OT: The Second OT Social Bubble Thread

[racerjoe]

f*** baseball. Would rather get an NBA team back.

the last season we had the grizzlies we were still a top 3rd team in attendance, and the game has only gotten more popular. What failed us was management and ownership.

 

[MS]

f*** baseball. Would rather get an NBA team back.

the last season we had the grizzlies we were still a top 3rd team in attendance, and the game has only gotten more popular. What failed us was management and ownership.

And the players. And I can't see that issue changing.

 

[racerjoe]

And the players. And I can't see that issue changing.

Good management has shown it can work in Toronto.

time may change things as well as many now former nba players loved Vancouver, and vacationed here.

 

[Vector]

Good management has shown it can work in Toronto.

time may change things as well as many now former nba players loved Vancouver, and vacationed here.

Toronto is a major metropolitan area with a substantial Caribbean and African Canadian population, represented loudly by popular music icons, and was considered a favourite away game destination for it's strip clubs. I do agree that if you have a winning team, players will join. A Vancouver NBA team will have the same problem 75% of the NBA teams have in that lots of stars want to play exclusively in big markets.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

How did you come to the conclusion baseball fans here are super casual? Even on the Friday game, when the Jays are in Seattle, there are still 20 000 people from Metro Vancouver and Southeast BC there. That’s not casual when you are taking the day off work or leaving early so you can travel 3 hours to catch the Friday night game. And the crowds are there right through the week-end.

The census numbers haven’t come out yet, but the Lower Mainland population (still a smaller sample size than US metro areas) is at 2.9 million people. That’s the 22 larger Metro area in the US and Canada. Plenty enough to support MLB. Milwaukee is half the size of the Lower Mainland and they support 2 major league teams.

If we had a stadium, we would be a front runner for expansion or relocation. Stadium is an issue, but as I said, a stepped approach would work. Build a AAA stadium that is upgradeable to MLB standards.

I personally hate baseball, but have done the road trip to watch the Jays/Mariners game, only to tag along for tailgate events and make a road trip with buddies out of it. There's pretty much nothing to do during the summer doldrums so ho-hey, baseball it is.

Now, imagine an MLB team that's in the middle to bottom pack here. A game verses the Rockies on a Thursday night in May. Can this city support the team over 81 home games?

Another fact is that you are overlooking is many MLB players wouldn't stick around here. Much like NBA players, they can be ultra big primadonnas preferring larger markets in the USA over here.

 

[MS]

Good management has shown it can work in Toronto.

time may change things as well as many now former nba players loved Vancouver, and vacationed here.

As @Vector noted above, Toronto has some very different things happening than Vancouver would.

Karl Malone and Hakeen Olajuwon loved vacationing here in the 1990s, too. Didn't mean that 20 year old #1 picks were happy about getting stuck here or that UFAs of any quality had any interest at all.

I agree that there 100% would be the fan support initially. I just feel like the team would end up being a perennial loser, again.

 

[racerjoe]

Toronto is a major metropolitan area with a substantial Caribbean and African Canadian population, represented loudly by popular music icons, and was considered a favourite away game destination for it's strip clubs. I do agree that if you have a winning team, players will join. A Vancouver NBA team will have the same problem 75% of the NBA teams have in that lots of stars want to play exclusively in big markets.

As @Vector noted above, Toronto has some very different things happening than Vancouver would.

Karl Malone and Hakeen Olajuwon loved vacationing here in the 1990s, too. Didn't mean that 20 year old #1 picks were happy about getting stuck here or that UFAs of any quality had any interest at all.

I agree that there 100% would be the fan support initially. I just feel like the team would end up being a perennial loser, again.

I agree and disagree. The primary problem is an NBA problem and not a Vancouver problem. We could support a team as well or better than probably at least half of the current teams. The issue is the same as any of those teams. They are not NY, LA, Miami… and one or two other cities.

 

[Vector]

@racerjoe Hey! That's what I said!

 

[racerjoe]

@racerjoe Hey! That's what I said!

that’s the part I agreed!

I just think that’s an NBA thing not a specific to Vancouver.

 

[Vector]

that’s the part I agreed!

I just think that’s an NBA thing not a specific to Vancouver.

Yeah, my first part is about the advantage Toronto has over Vancouver, the middle is agreeing that it can be overcome through winning, and the last is the overall the problem the NBA has anyway. Only reason Milwaukee is successful is they lucked into a foreign superstar who wants to stay. Same as Dallas with Dirk and now Luca.

There's really only Boston, Brooklyn, New York, Philadelphia, Chicago, Miami, Golden State, LA Clippers, LA Lakers, and Houston as key at attracting stars. I feel Detroit should be there but they've had such a lousy history since the 80s that the franchise doesn't generate any interest. Chicago, Houston, and Golden State are really only there because of the money they've been willing to spend and success as a franchise. Main reason San Antonio doesn't rank is they don't chase free agents.

 

[logan5]

Vancouver was seen and still would be seen as the biggest backwater in the league. Even in the age of Drake in Toronto, you have guys describing it as “like playing overseas”. And that’s Toronto.

These guys are super image and lifestyle conscious, and if that isn’t there, they will lay down and play themselves into getting traded. As mentioned, there is zero chance Vancouver would ever win a championship, and most fans know it, or would quickly figure it out. Maybe in the far future when there are enough Canadians and Euro’s, there would be a chance.

Baseball players are more diversified in culture. They would be more comfortable playing here than the African American players would. And Vancouver and BC produces some very good baseball players. We could easily have 1 or 2 hometown players.

Basebalk season works with hockey season as they don’t overlap much.

 

[racerjoe]

Yeah, my first part is about the advantage Toronto has over Vancouver, the middle is agreeing that it can be overcome through winning, and the last is the overall the problem the NBA has anyway. Only reason Milwaukee is successful is they lucked into a foreign superstar who wants to stay. Same as Dallas with Dirk and now Luca.

There's really only Boston, Brooklyn, New York, Philadelphia, Chicago, Miami, Golden State, LA Clippers, LA Lakers, and Houston as key at attracting stars. I feel Detroit should be there but they've had such a lousy history since the 80s that the franchise doesn't generate any interest. Chicago, Houston, and Golden State are really only there because of the money they've been willing to spend and success as a franchise. Main reason San Antonio doesn't rank is they don't chase free agents.

I think Vancouver has advantages over Toronto too, like it’s nice weather, beauty, and while we may not have some specific large cultural, we are still very multi cultural. I don’t see Toronto having any serious great advantage on Vancouver, and even know a few eastern born national team players that now live here preferring it.

point just being we would be no different than Toronto. Still huge challenges until the league fixes itself.

Vancouver was seen and still would be seen as the biggest backwater in the league. Even in the age of Drake in Toronto, you have guys describing it as “like playing overseas”. And that’s Toronto.

These guys are super image and lifestyle conscious, and if that isn’t there, they will lay down and play themselves into getting traded. As mentioned, there is zero chance Vancouver would ever win a championship, and most fans know it, or would quickly figure it out. Maybe in the far future when there are enough Canadians and Euro’s, there would be a chance.

Baseball players are more diversified in culture. They would be more comfortable playing here than the African American players would. And Vancouver and BC produces some very good baseball players. We could easily have 1 or 2 hometown players.

Basebalk season works with hockey season as they don’t overlap much.

Yeah part of this post seems racist so I might leave that part alone.

Canada hasn’t produced some very good basketball players? BC hasn’t produced a good NBA player?

 

[Vector]

The only BC-raised basketball player I'm aware of is Steve Nash and he's a massive outlier.

Edit: The other two are Brandon Clarke, who moved to Phoenix at age 3, and Kelly Olynyk who was born in Ontario but moved to Kamloops when he was 7.

 

[F A N]

The only BC-raised basketball player I'm aware of is Steve Nash and he's a massive outlier.

Edit: The other two are Brandon Clarke, who moved to Phoenix at age 3, and Kelly Olynyk who was born in Ontario but moved to Kamloops when he was 7.

What's the "cut off" age? Robert Sacre grew up in North Van and played high school basketball here. Olynyk played high school basketball in Kamloops as well. I would consider both to be BC-raised basketball players. Clarke was born in Vancouver and that's pretty much it. But he is a proud Canadian. All three are Gonzaga alumni.

 

[logan5]

I think Vancouver has advantages over Toronto too, like it’s nice weather, beauty, and while we may not have some specific large cultural, we are still very multi cultural. I don’t see Toronto having any serious great advantage on Vancouver, and even know a few eastern born national team players that now live here preferring it.

point just being we would be no different than Toronto. Still huge challenges until the league fixes itself.





Yeah part of this post seems racist so I might leave that part alone.

Canada hasn’t produced some very good basketball players? BC hasn’t produced a good NBA player?

I was re-iterating what other people just said. You didn't make any racism accusation towards them. What gives?

 

[Vector]

What's the "cut off" age? Robert Sacre grew up in North Van and played high school basketball here. Olynyk played high school basketball in Kamloops as well. I would consider both to be BC-raised basketball players. Clarke was born in Vancouver and that's pretty much it. But he is a proud Canadian. All three are Gonzaga alumni.

Current NBA players. There are 2 you could say have a connection to BC. Saying Vancouver could easily have 1-2 homegrown players is really weird when there are only 2 potential players and one of them is homegrown at all. You didn’t write the post I was referring too, though.

 

[racerjoe]

Current NBA players. There are 2 you could say have a connection to BC. Saying Vancouver could easily have 1-2 homegrown players is really weird when there are only 2 potential players and one of them is homegrown at all. You didn’t write the post I was referring too, though.

If it was my post that isn’t close to what I said either.

 

[Vector]

If it was my post that isn’t close to what I said either.

Oh. No. It was logan5’s but I just now realize he was talking about baseball and not basketball.

 

[DFAC]

Might be an unpopular opinion but I dont see Vancouver as a huge “sports” city. The majority of fans are super casual and fairweather.

Most people would rather go on a hike or out to eat than to watch a game and that’s fine

 

[racerjoe]

Might be an unpopular opinion but I dont see Vancouver as a huge “sports” city. The majority of fans are super casual and fairweather.

Most people would rather go on a hike or out to eat than to watch a game and that’s fine

I think we are an event city more than anything.

 

[F A N]

Oh. No. It was logan5’s but I just now realize he was talking about baseball and not basketball.

 

[Vector]

I got so confused and twisted myself in a very dumb knot. Whatever, Kyle Lowry will lead the Blue Jays to a Grey Cup this year.

 

[Melvin]

Might be an unpopular opinion but I dont see Vancouver as a huge “sports” city. The majority of fans are super casual and fairweather.

Most people would rather go on a hike or out to eat than to watch a game and that’s fine

Given the amount of times I would go to a bar downtown and have to ask them to put the Canucks game on when I lived in Yaletown, I agree.

 

[Hit the post]

Given the amount of times I would go to a bar downtown and have to ask them to put the Canucks game on when I lived in Yaletown, I agree.

Watching the DimJim managing the Canucks would drive me to drink.

 

[Peen]

I went to hang out in Toronto for a few days a week ago and I do agree that the vibes that city has are just not in any way comparable to Vancouver.

Vancouver is cool for different things. The lifestyle, culture, diversity, vibes are on a different level in Toronto.

I'd move there if the weather weren't so shit.