The Official Horrible Trade Proposals Thread: Part 3, Still Drinking...

[geehaad]

Your guess is as good as anyone's, though there was speculation on the Twitters that other teams likely put in a claim on him.

 

[Moosetache]

I think Turbo's defense is short-sold a bit, he's not some world beater but for a skill winger he's above average. Definitely not some Skinner/Eberle type where I'm not sure they'd know who's in net for their own team most nights.

A good point here by DaveG....again he's no Bergeron/Hossa, but hes more than responsible and allows Aho to roam a little more than a lot of other wingers would. Ive watched a fair bit of Nylander (tho admittedly not a ton) and am of course seduced by his offensive abilities....but he leaves a lot to be desired in his own end IMO

All this being said....I am on the fence value wise as to whether Pesce for Nylander makes sense. Simply because I think Pesce at 4 mil for the next 6 years (including this one) is likely value you cannot recoup.

Nylander at 7 mil a year for X years....is he that much more valuable? on 95% of teams certainly no...on the canes with their lack of finishing ability always being an issue? maybe yes?

 

[Lempo]

Saw this on one of the trade threads, in reference to CAR potentially trading McElhinney:

They can't trade him unless they were the only team that put in a claim or he clears waivers.

From the CBA:
A Player who has been acquired by Waiver claim shall not be Traded to another Club until the termination of Playoffs of the season in which he was acquired unless he is first offered on the same terms to the Club(s) that entered a claim when Waivers were requested originally and the offer has been refused.​

First off, I don't see that he needs to clear waivers from CAR...not sure where the OP got that notion, from what's quoted above, anyway.
Second, does this mean that you would have to negotiate terms of a trade with one team, then present that same offer to a second team that had put in a claim on the original waiver, and that second team would have first right of refusal of those terms?

This is very weird. Let's say the deal was for a third rounder, and the first team you struck a deal with was a bottom-feeder, and the second team was a team who would likely make the playoffs (therefore the value of the pick is lessened), the terms of the agreement are not equal.

Good catch. It's utterly nonsensical that if you try trading Trevor Waiverbait and a prospect for Eberle, you'd first have to offer him to another waivers-claiming team that doesn't have Eberle to trade.

Could it mean he needs to be offered with the waivers-claim terms, so for a pesky couple of ten k's compensation?

 

[Lempo]

Oh, and @geehaad

The poster saying Canes would have to put McE on waivers again before trading him probably got it mixed with Return Waivers:

13.23 In the event a professional or former professional Player plays in a league outside North America after the start of the NHL Regular Season, other than on Loan from his Club, he may thereafter play in the NHL during that Playing Season (including Playoffs) only if he has first either cleared or been obtained via Waivers. For the balance of the Playing Season, any such Player who has been obtained via Waivers may be Traded or Loaned only after again clearing Waivers or through Waiver claim. This section shall not apply to a Player on the Reserve List or Restricted Free Agent List of an NHL Club with whom the Player is signing an NHL SPC or is party to an existing SPC with such NHL Club.

So that concerns (only) the player brought in from overseas after the season start.

 

[Negan4Coach]

I keep pwning the Flames fans on the main board who continue to labor under the delusion that Lindholm > Ferland

 

[The Faulker 27]

I keep pwning the Flames fans on the main board who continue to labor under the delusion that Lindholm > Ferland

To each his own, but I wouldn't rush to say either player is better. I think the trade worked out well for both sides, and both teams got the player they needed. Lindholm needed a change of scenery. He's off to a hell of a start, and was always the part of that trade I didn't like, but it got us Ferland, and he's added offense and power up front that was sorely needed.

 

[Negan4Coach]

To each his own, but I wouldn't rush to say either player is better. I think the trade worked out well for both sides, and both teams got the player they needed. Lindholm needed a change of scenery. He's off to a hell of a start, and was always the part of that trade I didn't like, but it got us Ferland, and he's added offense and power up front that was sorely needed.

At this point I think it'd be fair to say that we got the better players in the deal but they got the guys with the higher upside. And Lindholm may very well score 30 like he was f***ing supposed to here this year, but when you compare him to Ferland as things currently stand at this moment in time, I think Ferland is better in several ways.

 

[geehaad]

I guess, but it would've been nice to see what Lindholm could do as a center in an attacking offense like the Hurricanes are running. And we could sure use a higher-end right-shooting center right now.

Meanwhile, Aho and TT makes the LW on their line look great no matter who it is, so replacing Ferland with Foegele/Zykov/Kuokkanen wouldn't be a thought to perish. My thought is that we need a center more than we need a LW to play with Aho.

Ferland as a "don't-f***-with-us" presence is pretty great, though.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Was the yellow shirt a surprise for Pesce ?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

He (Pesce) was banged up at little at the end of the Detroit game.

 

[MinJaBen]

View attachment 149351

Was the yellow shirt a surprise for Pesce ?

Yes and no. He was "injured" on a play late in the game against Detroit enough so that he was able to leave the ice even though the Canes had just iced the puck. However, he never left the bench area, so it was not thought to be anything more than a stinger at the time. Coaching staff says the yellow jersey was just being extra cautious and Pesce wanted to skate as normally during practice.

 

[DougieSmash]

but when you compare him to Ferland as things currently stand at this moment in time, I think Ferland is better in several ways.

Ferland is not even two-way player, he can't touch Lindy defense. Lindholm is better playmaker and legit PK-er.

Overall, Ferland is crazy good but it was mistake to deal Lindy. Don't care about Hanifin that much

 

[geehaad]

^too exaggerated. It's much closer than this hyperbole would suggest.

Except in salary, of course.

 

[The Faulker 27]

Ferland as a "don't-****-with-us" presence is pretty great, though.

If you haven't seen this, it's a great watch. Ferland was a nightmare for Vancouver during the 2015 playoffs. Had 2 goals 2 assists and 40 hits in 6 games. I'd love to see this cat in the playoffs.

 

[Canes]

Ferland is way more talented than advertised, so it makes the Lindholm part of the deal not so bad for me even with Lindholm being younger, better defensively and finally starting to fulfill his potential. Ferland appears to have some untapped offensive potential himself, and he's the type of power forward I've wanted for years and years now.

I'm actually more disappointed with the Hamilton/Hanifin part of the deal, and that was as someone skeptical of Hanifin's ceiling even when he was here. Hamilton just hasn't looked more than average outside maybe a few periods this season, so I'm hoping he gets it together soon.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Ferland is way more talented than advertised, so it makes the Lindholm part of the deal not so bad for me even with Lindholm being younger, better defensively and finally starting to fulfill his potential. Ferland appears to have some untapped offensive potential himself, and he's the type of power forward I've wanted for years and years now.

I'm actually more disappointed with the Hamilton/Hanifin part of the deal, and that was as someone skeptical of Hanifin's ceiling even when he was here. Hamilton just hasn't looked more than average outside maybe a few periods this season, so I'm hoping he gets it together soon.

The guys on the Flames board said he starts slowly but he'll start heating up. Good news is that we are doing OK with Hamilton not scoring yet.

I watched a couple Flames games. I thought Hanifin looked pretty decent the first game. Last night though, I thought he looked brutal. Skated it up the middle by his own net and had his pocket picked resulting in a grade-a chance, another turn-over down low leading to another great chance, poor coverage in his own zone, etc. Everybody has bad games AND the Flames as a team didn't show up at all, so not going to judge him on 1 game, but it was a lot of the same things we've seen here.

 

[RodTheBawd]

My 1 viewing of Hanifin and Lindholm this year I thought they both looked solid. I've always been a Lindy fan, so I'm glad to see him (hopefully) breaking out. Last year I started buying into the Hanifin lack of IQ narrative, still might be what holds him back from ever getting to that ceiling.

 

[HisIceness]

I'm impressed with Ferland thus far. Dude can ball, err, puck. He's a ball of energy that isn't afraid of kicking some ass, which is good because watching this team get bullied for years was not fun, at some point you have to punch the bully back and Ferland provides that fearlessness.

Hamilton is like a roller coaster. For every bad play he's helped keep the score what it is at that moment at times. He made a couple of nice plays in the Detroit game when the Wings were attacking. I am hoping once he breaks through on a goal the floodgates will open and his overall play will improve.

 

[Negan4Coach]

I'm impressed with Ferland thus far. Dude can ball, err, puck. He's a ball of energy that isn't afraid of kicking some ass, which is good because watching this team get bullied for years was not fun, at some point you have to punch the bully back and Ferland provides that fearlessness.

Hamilton is like a roller coaster. For every bad play he's helped keep the score what it is at that moment at times. He made a couple of nice plays in the Detroit game when the Wings were attacking. I am hoping once he breaks through on a goal the floodgates will open and his overall play will improve.

Agree. Wasn't Martinook also supposed to provide some of that toughness as well? Have to say I haven't seen much from him regarding that.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Agree. Wasn't Martinook also supposed to provide some of that toughness as well? Have to say I haven't seen much from him regarding that.

not sure how much of it was "toughness" vs. "tough to play against". Martinook hasn't shown the physicality of Ferland, but I've been pleasantly surprised by his speed, forecheck and puck pursuit. He's been playing kind of like Foegele (light) where he has been a bit of a pain in the ass to the other teams.

 

[Unsustainable]

not sure how much of it was "toughness" vs. "tough to play against". Martinook hasn't shown the physicality of Ferland, but I've been pleasantly surprised by his speed, forecheck and puck pursuit. He's been playing kind of like Foegele (light) where he has been a bit of a pain in the ass to the other teams.

Foegele is just a horse on the puck

 

[The Faulker 27]

Agree. Wasn't Martinook also supposed to provide some of that toughness as well? Have to say I haven't seen much from him regarding that.

Martinook does his fair share of checking. Currently tied with Ferland for 2nd on the team in hits with less ATOI.

 

[MinJaBen]

not sure how much of it was "toughness" vs. "tough to play against". Martinook hasn't shown the physicality of Ferland, but I've been pleasantly surprised by his speed, forecheck and puck pursuit. He's been playing kind of like Foegele (light) where he has been a bit of a pain in the ass to the other teams.

He’s been great for what he is. I had thought he was just “the guy coming back” for us to shed salary with Kruger, but he has been worth trading for on his own merits.

 

[Canes]

I like Martinook's game a lot. He's certainly better than I thought he would be. I figured he would battle it out for the 12th/13th forward spot but he's been better than that. Him and Ferland play good ol' Manitoban prairie hockey.

 

[emptyNedder]

I think Martinook has been more surprising than Ferland. Everyone knew that Ferland could score given 21 goals last season. Being honest, Ferland's start is partly the fact that Aho has turned into the 1C that everyone wanted. I believe in 2-3 years Aho will be a couple million cheaper and as good a center as Tavares. In fact, Ferland didn't even score on the best play of the season: Aho's pass to Ferland in stride after no-looking away the defender in the Red Wings game. That was pretty amazing.
Martinook has been solid and created several scoring opportunities in most games. The expectation, at least on my part, was that he would be solid defensively with maybe a tiny bit more offense that Kruger/Nordstrom.