno87]

Yet it appears that Anson Carter's group was willing to purchase the whole kit for $350 million (unknown about the assumption of debt), and when push came to shove, ASG isn't interested in unloading the Hawks and the arena rights.

a) you do not know what the terms of the Carter Group's offer was, whether they were able to demonstrate they had the financial wherewithal to be able to complete a sale or any of the hundreds of other factors that goes into negotiating this type of agreement. Just look at how long it has taken TNSE and ASG to iron out a sales agreement for one franchise, never mind throwing in the arena and the Hawks into the equation.

b) it was Carter who withdrew his offer of $350M. We don't know why, or what the timeline was, how far along they got. But if Carter's group was actually serious, they would have pushed forward, and not retracted.

c) please do not argue that ASG never wanted to sell all 3 or just wanted to get rid of the Thrashers. The ASG is clearly running on fumes in terms of capital (ex. Hawks loan, unwillingness to fund Thrashers losses next year). When an interested and capable buyer comes along, and it's your money on the line, YOU LISTEN. Listen I could believe the theory that a few of the ASG clowns wanted to keep the Hawks and Phillips rights, and be rid of the Thrashers, however there is no way they would turn away buyers for all 3 on the hope that they could either sell Thrashers locally or sell to TNSE for relocation. If you remember that earlier in the month there was the very real chance that TNSE would have purchased the Coyotes had Glendale city council not stepped up to save the team. If that had happened, ASG would be holding the bag for the Thrashers next year, something they probably could not have afforded.

I am certain that they were aware of that possibility, and if any of the buyers for all 3 were actually serious or capable, they would not have just turned them away because they don't like hockey or whatever other emotional arguments you can think about are.

I find it quite interesting that for a group that owns the three pieces they signed an exclusive negotiating deal for only two of them. By signing the exclusive deal with Moores, it left the Thrashers on a deserted island; no one could negotiate for all three entities at a time when there may have been interest in all three.

Moores did not want to purchase the Thrashers. That is why there was exclusivity for only the Hawks and Phillips. It was because the buyer only had interest in those two, not because ASG wanted to save money losing Thrashers piece for a separate sale. ASG is lucky that TNSE is around to purchase to take the Thrashers off their hands, they didn't orchestrate any of this to help TNSE out.

There was no legitimate interest in all 3. That has been widely reported and confirmed. #thebalkan was a joke. Kincade was trying to help his wannabe friend get into the sports ownership game, nothing more. As Kincade himself said many times, he is not a "journalist" he is a radio show host, and it was his personal connection to #thebalkan that led to him propping up that speculation. Jay Clemons "resigned" (IMO he was fired) for jumping at the chance to be the PR mouth piece for #thebalkan, which appears to have been a miscalculation on his part.

By unloading the Thrashers and removing them from Atlanta, it is more than possible that the monies earned from the sale negates the need for a local investor for the Hawks and the arena. According to the lawsuit, that almost appears to be the endgame.

You are absolutely correct here. The $110MM infusion of cash will certainly remove the need for new investors for the Hawks. The implication that this entire scenario was manufactured by ASG for that express purpose is laughable as it makes zero sense from a fiscal standpoint.