The Management Thread - Time is a Flat Circle

[Bob Long]

Benning re-working the system:

“No Ron, we want to draft good players now!”

there were a lot of people doing a poor job, don't you remember all the fluff over the firings Jim made in the scouting staff early on?

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

there were a lot of people doing a poor job, don't you remember all the fluff over the firings Jim made in the scouting staff early on?

Didn't Benning hire his son (or a relative) who had pretty much no experience or credentials for the role?
And didn't Gillis revamp the scouting department right before the 2013 draft?

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Didn't Benning hire his son (or a relative) who had pretty much no experience or credentials for the role?
And didn't Gillis revamp the scouting department right before the 2013 draft?

First part

I have no memory

 

[Hansen]

Apparently Ron worked pretty closely with Jim's dad. So that pretty much seals it

 

[MS]

why the dislike for Delorme?

Because Ron Delorme - while he seems to be a nice guy - is completely, utterly incompetent?

good thing Benning was hired to re-tool the scouting system then wasn't it?

Delorme was marginalized under Gillis when Crawford was promoted. Benning has brought him back to have a larger voice.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Apparently Ron worked pretty closely with Jim's dad. So that pretty much seals it

Benning sure loves nepotism.

 

[Fatass]

This is disappointing and shows how highly Value Brackett was around the league. He was jobless for 9 freaking days.

Heard on the radio Minnesota and Seattle contacted Judd as soon as his contract with us ended. I’m thinking he’s been negotiating during these eight days. If Benning would have let Judd talk with other teams earlier, I think he’s signed July 1.
Huge get for the Wild.
Will we see Rathbone sign in Minnesota next year now?

 

[carrotshirt]

The Old Boys Club rides again!

 

[timw33]

Mike Gillis' biggest mistake may well have been not immediately canning a well-liked, but absolutely archaic and ineffective head scout in Ron Delorme and beginning a scouting overhaul sooner.

Ron Delorme's WHL region has produced exactly ONE NHL player (Grabner) in the last TWENTY Years.

On a semi-related note, the QMJHL region has produced zero NHLers in the last Twenty years as well, but I have to note that this factors in Luc Bourdon's tragic death, so we'll call it 1 meaningful player drafted in twenty years from this region. We haven't drafted from this region for 4 years for pretty good reason.

 

[Wall of Wonder]

Sigh. Big downgrade if they go back to Delorme.

 

[Ryp37]

The Delorme/Weisbrod/Benning show now.

What a zoo.

Delorme will be head scout in name only. Weisbrod being the snake oils salesmen that he is will be running that show for sure.

We're pooched.

Also is it normal to let the guy who built your draft board be hired by another team before the draft has taken place?

 

[VanJack]

In recent seasons the Canucks have completely overhauled their entire scouting staff....so many dizzying changes, it's hard to keep up.

Yet through all the change and turmoil, Ron Delorme endures. There has to be some reason. Maybe he's been more effective than we know. But then again, maybe not.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

The Delorme/Weisbrod/Benning show now.

What a zoo.

Delorme will be head scout in name only. Weisbrod being the snake oils salesmen that he is will be running that show for sure.

We're pooched.

Also is it normal to let the guy who built your draft board be hired by another team before the draft has taken place?

Pretty much. Weisbrod is an incompetent moron who should never be able to run a draft. I would easily take an algorithm that averaged all major draft rankings and then chose a player that no one has even watched, over Weisbrod. Hell, I'd take most of the posters' opinions on this message board over Weisbrod. He's that bad.

As for the bolded, this occurred to me as well. It does seem problematic, but my guess is that Brackett had so little input on our draft board (reports of the issues between management and Brackett date back to January), so I don't think he had much influence on our draft rankings. The same thing happened with Benning when he came from Boston to Vancouver right before the 2014 draft and there weren't any issues.

 

[Hansen]

As an indigenous person, it makes me so happy to see a Cree-Metis guy in Delorme have such a rich career in the sport. I don't know him personally, but having his voice and perspective in the room has to be a good influence and he seems to be very well respected and liked, even having inspired a generation of indigenous hockey players and he does lots of community work. Unfortunately, he just hasn't provided results as a head scout and our regional scouting hasn't been strong. Doesn't mean he should be ran out of town, but when we're having some organizational upheaval in amateur scouting, it's time to get fresh perspectives.

What really scares me is that he would now be the defacto pazzi for Weisbrod and take the fall when Weisbrod inevitably f***s everything up

 

[rypper]

Didn't Benning hire his son (or a relative) who had pretty much no experience or credentials for the role?
And didn't Gillis revamp the scouting department right before the 2013 draft?

I don't know what you're talking about Brandon Benning has a long and fruitful history of scouting the Nordstrom's region for prospects.

 

[Bob Long]

Didn't Benning hire his son (or a relative) who had pretty much no experience or credentials for the role?
And didn't Gillis revamp the scouting department right before the 2013 draft?

So who was more successful at drafting, Gillis or Benning?

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

So who was more successful at drafting, Gillis or Benning?

Red herring, my post was about the timeline of scouting changes. I'm not saying Benning didn't make changes, but I recall Gillis also made big changes in 2013 and was responsible for bringing in Brackett.

 

[Bob Long]

Benning sure loves nepotism.

omg people hire who they know sometimes, name one NHL team that hasn't ever done that. You make it sound like the team is staffed by Jims family alone.

 

[Bob Long]

Red herring, my post was about the timeline of scouting changes. I'm not saying Benning didn't make changes, but I recall Gillis also made big changes in 2013 and was responsible for bringing in Brackett.

red herring? we're talking about drafting records here are we not?

Benning deserves most of the credit for re-tooling the scouting system, if you're not even going to give him that credit I'd suggest you've got blinders on.

 

[carrotshirt]

omg people hire who they know sometimes, name one NHL team that hasn't ever done that. You make it sound like the team is staffed by Jims family alone.

You consider it a good thing that Jim hired his son out of a Nordstroms to join the scouting team?

 

[MS]

So who was more successful at drafting, Gillis or Benning?

In the perfectly overlapping period when Benning was running the scouting department in Boston and Gillis was GM here ... the answer is Gillis.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

red herring? we're talking about drafting records here are we not?

Benning deserves most of the credit for re-tooling the scouting system, if you're not even going to give him that credit I'd suggest you've got blinders on.

Re-read my post, it was about the changes made to the scouting department. So yes, talking about quality of draft picks is completely unrelated to the point I made.

Prove to me why Benning deserves most of the credit for retooling the scouting department. Show me the moves he made and how they improved the scouting department, and do the same for Gillis, and then you'll actually have a persuasive argument. And I did give Benning credit - I just posted saying that I acknowledge that he made changes (promoting Brackett was huge, but he kind of reversed that progress).

 

[Bob Long]

You consider it a good thing that Jim hired his son out of a Nordstroms to join the scouting team?

he's clearly giving his kid a chance to learn, suggesting its anything other than that is laughable.

 

[MS]

red herring? we're talking about drafting records here are we not?

Benning deserves most of the credit for re-tooling the scouting system, if you're not even going to give him that credit I'd suggest you've got blinders on.

The team accidentally sucking their way to high picks deserves most of the credit for our 'improved drafting'.

 

[Bob Long]

Re-read my post, it was about the changes made to the scouting department. So yes, talking about quality of draft picks is completely unrelated to the point I made.

Prove to me why Benning deserves most of the credit for retooling the scouting department. Show me the moves he made and how they improved the scouting department, and do the same for Gillis, and then you'll actually have a persuasive argument. And I did give Benning credit - I just posted saying that I acknowledge that he made changes (promoting Brackett was huge, but he kind of reversed that progress).

proof? OK who was the GM when the changes were made? Gillis was a drafting disaster. Benning has a solid history. Suggesting thats not the case is the red herring here.