Value of: This Leafs Package

[Mikenusca]

to Ott: 1st plus Chris Tierney, Josh Norris and Rudolfs Balcers, and Dylan DeMelo for Karlsson + Francis Perron

if the Leafs offered Rasmus Sandin, Kasperi Kapanen, and Tyson Barrie l'd take the Leafs package any day, and just flip Barrie for a 1st and prospect to make the deal, 1st, prospect, Sandin, and Kapanen, which is far better than what they got.

The sens got 2 1st rounders because EK resigned. That puck could be top 5, Balcers and Norris are going to be pretty good. I think the sens deal is better

 

[slimbob8]

The defensemen on the block are not worth that package. The defensemen that are worth that package aren't on the block.

That's why these trades don't happen.

That sums it up perfectly in a nutshell.

 

[Sticks99]

Was watching the Coyotes/Habs last night and I couldn't help but envision Taylor Hall and Niklas Hjalmarsson on the Leafs. Obviously it would take a lot to do it, but would be nice. Maybe start a package with Barrie, Johnson, Bracco, +++.

 

[Djp]

How do you figure? He's pretty much out produced Brannstrom at every level while being younger and folks are pretty high on him.

so point production=top Dman are you saying?

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

so point production=top Dman are you saying?

It's not the only thing but like it or lump it, it's a big thing. See decades worth of Norris winners and/or candidates.

 

[LokiDog]

You really think that package gets an all star #1 D? Which team do you think bites on that?

The big problem on top of that is Barrie is a rental so the teams interested in him would be wanting to add to a playoff roster. Sandin and Kapanen add a lot of value, but what team that’s adding a rental is going to part with a top caliber player? It doesn’t make sense. If Barrie had 1-2 years left, this package would have a lot of value, but with Barrie not being guaranteed to re-sign anywhere, I don’t see any teams that are in the market for a rental D but willing to offload the type of asset this package could return. Doubtful the Leafs are looking for a hodge podge of futures and spare parts in a deal like this, but no one is trading a star player when shopping for the playoffs.

 

[weinsink]

When is the last time you've seen a package that valuable get traded? Karlsson, Stone, Hall all recently traded star players and they didn't get anything close to that in return. Barrie alone would return a 1st plus decent prospect at the deadline if he was available.

If the leafs offered that package up, they should be getting an all star level #1D with a lot of term back in return. And no, not somebody like Manson. That package returns a much, much better player than that.

LMFAO

 

[Liferleafer]

LMFAO

A little harsh, but accurate. The hopes for me is that by the end of next season, people will be seeing why we all (Leafs fans) value Sandin highly.

 

[PuckFather]

When is the last time you've seen a package that valuable get traded? Karlsson, Stone, Hall all recently traded star players and they didn't get anything close to that in return. Barrie alone would return a 1st plus decent prospect at the deadline if he was available.

If the leafs offered that package up, they should be getting an all star level #1D with a lot of term back in return. And no, not somebody like Manson. That package returns a much, much better player than that.

Barrie alone would return a 1st plus decent prospect? Seriously?

 

[Djp]

It's not the only thing but like it or lump it, it's a big thing. See decades worth of Norris winners and/or candidates.

They get points playing on a good teams PP. You have a team who can avg 1 PPG per game your Dman likely gets 45+ PP points thus not much effort at ES to be a pte leader than accuratley assesing their defense skills.

On many teams their PMD PP specialists is a 4-6 Dman on many teams....they usually area defensive liability

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

They get points playing on a good teams PP. You have a team who can avg 1 PPG per game your Dman likely gets 45+ PP points thus not much effort at ES to be a pte leader than accuratley assesing their defense skills.

On many teams their PMD PP specialists is a 4-6 Dman on many teams....they usually area defensive liability

So his two powerplay points makes him a PP specialist?

 

[Shanwhatplan]

You really think that package gets an all star #1 D? Which team do you think bites on that?

I agree with you, and I’m a big Leafs fan.

 

[slimbob8]

Barrie alone would return a 1st plus decent prospect? Seriously?

All I can do is point you to comparable trades. You can continue to ignore them if you choose, but that won't change the proven market value for a player like Barrie.

Shattenkirk in 2017: Kevin Shattenkirk Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com
Sekera in 2015: Andrej Sekera Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com
Yandle in 2015: Keith Yandle Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

We know what Barrie is. He's the same player he was in Colorado which is a proven 50+ point d-man capable of running a 1st unit PP. Those guys don't come anything close to cheap even with defensive issues and UFA status factored in and history proves that year after year at the trade deadline. Hell even Cody Franson returned a 1st round pick for Toronto. Polak fetched two 2nd's and he was a bottom pairing plug. Neither of those two players are anywhere close to as good as Barrie.

The only logical explanation I can think of for someone to think Barrie wouldn't fetch a sizeable return at the deadline is their cable provider went down on trade deadline day for the last 20 years and they didn't bother to read up on what happened afterwards.

 

[Cogburn]

I'd give a second round pick (and a short term cap dump, say Schaller) for Kapanen, but Barrie holds no appeal to me, and Sandin is the wrong type of asset for the Canucks to acquire at this point.

 

[BlueBaron]

I'd give a second round pick (and a short term cap dump, say Schaller) for Kapanen, but Barrie holds no appeal to me, and Sandin is the wrong type of asset for the Canucks to acquire at this point.

A lot wrong with this post, shows a major disconnect.
-A second and cap dump for Kappy is very low ball, even before the Cap dump
-Every team can use guys like Sandin, not that he's available. 2 more years on ECL. You're right though it makes more sense for you to keep drafting D.
-Don't know your power play lines well enough to say but most teams can use a 50 point RHD for their PP but in this instance I can agree, getting a rental (not that he's really available) makes no sense for the Nucks.

 

[Cogburn]

A lot wrong with this post, shows a major disconnect.
-A second and cap dump for Kappy is very low ball, even before the Cap dump
-Every team can use guys like Sandin, not that he's available. 2 more years on ECL. You're right though it makes more sense for you to keep drafting D.
-Don't know your power play lines well enough to say but most teams can use a 50 point RHD for their PP but in this instance I can agree, getting a rental (not that he's really available) makes no sense for the Nucks.

Short term being one year, as I'd feel most teams interested in adding a scoring forward are pretty high up against the cap. Toronto isn't the only team pressed for cap space, and taking a cap dump seems to be the cost of doing business with a cap strapped team.

Not every team wants to burn assets to acquire Sandin though. You can never have too many prospects, but Vancouver is banking on making the playoffs this year, so assets being used to acquire Sandin can fill other roles or be used to acquire assets that can help them now. If Sandin was coming at ko cost, any team would love to have him.

I'm glad we agree on Barrie though. We have Hughes freshly added to our line up this year, and it's stalled again. More scoring D isn't the answer, ditching our stubborn special teams coaches is.

 

[KevinRedkey]

He certainly projects as a top two dman.

He has the potential to be one, but if we're talking projections as in.. what is he likely to become.. then no he's not projected as a top 2 guy. More of a 2nd pairing guy with potential to be a #2 guy. There's a reason he was the 13th Dman taken in his draft year. While he may have surpassed some of the guys drafted above him, it's not like the draft is going to produce 10+ top pairing Dmen in the first round. You gotta be realistic here.

FTR I'd day the same thing about Bernard-Docker (picked before and also doing well), so this isn't me Leafs bashing or being a homer. Very few dmen are expected top be top 2 is all I'm saying, really.

 

[KevinRedkey]

Barrie alone would return a 1st plus decent prospect? Seriously?

Imagine a scenario (hypothetical of course) where Toronto gets Demelo (0.900) and they retain 50% of Barrie (1.375).

Barrie at 1.375 is a very attractive option for a team that needs a PMD, but has little to no cap space. In that scenario I think Barrie gets a 1st and a decent prospect. It's possible is all I'm saying.

 

[DJIncognito]

What is the best defenseman this package could return for the Leafs?

Rasmus Sandin
Kasperi Kapanen
Tyson Barrie (UFA)

For that it would have to be Seth Jones

 

[7even]

I'm not saying any team would bite on it because nobody's looking to trade an all star D if they have one. But on the other hand you never, ever see packages as valuable as the one listed here traded. We sees star players (d-men included) traded for much less than this package. So it's all a moot point really because nobody is trading a package that valuable for any player that would realistically be available. The type of player that package is worth would not be on the market to begin with.

I don't think that package is quite the showstopper you think it is. Sandin is good but doesn't have the resume yet. As Dubas doesn't want to be the one who trades a future All Star defenseman age 19, so does no other GM want to trade JvR for Luke Schenn. The risk reward is such that the All Star RD Leafs fans expect this deal to entertain likely remains unavailable.

 

[slimbob8]

I don't think that package is quite the showstopper you think it is. Sandin is good but doesn't have the resume yet. As Dubas doesn't want to be the one who trades a future All Star defenseman age 19, so does no other GM want to trade JvR for Luke Schenn. The risk reward is such that the All Star RD Leafs fans expect this deal to entertain likely remains unavailable.

Show me an example of a package of players this valuable that has been traded then. I've yet to see someone on here that can do that.

 

[TaketheCannoli]

For that it would have to be Seth Jones

Columbus hangs up.

 

[Asymmetric Solution]

I’ll be willing to give you Zack Bogosian for that.

 

[Magic Man]

I’ll be willing to give you Zack Bogosian for that.

Jordan Schmaltz + 2020 7th rd. Pick for Zach Bogosian 50% retained

 

[crowi]

So you shouldn't trade Sandin, he is a good one. Kapanen, eh, if you can move him for a proper RD then go for it. Barrie - worth like a 2nd.

Then you want examples of teams dumb enough to trade Sandin and expect what, top-pairing D-man? What you had in mind here to acquire?