Player Discussion "The Real Deal" James Neal

[5 14 6 1]

Play him on the PP and sheltered 5v5. Buy him out next year if needed (3.9M savings)

 

[McDNicks17]

For next season, ideally I'd like to move Chiasson and find a decent offensive #3C(someone like Haula or Brassard from UFA) to run a more offensively oriented third line.

Then run something like Benson(or even try to re-sign Ennis) - new #3C - Neal.

After that, it likely makes a lot of sense to try to make a deal around Seattle taking him as the expansion pick.

 

[Aerchon]

Neal is about 1000 times better than Chiasson on the PP lately anyways.

His 5v5 play is actually better than I thought it would be. Plus minus is not flattering him, it's a bit misleading.

Neal is typically good in the playoffs as well.

With AA in the lineup moving forward plus Kassian and Yamamoto... Neal is no longer "needed". However getting rid of him not very likely.

In short we are most likely stuck with him but it's not "that" bad a thing.

Use him in the top 6 sparingly. A solid depth scorer that needs some sheltering. Have him on PP #1 racking up goals to offset his boots/2 way play.

Neal has been a big part of our success this year. Can be a good piece moving forward. Having said that, if possible and not too costly, getting Seattle/someone to take his contract is a good option as well.

Edit: Buyout is the absolute last thing tried and only if he plays worse as well.

 

[bucks_oil]

Neal has said in interviews that he prefers playing RW because of that reason.

Yep... I remember.

Something like this could work:

AA McD Neal
Nuge Drai Yama
Ennis Haas* Kass
Chaisson* Sheahan Archie

With the asterisks for potential upgrades next year.

 

[McNuge]

I think he's actually good on the PP, but god damn ES he is brutallll. I think his value is really shot form last year and he will need another decent - good season next season to regain any form of value, enough that it doesn't cost a 1st to get rid of him... Hopefully

 

[FlameChampion]

He is still good on the PP. The guy has 12 PPG this year and hasnt played for forever. He is worlds better than Chiasson on the PP.

He isnt good on 5 on 5 though. I dont know how many injuries he has dealt with this year.

I think hes going to be on the team next year. Not sure its even worth discussing ways to get him off the team at this point.

 

[Mr Positive]

the negatives about Neal are a bit overblown imo. He accumulated a big minus, but he was being tried in a lot of situations. Tippett probably loved him a bit too much because he likes the idea of a good veteran in the top six. As Neal's role gets more refined, his weaknesses won't show so much. He probably ends up as a good third liner with less minutes than before but a PP push

 

[McDNicks17]

the negatives about Neal are a bit overblown imo. He accumulated a big minus, but he was being tried in a lot of situations. Tippett probably loved him a bit too much because he likes the idea of a good veteran in the top six. As Neal's role gets more refined, his weaknesses won't show so much. He probably ends up as a good third liner with less minutes than before but a PP push

Yeah, he got beat up in November, but he's actually been really good at 5v5 since then.

Since Dec. 1st:
CF%: 51.55 (1st among Oilers forwards)
SCF%: 55.96 (1st)
HDCF%: 53.68 (2nd)
xGF%: 54.41 (1st)

He did that mostly playing with McDavid and Kass, I believe.

 

[Tom Poti]

i was looking at the schedule and guesstimating a return for neal. i wonder if this injury provides a silver lining in that it could allow us to retain that 3rd we dealt in the lucic deal, seeing as we dealt our 2nd's for AA.

he's 2 goals off the first condition and i see maybe around 8/9 games left if he's back and healthy. obviously it would be nice to have a body back in the lineup, but there's a few variables at play.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

I picked buy-out IMO we got the best out of Neal that we could, he got better linemates than he deserved and a big offensive zone push, yet he's scoring at a 4th liners pace 5 on 5 while being poor defensively and providing no utility outside of a net front presence on the PP. With respect to the PP IMO he got some puck luck early and was burying everything and then has been much worse of late, I think his more recent play is a closer reflection of what to expect next season, not only cause of what I'm seeing in his play, but cause it lines up with his PP production in the 2 years prior to this season. Neal much like Lucic in his 1st year here seems to be producing on the PP at a rate higher than I think he can sustain and when that collapses all we have left is an underwhelming and expensive 4th line player.

The Seattle option would still leave him on the team for a year which I don't want and it still requires a bribe, the swap him for another overpaid player option, I looked around I'm not sure anything lines up that works for both teams, Turris is a little tempting, but we'd be taking one more year of bad contract. With the way things are right now, the best non buy-out option might be bribing New Jersey to take him, they have a ton of cap and could use more futures. Anyways, buy-out is the sure fire option and the one I picked, we should do our due diligence to explore other options, but I'm guessing the final decision will be what I picked, we can put the $3.83M cap savings to good use elsewhere.

 

[Aerchon]

I picked buy-out IMO we got the best out of Neal that we could, he got better linemates than he deserved and a big offensive zone push, yet he's scoring at a 4th liners pace 5 on 5 while being poor defensively and providing no utility outside of a net front presence on the PP. With respect to the PP IMO he got some puck luck early and was burying everything and then has been much worse of late, I think his more recent play is a closer reflection of what to expect next season, not only cause of what I'm seeing in his play, but cause it lines up with his PP production in the 2 years prior to this season. Neal much like Lucic in his 1st year here seems to be producing on the PP at a rate higher than I think he can sustain and when that collapses all we have left is an underwhelming and expensive 4th line player.

The Seattle option would still leave him on the team for a year which I don't want and it still requires a bribe, the swap him for another overpaid player option, I looked around I'm not sure anything lines up that works for both teams, Turris is a little tempting, but we'd be taking one more year of bad contract. With the way things are right now, the best non buy-out option might be bribing New Jersey to take him, they have a ton of cap and could use more futures. Anyways, buy-out is the sure fire option and the one I picked, we should do our due diligence to explore other options, but I'm guessing the final decision will be what I picked, we can put the $3.83M cap savings to good use elsewhere.

If cup is seriously a goal for this franchise, buyouts need to stop. It ruins your cap management. As inflation hits the league in player contracts and increases in the cap having money tied up in buyouts basically keeps the team behind the 8 ball continously.

If we can't get good value during this years offseason for Puljujarvi and he stays in Europe playing well...

Package Puljujarvi and even maybe a late pick for Seattle to take Neal. Two birds one stone and really getting Neal and Puljujärvi is solid for an expansion club.

 

[Faelko]

Agree with Aerchon here, no more buyouts...Neal will still score 15 goals playing 3rd line minutes and PP.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

If cup is seriously a goal for this franchise, buyouts need to stop. It ruins your cap management. As inflation hits the league in player contracts and increases in the cap having money tied up in buyouts basically keeps the team behind the 8 ball continously.

If we can't get good value during this years offseason for Puljujarvi and he stays in Europe playing well...

Package Puljujarvi and even maybe a late pick for Seattle to take Neal. Two birds one stone and really getting Neal and Puljujärvi is solid for an expansion club.

If Puljujaarvi is still Oiler Property in 2021, I'd assume he reports to training camp.
If he DOES report, either we either protect him because he was so awesome, or he sucks, so we expose him (allowing Vegas to pick him without taking Neal).

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

If cup is seriously a goal for this franchise, buyouts need to stop. It ruins your cap management. As inflation hits the league in player contracts and increases in the cap having money tied up in buyouts basically keeps the team behind the 8 ball continously.

If we can't get good value during this years offseason for Puljujarvi and he stays in Europe playing well...

Package Puljujarvi and even maybe a late pick for Seattle to take Neal. Two birds one stone and really getting Neal and Puljujärvi is solid for an expansion club.

It's not buy-outs that need to stop it's bad contracts that need to stop, a buy-out is nothing more than a tool in GM's toolbox an overabundance of buy-outs obviously eats into your cap significantly, but you have to make a case by case evaluation on what the best choice is in every given circumstance, sometimes it's the right choice and sometimes it's the wrong choice, but it should never be eliminated as a potential choice altogether just cause you think it may have been used too excessively in the past.

Of the 3 buy-outs presently on our books I was against the Sekera buy-out, I thought he was still useful and his time in Dallas is bearing that out. With respect to the Pouliot buy-out my only issue with it is I thought we could milk one more year out of him and then buy him out so it's only a 2 year cap commitment opposed to a 4 year commitment, if we went with my way he'd be coming off the books this year. The Gryba buy-out was just a favor to a player, it clearly made no sense since his cap-hit was below the threshold for it counting against the cap if he was buried in the AHL, and while I'm not thrilled about it, it's a small enough cap penalty there isn't much reason to get bent out of shape about it.

With respect to Neal I think he's pretty conclusively proven he is not well suited to a top 6 role at the stage of his career and his skill set is not typically what you want in a bottom 6 player, then you only need parse through his career PP point rates and his career average shooting percentages to see it's pretty unlikely he'll be as successful on the PP next year, of the 5 members of our PP unit it's clear coaching deemed him to be the weakest individual as with any struggles he was the one who was interchanged with another player. Neal's sole route to remaining a viable and useful member of our team is continued PP success on the present season his PP shooting percentage is 38.7% which is +23.3% above his career average, if you don't know 23.3% is a pretty darn solid PP shooting percentage in general to be that much above your career average shooting percentage is absurd.

Tippett is always about giving his players designated roles and assignments, I just don't see a defined role for Neal absent him just doing phenomenally well on the PP again and math, common sense, and the numbers game stand against him (# of contenders for that one role both existing players under contract and off-season acquisitions).

 

[guymez]

Yeah, he got beat up in November, but he's actually been really good at 5v5 since then.

Since Dec. 1st:
CF%: 51.55 (1st among Oilers forwards)
SCF%: 55.96 (1st)
HDCF%: 53.68 (2nd)
xGF%: 54.41 (1st)

He did that mostly playing with McDavid and Kass, I believe.

...and playing with a broken big toe.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

...and playing with a broken big toe.

That's the first that I've hear what the actual injury was. I thought that he seemed slower as the season went on. Hopefully he comes back quicker and ready to kick some ass!

 

[McJadeddog]

That's the first that I've hear what the actual injury was. I thought that he seemed slower as the season went on. Hopefully he comes back quicker and ready to kick some ass!

You would think the broken toe would be healed by now, as it has been 2 months already. The high ankle sprain on the other hand..... that might be a few more weeks, or tomorrow, lol. Never seem to know with high ankle sprains.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

You would think the broken toe would be healed by now, as it has been 2 months already. The high ankle sprain on the other hand..... that might be a few more weeks, or tomorrow, lol. Never seem to know with high ankle sprains.

I mean I guess you would, but it's probably more to do with doing workouts and practicing without pain, which can be a while with something like a broken toe.

 

[Stoneman89]

I wonder if Neal's injury problems were affecting his play long before he went on IR. He looked fine for the first month or 2 and then really slowed down.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I wonder if Neal's injury problems were affecting his play long before he went on IR. He looked fine for the first month or 2 and then really slowed down.

That's what the implication in this thread seems to suggest, which would explain a lot.

 

[guymez]

That's the first that I've hear what the actual injury was. I thought that he seemed slower as the season went on. Hopefully he comes back quicker and ready to kick some ass!

The broken toe was a separate injury....apparently that was an issue for November and December.
I havent heard what his recent injury is.

 

[guymez]

I wonder if Neal's injury problems were affecting his play long before he went on IR. He looked fine for the first month or 2 and then really slowed down.

Based on what I heard this is exactly what happened.
Not sure about the exact timeline...if I was to guess the toe injury would have been from mid November to late December. A broken big toe would have made it very hard to push off so it would have had to affect his skating.

 

[SwedishFire]

The history of hockey was before that those with vision, technice, speed was ahead and superior in the game, could lift a whole line.If you had a great shot, just a good playmaker, anything, or just though, you was an NHL´er. In todays hockey, it has become the evolution. In todays hockey, everybody is speedy and smart. And if you´re not smart or speedy, you sinka whole line. Hence the new attach as "anchor" on a line. ANd that is now the problem with Neal. While still being a good player, he misses the important parts in todays hockey, speed, and qucikness, and some hands.¨

You cant hide a player in a line. Agreat line is three good to great players, where hey dont neccesary have a weakness. If a weak player is on the team, he sinks the other two on the line. Thats why puttong Neal on a 3rd line could be very bad. Two average NHLers will become two unefficent and unprducing NHLers, who will become lighted up.

I think Oilers should keep Neal one more year, then let Seattle choose him in the expansiondraft. Just do it, rip it off. Bring Neal as someone said, Sam Gagner treatment. PP specialist, and 4th line selective miniutes. IN defense zone starts in 4th line, you throw in Nuge, Haas or Archibald instead.

AA McDavid Tennis
NDY
Nygård Sheahan Archibald (we got finally 3 lines)
New LW/could be Benson) - Haas - offensive zone Neal/ def.zone Nuge/Arch

And oh! .. trade 2 mllion Chiasson. that cap could be used in other ways than just waiting for a pressboxer to score again. He has to invent himself again, and I just dont think he can... in Edmonton at least.

 

[MessierII]

Bottom 6 top PP

 

[Messrules11]

Neal plays best when he’s hitting, put him in the bottom 6 with some pp time and hope for the best.