Speculation: The Ryan O'Reilly Factor

[umdieecke*]

Im creating this thread for the purpose of consolidating all the some what legitimate trade proposals. When I say somewhat legitimate, it doesnt have to be unanimous but if one, say, Leafs fans likes a trade but its criticized by 10 other Leafs fans, you could call it questionable. So please use good judgment as far as whether there's some consensus involved. But I thought it would be useful to have a thread to track all the various trade proposals for Ryan O'Reilly where it's in one place and it can be easily referenced. This way we can know that there are better proposals and other fans can see that they need to step up witht their proposals.

Im listing this witht he eastern conference teams first. As the East would be a preferable trade partner. Then the Pacific. And lastly, the Central since thats the least likely trade destination for ROR.

Boston: Marchand/sandpaper+2 million savings (http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=86522549&postcount=112)
Tampa Bay:
Montreal:
Detroit:
Ottawa:
Toronto: Phanuef; Gardiner + #8OA
Florida:
Buffalo:
Pittsburgh: Maatta + Sutter
NY Rangers: Marc Staal + Miller; Marc Staal + Carl Hagelin
Philadelphia: Coburn + 2nd round pick(tentative, pending subsequent beatdown)
Columbus:
Washington:
New Jersey:
Carolina:
NY Islanders:Hamonic+or 5th + or 5th+Mayfield+Grabner
________________________________

Anaheim:
San Jose:
Los Angeles:
Phoenix: Vermette + Stone/Murphy + 12th; Yandle + 58th; Hanzl+ Stone or Korpi + 12th - 23rd

Vancouver:
Calgary:
Edmonton:
________________________________

St. Louis:
Chicago: Sharp + Leddy-
Minnesota:
Dallas:
Nashville: 11th
Winnipeg: Wheeler/Bogosian + 9, Evander "Big Daddy" Kane (i.e. someone to beat the ***** out of Matt Cooke)


http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1691295

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1690251

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1691217

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1692431

Please let me know of others or ones that are better.

Click to read more...

 

[Prongo]

As a Flyers fan I would offer Coburn+. I believe, in my clearly unbiased views that Coburn is better than Marc Staal. You also probably have a much better chance of signing him to an extension than Staal.

I don't think you would ever trade him in conference either. You don't want to play him every night.

 

[Avs71]

As a Flyers fan I would offer Coburn+. I believe, in my clearly unbiased views that Coburn is better than Marc Stall. You also probably have a much better chance of signing him to an extension than Stall.

I don't think you would ever trade him in conference either. You don't want to play him every night.

Would you do something like Coburn+Simmonds for O'Reilly+Siemens? It was discussed by a few Avs fans in our off-season thread.

That Winnipeg deal was ripped apart by Jets fans. I wouldn't put that up there.

 

[tigervixxxen]

I think every proposal should come with an addendum on how that particular team plans to fit ROR under the salary cap.

 

[umdieecke*]

I think every proposal should come with an addendum on how that particular team plans to fit ROR under the salary cap.

That's their problem.

Edit--We shouldnt put too fine of a point on his contract uncertainty because thats the only reason he's available to begin with.

 

[Prongo]

Would you do something like Coburn+Simmonds for O'Reilly+Siemens? It was discussed by a few Avs fans in our off-season thread.

I don't think Simmonds is on the block in any scenario. Homer/Hexy love the guy and how he plays. He is someone I wouldn't want to move and I have concerns about Siemens as well. Flyers were high on him though at the draft. I just think Coburn(22-23 minutes a night) and a 60 point PF is a little too much.(a lot haha, don't want to upset the natives)

Coburn has the ability to pair next to EJ and solidify that top pairing for the Avs. ROR has the ability to solidify the LW next to Giroux or our second line center position.

The Flyers I think wouldn't have any problems starting at 6.5 with O'Reilly. They have proven they like him and chased him when he was holding out. I would be willing to bet they would offer 6.5-6.75 a year on a long term deal.

 

[henchman21]

Coburn with a small + would not get ROR though. Other teams can offer better (and younger) defensemen.

 

[Burnaby_Joe*]

As a Flyers fan I would offer Coburn+. I believe, in my clearly unbiased views that Coburn is better than Marc Staal. You also probably have a much better chance of signing him to an extension than Staal.

I don't think you would ever trade him in conference either. You don't want to play him every night.

Depends on what that + is, and I think Staal is better than Coburn, but hey, that's me.

 

[Avs71]

Yeah, I get not wanting to trade Simmonds. I like Coburn, but the fact that he is 30 already next season is what turns me off that deal. If the Avs are going that old, they may as well go after Giordano.

 

[Prongo]

Coburn with a small + would not get ROR though. Other teams can offer better (and younger) defensemen.

Av fans were willing to take Marc Staal for O'Reilly. He is two years younger and isn't the same defenseman he was before his concussion. He is regaining form but the two year gap isn't much there, especially with the concussion concerns.

I am not going on what was deemed fair value with fans either. The Flyers have made Coburn available before and I don't see why they wouldn't again. I don't know many defenseman that would be available that are better than him.

 

[Burnaby_Joe*]

Av fans were willing to take Marc Staal for O'Reilly. He is two years younger and isn't the same defenseman he was before his concussion. He is regaining form but the two year gap isn't much there, especially with the concussion concerns.

I am not going on what was deemed fair value with fans either. The Flyers have made Coburn available before and I don't see why they wouldn't again. I don't know many defenseman that would be available that are better than him.

Staal + Miller or Hagelin I think it was.

 

[henchman21]

Av fans were willing to take Marc Staal for O'Reilly. He is two years younger and isn't the same defenseman he was before his concussion. He is regaining form but the two year gap isn't much there, especially with the concussion concerns.

I am not going on what was deemed fair value with fans either. The Flyers have made Coburn available before and I don't see why they wouldn't again. I don't know many defenseman that would be available that are better than him.

It was Staal with a significant plus. IMO Staal is better than Coburn, but the same range.

If Coburn is the player either Philly is giving up 1 big plus, or 2 smaller, but still substantial +.

 

[Prongo]

Staal + Miller or Hagelin I think it was.

I just don't know if Sather is willing to offer that.

If you got the Staal+Hagelin offer, I would take it and run. Problem is I don't think that would ever actually be offered. Rangers were in the cup finals this year, they need a offensive center like Spezza I believe. They shouldn't be subtracting from a amazing defense that got them to the cup. Just my opinion though.

 

[umdieecke*]

Av fans were willing to take Marc Staal for O'Reilly. He is two years younger and isn't the same defenseman he was before his concussion. He is regaining form but the two year gap isn't much there, especially with the concussion concerns.

I am not going on what was deemed fair value with fans either. The Flyers have made Coburn available before and I don't see why they wouldn't again. I don't know many defenseman that would be available that are better than him.

Not really. There needed to be a + with Staal also. Don't worry, Im sure the the opstions will be vetted once the board is solidfied.

Put it in terms of a draft pick. What about Coburn + your 1st Rd pick? ROR is 23, Coburn is 29. You need to give us a way to stay young since you're getting a two way forward entering his prime years.

 

[umdieecke*]

I just don't know if Sather is willing to offer that.

If you got the Staal+Hagelin offer, I would take it and run. Problem is I don't think that would ever actually be offered. Rangers were in the cup finals this year, they need a offensive center like Spezza I believe. They shouldn't be subtracting from a amazing defense that got them to the cup. Just my opinion though.

Im not adding +Hagelin because that was the counter offer from Avs fans. There was no consensus of acceptance or any acceptance at all really.

But the contract uncertainty with Staal should necessitate a + bigger than Miller. I think Hagelin is fair given that uncertainty. NYR would lose Hagelin and a player whose contract is up but they'd be gaining a F who is better all around than Hagelin and can better chip in for the loss of Stralman on defense.

 

[Prongo]

Not really. There needed to be a + with Staal also. Don't worry, Im sure the the opstions will be vetted once the board is solidfied.

Put it in terms of a draft pick. What about Coburn + your 1st Rd pick? ROR is 23, Coburn is 29. You need to give us a way to stay young since you're getting a two way forward entering his prime years.

Coburn is as well in his prime too. O'Reilly also can be a UFA in two years as Coburn can be. These would have to be measured in a trade for ROR as well. There really is no reason to think Coburn can't be a 23 minute a night player until he is 33-34 years old. You would have two years to negotiate a deal with him as well. That's why I would be hesitant to throw in a substantial+

To the poster below, Staal plays 19 mins a night on the Rangers second pairing and Coburn plays 22 mins a night on our top pairing with 0 PP time. I just have to disagree with the opinion that Staal is a top pairing defenseman.

 

[Burnaby_Joe*]

Not really. There needed to be a + with Staal also. Don't worry, Im sure the the opstions will be vetted once the board is solidfied.

Put it in terms of a draft pick. What about Coburn + your 1st Rd pick? ROR is 23, Coburn is 29. You need to give us a way to stay young since you're getting a two way forward entering his prime years.

I still wouldn't do it. Coburn would help our blueline, but he's not a top pairing dman imo, Staal is.

 

[tigervixxxen]

The Flyers I think wouldn't have any problems starting at 6.5 with O'Reilly. They have proven they like him and chased him when he was holding out. I would be willing to bet they would offer 6.5-6.75 a year on a long term deal.

Yeah my question is how. You don't even have that in cap space right now.

 

[umdieecke*]

Coburn is as well in his prime too. O'Reilly also can be a UFA in two years as Coburn can be. These would have to be measured in a trade for ROR as well. There really is no reason to think Coburn can't be a 23 minute a night player until he is 33-34 years old. You would have two years to negotiate a deal with him as well. That's why I would be hesitant to throw in a substantial+

To the poster below, Staal plays 19 mins a night on the Rangers second pairing and Coburn plays 22 mins a night on our top pairing with 0 PP time. I just have to disagree with the opinion that Staal is a top pairing defenseman.

Well what's your +? To be honest, relative to NHL level players, its questionable how significant a 15-25 first is.

 

[Prongo]

Yeah my question is how. You don't even have that in cap space right now.

With Coburn going to Colorado it would free 4.5. That would be enough to sign ROR and we still have Vinny in play. I think Vinny gets moved this off season and if no salary is retained(which IMO is a possibility) we clear another 4.5. Basically 9 out to sign 6.75. That would be the ideal situation but we know that doesn't happen generally.

Well what's your +? To be honest, relative to NHL level players, its questionable how significant a 15-25 first is.

It's tough, we are going to disagree with how big the gap is for each team on the values. I would offer Coburn+2nd rounder but you guys clearly wouldn't accept that. We know you asked for Couts in the holdout last time but he was an untouchable. I still think that remains true.

This is the part where if the Avs are looking to move O'Reilly I have to see what they are looking for in return(someone respectable in the media). It's tough to gauge the price in these situations. I just think as a base ROR for Coburn is workable.

 

[Avs71]

This is the part where if the Avs are looking to move O'Reilly I have to see what they are looking for in return(someone respectable in the media). It's tough to gauge the price in these situations. I just think as a base ROR for Coburn is workable.

The asking price from the Rangers was Stepan+Del Zotto, back before Del Zotto was considered complete trash.

 

[pockets]

Letang should not be on the list from Pittsburgh, injury history plus being a RHD makes it an easy no for me...

Add Josi from Nashville (not combined with the 11th OA though)

 

[Avs For Life]

Someone in the trade proposals thread said something around Soupy and the 1st OA for ROR. Might not be a bad idea.

I suggested

ROR, Siemens, Elliott

for

Soupy and Kulikov.

I think I am short on value though from the Avs side. Thoughts?

 

[henchman21]

The rumor mills last time were very good young center to replace ROR or high ceiling forward prospect and either a high ceiling young defensemen or a solid top pairing defender. I see no reason why that has changed.

One rumor that floated around (and possibly why Calgary offersheeted) was Gio + Baertschi for ROR... the Avs were asking the moon, and that price has not gone down.

 

[umdieecke*]

Letang should not be on the list from Pittsburgh, injury history plus being a RHD makes it an easy no for me...

Add Josi from Nashville (not combined with the 11th OA though)

OK, fair enough. Ill take LeTang off the list. I think theres enough consensus on Avs fans that this is bad. But the Avs defense isn't good enough to be picky about handedness.

ROR = Josi wasnt really something Nashville fans agreed on. And it wasn't +11th OA. I just put 11th OA based on what Poile has said about adding a top 6 forward. I think it's pretty conservative to say ROR would bring back at least 11 OA.