The legacy of Henrik Lundqvist

[Pens x]

Overrated

 

[Irishguy42]

What? Lundqvist never really *****es or complains about calls. He also doesn't dive or flop.

As a matter of fact I think that works against him sometimes.

He definitely sells a lot to get GI calls. More than goalies normally do.

And he does get vocal with the refs more than usual.

But that shouldn't detract from the fact that he most definitely is the best of the generation and will be in the HHoF.

 

[IamNotADancer]

This thread is very revealing as far as who you can take serious on this board and who is just is salty, biased homer who would be better suited on a Facebook fan page.

This is the equivalent of this guy at the mall who tried to sell me a McDavid signed photograph trying to tell me "McDavid will be drafted by the Penguins 100%!!".

There is a lot of faux knowledge floating around with some people. If you objectively can't see how good a player is/has been throughout his career and let your fan allegiance get in the way of your reason then you simply aren't a hockey fan who appreciates hockey.

You are just one of those tribal guys who wants to belong to a group. "My tribe good, their tribe bad!UCK!!"

 

[LordNeverLose]

Meh. Didn't think it was nearly as good as the Identity, Supremacy, or Ultimatum of Henrik Lundqvist

 

[Leafs87]

I have him behind Luongo as the best of this generation but both were truly elite and amazing goalies. Both had SCF apperences and the one thing I will give Hank credit for is that he did help his team a lot more and had less to work with but in the end Luongos body of work overall to me was more impressive

 

[Tuna Tatarrrrrr]

He was the best/most consistent post-lockout goalie but he is also overrated by some and underrated by others.

 

[Fataldogg]

Would have been considered a generational talent on teams like LA, Pittsburgh, Washington, Chicago, Nashville, etc.

Instead, he is a 20-25 goaltender all time. His Vezina voting, on Ranger teams that never had real elite talent, either offensively or defensively, is incredible.

People said he was average last season with a .915SV%. That was on a team that was 2nd in the NHL in High Danger Chances Against. The year before he was "terrible" with a .910SV%. Lowest of his career.

Price has had three seasons as a starter at a .905SV% or lower. Rinne has had multiple seasons below .910SV% on far better teams.

He was the best goaltender post lockout who never had a truly high level team in front of him.

The best talent of his era, unfortunately with just one major individual award to show, of which is mostly team related [look at some of the posts from other posters... their list of defense men post lockout in laughable].

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Meh. He's had to put up with garbage blueliners in front of him for most of his career. Dan Girardi was a 25 minute per night moving screen in front of him for most of his career.

Revisionist history. As recently as the 2014 finals there were threads here declaring the Rangers d-core better than the Kings 1-6, including gems like McDonagh > Doughty and Girardi > Mitchell and so on. They have certainly worn down, but let's stop pretending he's been on crap teams his entire career and he's enjoyed success in spite of them.

Would have been considered a generational talent on teams like LA, Pittsburgh, Washington, Chicago, Nashville, etc.

Instead, he is a 20-25 goaltender all time. His Vezina voting, on Ranger teams that never had real elite talent, either offensively or defensively, is incredible.

People said he was average last season with a .915SV%. That was on a team that was 2nd in the NHL in High Danger Chances Against. The year before he was "terrible" with a .910SV%. Lowest of his career.

Price has had three seasons as a starter at a .905SV% or lower. Rinne has had multiple seasons below .910SV% on far better teams.

He was the best goaltender post lockout who never had a truly high level team in front of him.

The best talent of his era, unfortunately with just one major individual award to show, of which is mostly team related [look at some of the posts from other posters... their list of defense men post lockout in laughable].

Too bad our terrible goaltender just raw outplayed him head to head then I guess.

Lundqvist is phenomenal but he gets overly romanticized. Generational? Come on. He's a mental midget in the clutch and visibly throws his teammates under the bus constantly. He constantly looks like he's going "guyyyyssss comeeoooonnnn." I'm very glad we got to put him in the faceplant pose for Alec Martinez' glory shot for that attitude alone. Only goalie I like to see fail more is Mike Smith.


All that venom aside, fully agree that he's the most consistent goaltender of the era and should eventually make the hall. Not looking past Luongo who has similar feats,but Lundqvist has been a constant on an ever-changing Rangers franchise, good teams and bad. Other guys have come and gone and had peaks and valleys, but what makes Hank one of the best is that for seemingly forever he's always been in or near the top-3 to 5 goalies every year. That's a hell of a legacy in a league with such parity at the position--guys can have volatile big years and separate themselves temporarily and maybe he's personally really only done that once or twice, but he also hasn't fallen down out of the top tier pretty much ever (obviously father time is catching up now). That sort of duration and consistency is a great feat at such a challenging position, especially in the bright lights of MSG. Those Rangers teams had great expectations and he was clearly a leader.

 

[blinkman360]

Joel was better, TBH.

...but yeah, he's a HOFer. Don't think there's any doubt about that.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Best goalie of his generation. Unfortunately for him, his generation is the cap era where spending top dollar on a goalie hurts your team. Not his fault his team went all in on the worst playoff performer in the league and tried to run Stepan/Brassard down the middle.

 

[Allan92]

Revisionist history. As recently as the 2014 finals there were threads here declaring the Rangers d-core better than the Kings 1-6, including gems like McDonagh > Doughty and Girardi > Mitchell and so on. They have certainly worn down, but let's stop pretending he's been on crap teams his entire career and he's enjoyed success in spite of them.




Too bad our terrible goaltender just raw outplayed him head to head then I guess.

Lundqvist is phenomenal but he gets overly romanticized. Generational? Come on. He's a mental midget in the clutch and visibly throws his teammates under the bus constantly. He constantly looks like he's going "guyyyyssss comeeoooonnnn." I'm very glad we got to put him in the faceplant pose for Alec Martinez' glory shot for that attitude alone. Only goalie I like to see fail more is Mike Smith.


All that venom aside, fully agree that he's the most consistent goaltender of the era and should eventually make the hall. Not looking past Luongo who has similar feats,but Lundqvist has been a constant on an ever-changing Rangers franchise, good teams and bad. Other guys have come and gone and had peaks and valleys, but what makes Hank one of the best is that for seemingly forever he's always been in or near the top-3 to 5 goalies every year. That's a hell of a legacy in a league with such parity at the position--guys can have volatile big years and separate themselves temporarily and maybe he's personally really only done that once or twice, but he also hasn't fallen down out of the top tier pretty much ever (obviously father time is catching up now). That sort of duration and consistency is a great feat at such a challenging position, especially in the bright lights of MSG. Those Rangers teams had great expectations and he was clearly a leader.

At the risk of sounding biased based on my avatar, I don't think hf threads should be used to measure how good a team was in actuality. For instance today I saw a thread detailing how Toronto will score ten goals multiple times this year. Or remember when Jimmy Hayes was a possible first overall ahead of Stamkos? That thread happened too. Doesn't make Hayes any closer to Stamkos. Nor do those threads you mentioned make Girardi any less of an average defenseman at the time

Girardi, Staal, Moore, guys who were on Hank's best teams were what they were: good soldiers who at one point were decent options for a top 4 and declined rapidly and should never have been a teams best options at defense. To say hank is a mental midget after carrying that group, not entirely but he definitely did the heavy lifting in almost every series win, to multiple conference finals and game 7 victories is laughable.

I guess no one remembers his back to back shutouts to eliminate the caps. Or his epic game six against Montreal. Or his series in 2017 after his worst statistical season ever where he shut down the Canadiens and was a big factor in winning that series in a very hostile bell centre. Or frankly, his entire rangers career of back breaking, brick wall performances. To call him anything but clutch is ludicrous.

To be fair I think generational is overused. Very, very few players actually are.

And I won't bother listing his credentials or stats or achievements as they've already been laid out and frankly you acknowledge alot of what he has accomplished which was reasonable of you.

But I'll end with this. Unless you're a rangers fan or have watched them very regularly since he became the starter, you'll never know just how good he has been and just how responsible he is for our success over the past decade plus. He's phenomenal and arguably no player as been as valuable to his team in the same time span as he has been

 

[Allan92]

Best goalie of his generation. Unfortunately for him, his generation is the cap era where spending top dollar on a goalie hurts your team. Not his fault his team went all in on the worst playoff performer in the league and tried to run Stepan/Brassard down the middle.

To be honest, we could have lived with Stepan-Brassard. Our C depth was very comparable to Nashville in 2017. Lots of depth and variety but no bona fide #1. But more than good enough to get by and those guys came up big plenty of times.

Thing that did us in was our defence, or more accurately, deployment of our defensive players.

But that's a story for another day.

 

[Ocoee]

What? Lundqvist never really *****es or complains about calls. He also doesn't dive or flop.

As a matter of fact I think that works against him sometimes.

Yes he does. Both. World class goalie but bitches and whines like no other goalie.

Edit: except maybe Smith in Calgary. The two of them compete for the being the biggest bitches among goalies

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

At the risk of sounding biased based on my avatar, I don't think hf threads should be used to measure how good a team was in actuality. For instance today I saw a thread detailing how Toronto will score ten goals multiple times this year. Or remember when Jimmy Hayes was a possible first overall ahead of Stamkos? That thread happened too. Doesn't make Hayes any closer to Stamkos. Nor do those threads you mentioned make Girardi any less of an average defenseman at the time

Girardi, Staal, Moore, guys who were on Hank's best teams were what they were: good soldiers who at one point were decent options for a top 4 and declined rapidly and should never have been a teams best options at defense. To say hank is a mental midget after carrying that group, not entirely but he definitely did the heavy lifting in almost every series win, to multiple conference finals and game 7 victories is laughable.

I guess no one remembers his back to back shutouts to eliminate the caps. Ot his epic game six against Montreal. Or his series in 2017 after his worst statical season ever where he shut down the Canadiens and was a big factor in winning that series in a very hostile bell centre. Or frankly, his entire rangers career of back breaking, brick wall performances. To call him anything but clutch is ludicrous.

To be fair I think generational is overused. Very, very few players actually are.

And I won't bother listing his credentials or stats or achievements as they've already been laid out and frankly you acknowledge alot of what he has accomplished which was reasonable of you.

But I'll end with this. Unless you're a rangers fan or have watched them very regularly since he became the starter, you'll never know just how good he has been and just how responsible he is for our success over the past decade plus. He's phenomenal and arguably no player as been as valuable to his team in the the same time span as he has been

Seeing him thoroughly outplay Carey Price who everyone was emphatically stating was the best goalie in the NHL in the 2017 playoffs was awesome.

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

Yes he does. Both. World class goalie but *****es and whines like no other goalie.

Edit: except maybe Smith in Calgary. The two of them compete for the being the biggest *****es among goalies

Except Hank played better when he was pissed, most goalies completely lose their game when they get pissed.

 

[Ocoee]

This thread is very revealing as far as who you can take serious on this board and who is just is salty, biased homer who would be better suited on a Facebook fan page.

This is the equivalent of this guy at the mall who tried to sell me a McDavid signed photograph trying to tell me "McDavid will be drafted by the Penguins 100%!!".

There is a lot of faux knowledge floating around with some people. If you objectively can't see how good a player is/has been throughout his career and let your fan allegiance get in the way of your reason then you simply aren't a hockey fan who appreciates hockey.

You are just one of those tribal guys who wants to belong to a group. "My tribe good, their tribe bad!UCK!!"

What are you talking about? Most people acknowledge lundqvist is a great goalie. You saw one negative post and generalized it to everyone.

 

[JT Kreider]

Revisionist history. As recently as the 2014 finals there were threads here declaring the Rangers d-core better than the Kings 1-6, including gems like McDonagh > Doughty and Girardi > Mitchell and so on. They have certainly worn down, but let's stop pretending he's been on crap teams.

Sure, 2012-14 McDonagh was looking like a perennial Norris contender, but everything was downhill the second he got that C and his play rapidly declined. Not to say he's still not a rock solid #2 (and I'm willing to give him a full year in the Tampa system to get the AV stench off him), but just not the same Mac f***ing truck his reputation the last three seasons is built off.

So that's pretty much a two year window where Lundqvist had anything that resembled a true #1 defensemen in front of him.

 

[Ocoee]

Except Hank played better when he was pissed, most goalies completely lose their game when they get pissed.

He is a great goalie. No one is arguing that.

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

Sure, 2012-14 McDonagh was looking like a perennial Norris contender, but everything was downhill the second he got that C and his play rapidly declined. Not to say he's still not a rock solid #2 (and I'm willing to give him a full year in the Tampa system to get the AV stench on him), but just not the same Mac ****ing truck his reputation the last three seasons is built off.

So that's pretty much a two year window where Lundqvist had anything that resembled a true #1 defensemen in front of him.

Agreed with this, he took the Rangers to at least the conference finals in three of four years from 2012 to 2015, even though none of those Rangers teams were what you would call ''elite'' on paper.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Seeing him thoroughly outplay Carey Price who everyone was emphatically stating was the best goalie in the NHL in the 2017 playoffs was awesome.

Habs had a putrid offence and every game in a 6 game series was decided by one goal except game 6 which had an EN. “Thoroughly outplayed” is exaggerating by a lot.

 

[JT Kreider]

Agreed with this, he took the Rangers to at least the conference finals in three of four years from 2012 to 2015, even though none of those Rangers teams were what you would call ''elite'' on paper.

We had great depth but lacked the true game breaking talents (plural) necessary to succeed come playoff time.

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

Habs had a putrid offence and every game in a 6 game series was decided by one goal except game 6 which had an EN. “Thoroughly outplayed” is exaggerating by a lot.

He gave up a goal by Tanner Glass for god's sake. I don't think Hank would ever let someone like Jordie Benn score on him in a playoff game.

 

[JT Kreider]

Habs had a putrid offence and every game in a 6 game series was decided by one goal except game 6 which had an EN. “Thoroughly outplayed” is exaggerating by a lot.

Because they had their most offensively gifted player neutered on the 4th line with AHL scrubs King and Ott. That was the difference in that series. It's a pretty good reflection of what's wrong with the Habs.

They should have done everything in their power to ensure Galchenyuk developed into their franchise center they desperately needed. Instead they f***ed around with him and zapped him of all his offensive potential.

He showed that there is a elite #1 center in him when he scored 30 goals (before 40 became the new 30) and a near PPG pace before his knee injury.

 

[JKG33]

Who is better?

Don't get me wrong, I don't think he's a bad goalie. He's really been a consistently good goalie, but there haven't been any seasons that made me think this guy is the best since the 90s. He hasn't done anything to impress more than guys like Thomas, Price, Bobrovsky, Holtby and Quick, who have all had higher peaks.

Everyone likes to blame his failures on having a "crappy" Rangers team, but put someone like Luongo (who's been on shit teams save for that span of a couple seasons where Vancouver was relevant) on those teams and he'd have an even more impressive career.

This just in... goalie no one has ever paid to watch play thinks poorly of one of the longest starting goalies at the NHL level. Interesting.

That'd be a good chirp, if only it were true.

 

[nhlfan9191]

He gave up a goal by Tanner Glass for god's sake. I don't think Hank would ever let someone like Jordie Benn score on him in a playoff game.

Amazing point.

Because they had their most offensively gifted player neutered on the 4th line with AHL scrubs King and Ott. That was the difference in that series. It's a pretty good reflection of what's wrong with the Habs.

They should have done everything in their power to ensure Galchenyuk developed into their franchise center they desperately needed. Instead they ****ed around with him and zapped him of all his offensive potential.

The Habs rebuilding right now is the best possible thing that could happen. We couldn’t score in the playoffs against good goalies or teams. It’s been the story of our franchise for awhile.