GDT: The Pittsburgher Thread - Training Camp is Upon Us

[bigdaddyk88]

Call me a Moron thing. Cowher was full of warts and didn’t even want to draft Ben. Tomlin is a top 10 coach and a future hall of famer and next year will finally be able to build a team with out30 million dollar playoff no show

 

[Richard]

The problem with the Steelers has always been Ben and the work, or shall I say, the part time work, he has put in at QB. Ben was fine until he reached 30 years old or so. Then his legs slowed down.

Ben doesn't watch film, he isn't coachable and he has been like this for a decade. The offense gets its cue from him. Big boy is a Hall of Fame talent but he left so many championships out there its ridiculous.

Do you think Brady, if given Bens offense 14-18, wouldn't have won a championship?

 

[Night Shift]

Call me a Moron thing. Cowher was full of warts and didn’t even want to draft Ben. Tomlin is a top 10 coach and a future hall of famer and next year will finally be able to build a team with out30 million dollar playoff no show

The irony here is by some of your previous post YOU wouldnt have wanted him drafted either.

The latter part of your post. Ben putting up 40 burgers in the playoffs and Tomlin coaching the defense.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I loathed Cowher, but he blows Tomlin out of the water and it isn't close.

Cowher had 3 years with Ben Roethlisberger. The ONLY franchise QB Cowher ever had.

Season one, the Steelers go 15-1 and lose to Belichick and Brady in the AFC Championship game. A game the Pats shouldn't even have been in because of the tuck rule bullshit. Cowher came within inches of going to a Super Bowl in Roethlisbergers rookie year. Think about that.

Season two, Cowher and Ben win the Super Bowl. With a pretty terrible performance from Roethlisberger. Cowher adapted in the postseason and let Roethlisberger air it out. Attacked downfield a shitload. Wasn't the first time Cowher allowed his offense to air it out. O'Donnell got the Steelers to a Super Bowl by throwing it all over the field with plenty of 5 wide.

Season three, Ben is a f***ing idiot, bounces his head off a Buick and basically destroys the season all by himself.

Cowher quits.

That's all that really need be said. Should Cowher be blamed for not prioritizing acquiring a franchise QB? Sure. But one he got one, Cowher knew how to win big with that guy.

Hell, Cowher got to Super Bowls and AFC championships with Kordell Stewart and Neil O'Donnell.

ANYBODY believing Tomlin is in the same league as Cowher is a moron

Cowher annoyed the hell out of me with his conservative coaching, but he did open it up in ‘95 at least.

Cowher was a much better coach that understood his Xs and Os, but wanting to pass on Roth for Andrews is exactly why I’m glad he retired (unfortunately that lead to the Tomlin Purgatory that has made the Steelers a laughing stock).

A coach who wanted to pass on a HOF QB because he believed his team was all good with a busted up insurance salesman leading his team, is not a guy I could ever trust.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Cowher annoyed the hell out of me with his conservative coaching, but he did open it up in ‘95 at least.

Cowher was a much better coach that understood his Xs and Os, but wanting to pass on Roth for Andrews is exactly why I’m glad he retired (unfortunately that lead to the Tomlin Purgatory that has made the Steelers a laughing stock).

A coach who wanted to pass on a HOF QB because he believed his team was all good with a busted up insurance salesman leading his team, is not a guy I could ever trust.

But this is why you have good front office people- to overrule coaches that suck at drafting. Even Bill Parcells wasn't great at playing coach and GM.

To his credit, Tomlin and FO have been good at selecting the players. He just isn't good at coaching them or keeping them out of trouble. Or game day planning. Or doing much more than being a cheerleader.

He says a lot of cool phrases though and looks great in shades

 

[Night Shift]

A coach who wanted to pass on a HOF QB because he believed his team was all good with a busted up insurance salesman leading his team, is not a guy I could ever trust.

I'm not arguing against your point but one theory in picking his brain is he see the Ravens win a SB in 2000 with a game manager in Dilfer and thinks he can do the same. Another theory maybe is he really was planning to retire and didn't feel he had paitence for coaching a young QB at the time (even without thinking in terms of the franchise's future- yes very selfish on his part).

 

[bigdaddyk88]

The irony here is by some of your previous post YOU wouldnt have wanted him drafted either.

The latter part of your post. Ben putting up 40 burgers in the playoffs and Tomlin coaching the defense.

Tomlin and Ben play off failures are attached to each other. Ben hasn’t been good for 10 years and most teams only go as far as their QB takes them. Ben has thrown 27 playoff interceptions that’s not winning football he has 1 good playoff run in his entire career but thanks to the elite defense and good running was able to win 2 Super Bowls. His game has not evolved since. It’s amazing that Rodgers only has 1 super bowl with 45 tds and 13 interceptions in his 23 playoff games. Ben never took a real pay cut to help keep better players. When Brady Rivers took 2/50 he took 2/68. He is easy to game plan when you know Ben hates play action and RPo getting under center never really learned about the progression he is more farve back yard then a student of the game

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I'm not arguing against your point but one theory in picking his brain is he see the Ravens win a SB in 2000 with a game manager in Dilfer and thinks he can do the same. Another theory maybe is he really was planning to retire and didn't feel he had paitence for coaching a young QB at the time (even without thinking in terms of the franchise's future- yes very selfish on his part).

Bens play off success is when he is a game manager. In our last 3 playoff wins he has combined to throw 3 tds.

 

[Khelandros]

Tomlin and Ben play off failures are attached to each other. Ben hasn’t been good for 10 years and most teams only go as far as their QB takes them. Ben has thrown 27 playoff interceptions that’s not winning football he has 1 good playoff run in his entire career but thanks to the elite defense and good running was able to win 2 Super Bowls. His game has not evolved since. It’s amazing that Rodgers only has 1 super bowl with 45 tds and 13 interceptions in his 23 playoff games. Ben never took a real pay cut to help keep better players. When Brady Rivers took 2/50 he took 2/68. He is easy to game plan when you know Ben hates play action and RPo getting under center never really learned about the progression he is more farve back yard then a student of the game

Tom Brady has thrown 23 INT's his last 10 playoffs. What a loser. Can't win with that.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Tom Brady has thrown 23 INT's his last 10 playoffs. What a loser. Can't win with that.

I was told that if you throw a certain amount of INT's in the playoffs over a certain time period you're not a "Franchise QB"
Can't find that analysis anywhere else!

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Tom Brady has thrown 23 INT's his last 10 playoffs. What a loser. Can't win with that.

He has 87 playoff tds Ben has 34 playoff td

 

[bigdaddyk88]

34 tds and 28 interceptions that’s winning football and any coach who can’t win multiple championships with that kinda of QB play should be fired

 

[Night Shift]

He has 87 playoff tds Ben has 34 playoff td

Half of those against the vaunted Tomlin Defense

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

But this is why you have good front office people- to overrule coaches that suck at drafting. Even Bill Parcells wasn't great at playing coach and GM.

To his credit, Tomlin and FO have been good at selecting the players. He just isn't good at coaching them or keeping them out of trouble. Or game day planning. Or doing much more than being a cheerleader.

He says a lot of cool phrases though and looks great in shades

I don’t have any desire to see Cowher back, but the org had an identity under him and it was never a matter of his coaching prowess being in question.

He knew his shit, but his conservative ways were too much in line with his mentor Marty S. Luckily for Cowher Rooney overruled him and Roth came in and saved Cowher from becoming exactly like his mentor.

Now the Steelers culture has eroded so significantly under Tomlin that it’s mind boggling it’s been allowed to go on this long. Their identity now is to wear clown shoes every season.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I've said repeatedly that Tomlin's problem is he's been mailing it in for years. I think that attitude has infected most of the team and staff. While some guys like AB had legendary work ethics, I think it's fair to say guys like Ben and others could have been pushed to excel more.

Tomlin has told us who he is, repeatedly:
- likes to go by his gut [because scenario analysis & planning takes time and effort]
- not a fan of analytics [because processing and acting on analytics takes time and effort]
- prefers to "ease into" games and "probe" what the opponent is doing [because anticipating and planning takes time and effort]
- expects guys to be professionals and men [because kicking guys in the ass can be uncomfortable, and also takes time and effort]

I'd submit that few, if any, people in business or sports who hope to be better than mediocre do one, much less all, of those things. Those are all traits of LOSERS. It's no coincidence this team is often unprepared and not ready to start playoff games.

You'll find, generally, the most successful people aren't just very talented, but also the hardest working. Tomlin is neither of those things, and he's told us as much.

Over 50% of our seasons with a playoff win under Noll.

Over 50% of our seasons with a playoff win under Cowher.

28.5% of our seasons with a playoff win under Tomlin.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I've said repeatedly that Tomlin's problem is he's been mailing it in for years. I think that attitude has infected most of the team and staff. While some guys like AB had legendary work ethics, I think it's fair to say guys like Ben and others could have been pushed to excel more.

Tomlin has told us who he is, repeatedly:
- likes to go by his gut [because scenario analysis & planning takes time and effort]
- not a fan of analytics [because processing and acting on analytics takes time and effort]
- prefers to "ease into" games and "probe" what the opponent is doing [because anticipating and planning takes time and effort]
- expects guys to be professionals and men [because kicking guys in the ass can be uncomfortable, and also takes time and effort]

I'd submit that few, if any, people in business or sports who hope to be better than mediocre do one, much less all, of those things. Those are all traits of LOSERS. It's no coincidence this team is often unprepared and not ready to start playoff games.

You'll find, generally, the most successful people aren't just very talented, but also the hardest working. Tomlin is neither of those things, and he's told us as much.

Over 50% of our seasons with a playoff win under Noll.

Over 50% of our seasons with a playoff win under Cowher.

28.5% of our seasons with a playoff win under Tomlin.

I think the last ten years are two fold because Tomlin was brought in at a critical juncture in Roth’s career and he botched it badly.

Roth is by all accounts a “slide by with as little effort as possible” kind of guy.

That’s why I’ve said repeatedly Tomlin was the worst thing to ever happen to him professionally.

Bradshaw always said how Noll pushed him and he hated him for it at the time, but when he looked back Noll was exactly the kind of coach he said he needed to get his very best.

 

[USMC607]

Something is going down right now.

No details yet from Twitter verse, except that the front office is working on something.

Hooker maybe?

I did see Nelson on Twitter this morning say today or tomorrow stay tuned. Idk.

Guess we will find out.

 

[xlm34]

Something is going down right now.

No details yet from Twitter verse, except that the front office is working on something.

Hooker maybe?

I did see Nelson on Twitter this morning say today or tomorrow stay tuned. Idk.

Guess we will find out.

Yeah I saw just a tweet saying something was about to happen. Nelson would be pretty great but surprising. The secondary depth is the biggest question mark on the defense so it’d be great to get that sorted out.

 

[Night Shift]

Tomlin has told us who he is, repeatedly:
- likes to go by his gut [because scenario analysis & planning takes time and effort]
- not a fan of analytics [because processing and acting on analytics takes time and effort]
- prefers to "ease into" games and "probe" what the opponent is doing [because anticipating and planning takes time and effort]
- expects guys to be professionals and men [because kicking guys in the ass can be uncomfortable, and also takes time and effort]

Lol I think you are referring to yesterday's news. In the article it states the Steelers are bottom in the league in using analytics while interestingly Cleveland and Baltimore are near the top.

Steelers Lose Analytics Front Office Member To Jets - Steelers Depot

 

[OnMyOwn]

Some tweets suggesting Hooker. Others Nelson.

 

[USMC607]

Some tweets suggesting Hooker. Others Nelson.

So looks like it may have been just Green finally signing.

 

[PensandCaps]

The problem with the Steelers has always been Ben and the work, or shall I say, the part time work, he has put in at QB. Ben was fine until he reached 30 years old or so. Then his legs slowed down.

Ben doesn't watch film, he isn't coachable and he has been like this for a decade. The offense gets its cue from him. Big boy is a Hall of Fame talent but he left so many championships out there its ridiculous.

Do you think Brady, if given Bens offense 14-18, wouldn't have won a championship?

Brady going from the best coach ever to mike tomlin would certainly guarantee that he would never have won anything here from 2013-2018. The Defense was awful, Tomlin was awful in crucial moments, No way Brady would have won here.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Brady going from the best coach ever to mike tomlin would certainly guarantee that he would never have won anything here from 2013-2018. The Defense was awful, Tomlin was awful in crucial moments, No way Brady would have won here.

So Brady just went to Tampa a franchise with no winning track record and won a super bowl with no pre season. Him with AB Bell would have set offensive records. The best coach is has now missed the playoffs 2 times without Brady as his QB

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

So Brady just went to Tampa a franchise with no winning track record and won a super bowl with no pre season. Him with AB Bell would have set offensive records. The best coach is has now missed the playoffs 2 times without Brady as his QB

Mike Tomlin could f*** up a 2 car parade

 

[PensandCaps]

So Brady just went to Tampa a franchise with no winning track record and won a super bowl with no pre season. Him with AB Bell would have set offensive records. The best coach is has now missed the playoffs 2 times without Brady as his QB

Why do people act like he won the SB himself? lol. He had Three #1 WRs, Gronk, a good coach, a very good RB and had a great defense.

Brady got thoroughly outplayed in the NFC championship game by Rodgers, but Tampa's D got a few TOs.

Brady didn't even have to show up to the SB, Mahomes had no time to throw, one of the best defensive performances ever, that Tampa team was much better than any Steeler team this past decade.