News Article: The Players Tribune: Pascal Dupuis ''In my blood'' (Read this -- seriously)

[Dipsy Doodle]

Is skating a skill? I'm not sure what the number of AHL forwards Dupuis' size who skate as well as him is, but it can't be high and Schremp would not be among their ranks.

His size and bigger. You remember Colton Gillies?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

The fact that undrafted players or even later round picks by default have to show more to prove themselves and get opportunities doesn't really say anything about their actual level of skill though.

And the fact is that Dupuis hasn't whiffed the minors since he was a rookie. He was always an NHL talent. He just fell through the cracks of the draft and busted his ass to very quickly prove as much.

He hasn't whiffed the minors since he was a rookie, and busted his ass to make the NHL.

Sounds suspiciously like incredible work ethic.

But if you're not going to take it straight from the horse's mouth, nothing I say is going to convince you.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Is skating a skill? I'm not sure what the number of AHL forwards Dupuis' size who skate as well as him is, but it can't be high and Schremp would not be among their ranks.

I think everything any particular player does well in hockey is a skill of sorts (even if it's just knowing where to be on the ice and being able to get there), but maybe some people think of "skill" as being solely the talents peculiar to skillful-minded biscuit scorers? That could be where some of the issue is in this discussion.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

He hasn't whiffed the minors since he was a rookie, and busted his ass to make the NHL.

Sounds suspiciously like incredible work ethic.

But if you're not going to take it straight from the horse's mouth, nothing I say is going to convince you.

I haven't said anything regarding his work ethic. Obviously he has one. Obvious it's a phenomenal one.

I'm only arguing that it's the primary reason he's in the NHL at all. The dude would be there if he took shifts, games, even weeks off.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I haven't said anything regarding his work ethic. Obviously he has one. Obvious it's a phenomenal one.

I'm only arguing that it's the primary reason he's in the NHL at all. The dude would be there if he took shifts, games, even weeks off.

Don't argue with me, argue with Dupuis.

An attitude like Dupes' is a rare, valuable thing, and his difference-maker. At least he seems to think so.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I haven't said anything regarding his work ethic. Obviously he has one. Obvious it's a phenomenal one.

I'm only arguing that it's the primary reason he's in the NHL at all. The dude would be there if he took shifts, games, even weeks off.

Now he might be able to get away with that. He wouldn't have made the league in the first place or through his first few years without the incredible work ethic though.

 

[Zen Arcade]

His size and bigger. You remember Colton Gillies?

Yeah, but Gillies has the hockey sense of a paper clip. I think being able to see plays developing and reacting to them counts as a skill, Gillies can't do any of that. The AHL is littered with "heart and soul" guys who it give it their all, most of them will never get more than a cup of coffee at the NHL level.

A guy with no talent who made it purely on work ethic and willpower would be someone like Steve Webb and he still only stuck around for half as long as Dupuis.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Don't argue with me, argue with Dupuis.

An attitude like Dupes' is a rare, valuable thing, and his difference-maker. At least he seems to think so.

I'm not going to argue with Dupuis because he didn't say anything dumb and wrong.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Now he might be able to get away with that. He wouldn't have made the league in the first place or through his first few years without the incredible work ethic though.

And that's basically true of like 95% of the league. I mean, you don't even really get in a position to even have the opportunity to play in the NHL unless you're willing to work like hell for years.

Unless you're Alexandre Daigle.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Yeah, but Gillies has the hockey sense of a paper clip. I think being able to see plays developing and reacting to them counts as a skill, Gillies can't do any of that. The AHL is littered with "heart and soul" guys who it give it their all, most of them will never get more than a cup of coffee at the NHL level.

A guy with no talent who made it purely on work ethic and willpower would be someone like Steve Webb and he still only stuck around for half as long as Dupuis.

Dupuis isn't talentless - my opinion of Dupuis' determining asset being work ethic seems to have been misinterpreted as Dupuis' only asset - but as I said, there are a lot of AHLers who have more raw skill.

 

[billybudd]

His size and bigger. You remember Colton Gillies?

Okay, so there's one. I'll throw Artyukhin in there as another, even though it's not clear that he was an actual hockey player and not a failed football player who learned how to figure skate.

That's not really a lot of guys. AHL journeymen almost overwhelmingly always have 1 of 2 things wrong with them.

1) Too small.
or
2) can't skate.

Guys that aren't too small and can skate like Duper just don't stay in the minor's except in rare exceptions (Artyukhin not having the hand-eye coordination to take a shot without falling over and not knowing the rules of the game he played would be one such exception).

I mean, average to above average size + good skating is all that Colin Greening is, but if Ottawa retained $1 million off his contract, Murray would get 20 calls on him.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Dupuis isn't talentless - my opinion of Dupuis' determining asset being work ethic seems to have been misinterpreted as Dupuis' only asset - but as I said, there are a lot of AHLers who have more raw skill.

I think I get it, I was going to disagree but then I realized I don't actually know how some players have NHL careers and long ones at that. Exhibit A, Adams is still going. Exhibit B, Glass' career.

Without it I doubt he'd have made the NHL after going undrafted or have lasted this long without some bizarre connection to someone. He's not brain dead, he has decent size and he can skate but the work ethic has ultimately been the deciding factor for his career. Dupuis was good at fitting a bottom 6 role which really helped him over more talented players who didn't have a niche. And luck, always luck. So I guess I agree? Maybe? idk.

The article is still pretty damn disturbing.

 

[billybudd]

I think everything any particular player does well in hockey is a skill of sorts (even if it's just knowing where to be on the ice and being able to get there), but maybe some people think of "skill" as being solely the talents peculiar to skillful-minded biscuit scorers? That could be where some of the issue is in this discussion.

Very probably. I think "skill" gets too often associated with stickhandling and behind the back passes.

Is a Hemsky head-fake a more impressive skill than a James Neal wristshot? Not to me, it isn't.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Okay, so there's one. I'll throw Artyukhin in there as another, even though it's not clear that he was an actual hockey player and not a failed football player who learned how to figure skate.

That's not really a lot of guys. AHL journeymen almost overwhelmingly always have 1 of 2 things wrong with them.

1) Too small.
or
2) can't skate.

Guys that aren't too small and can skate like Duper just don't stay in the minor's except in rare exceptions (Artyukhin not having the hand-eye coordination to take a shot without falling over and not knowing the rules of the game he played would be one such exception).

I mean, average to above average size + good skating is all that Colin Greening is, but if Ottawa retained $1 million off his contract, Murray would get 20 calls on him.

I guess I believe they're a lot more common than one might think - we just don't usually remember very good skaters who don't make it unless they're touted giants like Gillies and Artyukhin. The "Billy Sweatts" of the world just sort of fade into obscurity.

The Pens alone have comparably-sized burners in Marcantuoni and Byron in the system, and I don't think they're anything like a lock to make the Pens.

 

[systemsgo]

I think it's dumb, but it's not entirely a professional athlete thing.

My ex's father was a doctor, and he very heavily suspected he had throat cancer for a while but refused to get it checked out for real until he finally went and it was stage 4, he didn't have much more time beyond that.

My mom had heart pains for a long time before she went to get it checked out, and it was only because she could no longer climb the stairs without it hurting. She had several arteries clogged, and was just right on the precipice of a heart attack.

People just don't want to get things proven because it makes it more real. It's like thinking that as long as it's not tested and proven, it's not real. Is it dumb as hell? Yes. But the moment he got it checked out, that would've been it for him and he knew it. He just didn't want to face up to it just yet.

 

[catnip]

Yeah, I've had a few of these "warriors" in my family, too, and none of us are professional athletes or lead otherwise exceptional lives.

All the best to the Dupuis family.

 

[clefty]

I hope people think of this story next time they want to get furious at "incompetent doctors" for not acting sooner.

 

[ColePens]

I hope people think of this story next time they want to get furious at "incompetent doctors" for not acting sooner.

Amen. Hockey toughness is one thing, but you can see the doctors tried and tried.

But... Dupers attitude is the reason he made it to the NHL. It's the same attitude that could have killed him. You can't help but love the guy.

 

[Joejosh999]

Love the guy but just frightening recklessness given he knew what it was, and that PE can be fatal.
If I'm his wife I'm pissed beyond pissed.
But....its part of who he is.

I understand the first clot, due to the knee injury. The recurrence, though.....unless they know the cause and can treat/prevent it, I can't imagine they let him play again.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I don't think I can hate Duper anymore.

Why would you hate him in the first place? He literally risked his life for this team.

 

[mpp9]

A guy who values a game over his wife and kids isn't something I'll respect. Love the guy, but that aspect of it is ****ing stupid.

 

[Darth Vitale]

A guy who values a game over his wife and kids isn't something I'll respect. Love the guy, but that aspect of it is ****ing stupid.

Agree 100% although I don't think this is a way to conclude that Duper doesn't love his family. I'm sure he does as much as anyone and is a decent human being. I do think though, it's hard to escape the conclusion this guy is not very bright / does not think things through very well. That's if he's telling this story truthfully / without trying to create a "dramatic situation with a love of the game" type story for PR reasons. Example: something his agent put him up to (wouldn't put it past any agent to suggest a story like this).


But there's a red line here: the decision to be made in that scenario is a no-brainer 100% of the time, and no brain is exactly what would be required to make the wrong decision. Duper made the wrong decision. Respecting his work ethic or heart for the game is one thing, but trying to suggest that heart or work ethic is what this story is all about (that may have been the intention but the obvious can't be over-looked), is a load of crap.

Let's be brutally honest for a second here: this thing he did is not something anyone should "respect" or "look up to" (example: if you're an aspiring athlete or die-hard lunch-pail fan). This is a sign that we're talking about someone who is not big on thinking things through when it comes to his family and life in general. I get that he's wanted to be a pro hockey player all his life, and maybe it's scary thinking "oh ****, 'what's next' could be next month and I haven't even thought about what I would do!" And so in other scenarios maybe you kid yourself that you're really OK and try to play a game with an undiagnosed knee tear or concussion (either of those things would be totally understandable on some level) , but this is something totally different.

Pulmonary embolisms -- you don't **** with that. [This guy's a millionaire. His family's financial security for the foreseeable future is set (unless he made a lot of dumb decisions there too). We can't make that excuse for him.] The medical condition he has, doing what he does, can kill you and leave your wife a widow and your kids with the trauma of watching their father go into the ground. Think about that.






Pascal Dupuis didn't.

Did Kris Letang try to play with a hole in his heart / stroke issues once he knew he had them? No. Did TV try to play once he knew he had to go on blood thinners? No. What Dupuis did was a total meat-head maneuver, and should be accorded the same amount of respect. It was selfish. No other way to put it when you get down to brass tacks. He was scared, didn't think it through for the good of his family, and did something that could've ruined their lives. Maybe his Dad never taught him the value of family being even more important than "don't ever let them see you hurt / let them carry you off the ice", who knows. But at some point, if you're a Dad yourself. Common.

I can't get behind that, even sort of in a "wow that guy has guts" kind of way. I DO hope he makes it back to play some more healthy hockey, I DO wish him and his family the best... but Jeezus. It's hard to fathom that one.

 

[Klifton]

Agree 100% although I don't think this is a way to conclude that Duper doesn't love his family. I'm sure he does as much as anyone and is a decent human being. I do think though, it's hard to escape the conclusion this guy is not very bright / does not think things through very well. That's if he's telling this story truthfully / without trying to create a "dramatic situation with a love of the game" type story for PR reasons. Example: something his agent put him up to (wouldn't put it past any agent to suggest a story like this).


But there's a red line here: the decision to be made in that scenario is a no-brainer 100% of the time, and no brain is exactly what would be required to make the wrong decision. Duper made the wrong decision. Respecting his work ethic or heart for the game is one thing, but trying to suggest that heart or work ethic is what this story is all about (that may have been the intention but the obvious can't be over-looked), is a load of crap.

Let's be brutally honest for a second here: this thing he did is not something anyone should "respect" or "look up to" (example: if you're an aspiring athlete or die-hard lunch-pail fan). This is a sign that we're talking about someone who is not big on thinking things through when it comes to his family and life in general. I get that he's wanted to be a pro hockey player all his life, and maybe it's scary thinking "oh ****, 'what's next' could be next month and I haven't even thought about what I would do!" And so in other scenarios maybe you kid yourself that you're really OK and try to play a game with an undiagnosed knee tear or concussion (either of those things would be totally understandable on some level) , but this is something totally different.

Pulmonary embolisms -- you don't **** with that. [This guy's a millionaire. His family's financial security for the foreseeable future is set (unless he made a lot of dumb decisions there too). We can't make that excuse for him.] The medical condition he has, doing what he does, can kill you and leave your wife a widow and your kids with the trauma of watching their father go into the ground. Think about that.






Pascal Dupuis didn't.

Did Kris Letang try to play with a hole in his heart / stroke issues once he knew he had them? No. Did TV try to play once he knew he had to go on blood thinners? No. What Dupuis did was a total meat-head maneuver, and should be accorded the same amount of respect. It was selfish. No other way to put it when you get down to brass tacks. He was scared, didn't think it through for the good of his family, and did something that could've ruined their lives. Maybe his Dad never taught him the value of family being even more important than "don't ever let them see you hurt / let them carry you off the ice", who knows. But at some point, if you're a Dad yourself. Common.

I can't get behind that, even sort of in a "wow that guy has guts" kind of way. I DO hope he makes it back to play some more healthy hockey, I DO wish him and his family the best... but Jeezus. It's hard to fathom that one.

The thing is, that decision is a no brainer when you don't have to make it. When you face a situation like that, it is easy to rationalize any choice. He loves the game of hockey, and there he was facing the possibility that he may never be able to play again. That kind of fear is powerful. It is easy to look at him from the outside and say, well he should have done this, or he should have done that, but most people will never face something like that.

You can tell from reading the article, hockey isn't just something that he does. It is a part of WHO he is. There is a downside to that kind of passion. It is almost like an addiction. Its one thing to CHOOSE to move on, it is another to be forced to. To have something that important to you be taken away. It leaves a whole in your life that can never be filled. There is a reason that some professional athletes turn to drugs, or even commit suicide after being forced to leave the game. To love something so much, and have it ripped away is simply more than some people can overcome.

Was his decision the right one? no. But nearly ALL of us on this site will never know, truly know, how hard it was to make the right choice. I for one, hope that he is able to return and retire on his own terms. I also fear it out of concern for him and his family.

 

[Deutschland Dangler]

It's not even an issue about thinking things through very well. It's just denial, which is the most common human coping mechanism when dealing with extreme situations. I've seen this countless times with other people ("If the doctor doesn't see it because I can hide it from him, it doesn't exist").
I seriously doubt that there's more to it or that he consciously put hockey above his family or something like that.

 

[Darth Vitale]

The thing is, that decision is a no brainer when you don't have to make it....

No, this really isn't that. A great many Dads in a great many professions (that they might lose), would've quickly made the right decision if it was "keep doing this and hope you're all right but maybe die, or stop doing this and know you're going ot live, and figure the rest out later".

It's not even an issue about thinking things through very well. It's just denial, which is the most common human coping mechanism ...

Absolutely denial is a part of it. Doesn't excuse the lack of thinking it through though. He started thinking about it, then stopped at the scary part (denial), and we know the progression from there based on his own words.